LightningJoe
Member
Kel-Tec 1911? Tactical shotgun? High(er)-powered rifle? Snub-nose revolver?
What's next from Kel-Tec?
- Thread starter LightningJoe
- Start date
- Status
Evil Monkey
member
- Joined
- Jun 26, 2006
- Messages
- 1,486
You know what's stupid? Kel-tec makes an SU-16 with traditional rifle grip and an SU-16 pistol (I think it's called the PLR?) with a pistol grip.
Why can't they make a rifle with a pistol grip like an ak or ar15!?!? It's obvious that they have the tooling to do it so why aren't they?
That's what I want to see from kel tec.
Why can't they make a rifle with a pistol grip like an ak or ar15!?!? It's obvious that they have the tooling to do it so why aren't they?
That's what I want to see from kel tec.
Mannlicher
Member
I have seen all I ever want to see from KelTec.
It's called "California".
The "next thing" from Kel-Tec has already been released at the last SHOT show.
It's the FP9 pistol. A single-stack DA 9mm that bridges the gap between the double-stack P11, and the diminutive P32 and P3AT.
Presumably it's aimed at the market segment served by the sub compact 9mm's such as Kahr PM9, and that Glock has strangely failed to exploit as of yet.
If you mean "next" as in "radicaly different", I couldn't begin to guess. If it were based on pure marketing appeal alone, I'd probably position something that takes advantage of the interest in the FN PS90 and the FS2000 bull-pups, and exploits the consumer frustration over their pricing and limited availibility.
If it was based on the viability of the CCW market, I'd wager it'll be more refinments of gaps in the pistol line like the recent P3AT and the PF9.
If it were for maximum uniqueness and a product aimed at a niche where there's little competition, I'd say some sort of ultra-compact shotgun that skirts the NFA the way the SUB carbines do.
Just_a_dude_with_a_gun
Member
I would think there are segments that haven't tapped into yet, that would sell
nicely. Take-down rimfire rifles, .45 caliber Polymer pistols, ala- BUL, etc....
nicely. Take-down rimfire rifles, .45 caliber Polymer pistols, ala- BUL, etc....
1 old 0311
member
Something that actually works?
JohnBT
Member
Funny, but off the mark.
I Googled these numbers up. They seem about right from the other sources I've read. I would have guessed 250,000 first generation P-32's, so I wouldn't have been far off. Mine is 12xxx and still works. I guess the 2,500 or so buyers who have had problems post a lot.
"According to their web site, Kel-Tec CNC Industries is one of the top ten manufacturers of handguns in the US, if not the world. During the first 3 years of production (starting in late 1999), Kel-Tec manufactured over 100,000 of these popular small pistols. Total numbers are not published, but 280,000 first generation guns are believed to have been produced as of 2005. Production for the second generation P-32 introduced in late 2005 is unknown."
I Googled these numbers up. They seem about right from the other sources I've read. I would have guessed 250,000 first generation P-32's, so I wouldn't have been far off. Mine is 12xxx and still works. I guess the 2,500 or so buyers who have had problems post a lot.
"According to their web site, Kel-Tec CNC Industries is one of the top ten manufacturers of handguns in the US, if not the world. During the first 3 years of production (starting in late 1999), Kel-Tec manufactured over 100,000 of these popular small pistols. Total numbers are not published, but 280,000 first generation guns are believed to have been produced as of 2005. Production for the second generation P-32 introduced in late 2005 is unknown."
sm
member
Dear Keltec,
Please consider adding .22 long rifle offerings to your product line.
First , please review for your consideration a Remington Nylon 66 that is feed thru the buttstock. This is a very reliable, maintenance free gun. No magazines to keep up with , maintain, and the rifle is not dependent on magazines to work.
Second, a handgun. This would allow persons less expensive practice, and less felt recoil. This is important from the viewpoint of new shooters, especially kids.
These offerings would sell to folks. Keep them in a affordable price point, and folks would buy them for a variety of reasons.
I am a huge believer in shooting .22 long rifle to teach new shooters and advising new shooters to use a .22 long rifle firearm to replicate as close as can to the centerfire they shoot often or Carry Concealed.
These offerings would also find uses from hunting, to plinking, to farm and ranch guns, and in the event of natural disasters.
Repectfully,
Steve
Please consider adding .22 long rifle offerings to your product line.
First , please review for your consideration a Remington Nylon 66 that is feed thru the buttstock. This is a very reliable, maintenance free gun. No magazines to keep up with , maintain, and the rifle is not dependent on magazines to work.
Second, a handgun. This would allow persons less expensive practice, and less felt recoil. This is important from the viewpoint of new shooters, especially kids.
These offerings would sell to folks. Keep them in a affordable price point, and folks would buy them for a variety of reasons.
I am a huge believer in shooting .22 long rifle to teach new shooters and advising new shooters to use a .22 long rifle firearm to replicate as close as can to the centerfire they shoot often or Carry Concealed.
These offerings would also find uses from hunting, to plinking, to farm and ranch guns, and in the event of natural disasters.
Repectfully,
Steve
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
This may be due to the GCA '68 import points calculus. Glock would have to build them in the USA since a gun that small probably couldn't rack up enough import points, I'd expect (same reason the .380 Glocks aren't importable into the U.S.). The G26 and G27 barely make it in as it is.
carterbeauford
member
Someone with more time than myself can defend Kel-Tec against the cheap shots.
I'd carry an uber-small single stack .40 S&W if they could fit 6+1 rounds in it.
I'd carry an uber-small single stack .40 S&W if they could fit 6+1 rounds in it.
I had thought of that, however the G26 and G27 already have additional features for getting import "points" due to their small size. It's why the sub-compacts have those tiny shallow thumb-rests on the sides of the grip-frame. IIRC, Glock also installs inexpensive plastic adjustable sights that are removed stateside for the fixed ones for more '68 GCA import points on some models...
They're both "Target and sporting features", and makes th G26 & 27 importable.
Here's the point system under the GCA as I understand it to be, and a pistol must have 75 points to be importable, Glock loses the biggest on the metal alloy frame requirments which were all designed to stop inexpensive European "Saturday Night Specials".
Characteristic Points
Length: for each 1/4" over 6" 1
Forged steel frame 15
Forged HTS alloy frame 20
Unloaded weight w/mag (per oz.) 1
.22 short and .25 auto 0
.22 LR and 7.65mm to .380 auto 3
9mm parabellum and over 10
Locked breech mechanism 5
Loaded chamber indicator 5
Grip safety 3
Magazine safety 5
Firing pin block or lock 10
External hammer 2
Double action 10
Drift adjustable target sight 5
Click adjustable target sight 10
Target grips 5
Target trigger 2
Worst case senario, they manufacture just enough stateside to be legal under US import regs. Plenty of smaller mfg's with less cash or market presences as Glock manage to do it, and they already have the Smyrna GA facility to work with.
The main place a single-stack Glock compact would lose points as compared to the G26 & 27 would be on the weight. It would probably gain a few points as the grip might be a bit longer to accomodate an extra round or two in single-stack format. Since most of the carry market's gripe with the 26 & 27 is the width, making it a bit heavier wouldn't be a huge drawback. Or, they could "Pull a Tarus" and just like Tarus ships all their small revolvers with long barrels, then ships them right back to Brazil, Glock could use heavy metal magazines, and just switch them with polymer ones stateside.
Personaly, I think Glock hasn't come out with single-stack sub compacts in anything other than .45 and .45 GAP because they're doing well enough and just don't care.
And to some above posters, I too would love to see what KT's take on the .22 LR in both a pistol and a rifle would be. I think something that folded down to the size of the M6 Scout, but was a magazine fed semi-auto would have lots of appeal. I can't imagine that the M6, the Marlin Papoose, or the AR7 are the pinnacle of the take-down .22 LR.
The new PLR16 pistol that came out last year is an outstanding effort on Kel-Tec's part. I bought one a few months ago and have been nothing but pleased with it. I would say the best .223 pistol available right now, accurate, affordable and nothing but reliable no matter what ammo I have have fed it. Bash them if you want but I found a fun plinker in the PLR16.
rhubarb
Member
First, what Steve said. I was plinking this weekend with a .22 and it's the greatest. Just as any gun safe is incomplete without a .22 LR or three, any gun manufacturer is incomplete without them in the product line.
Then, a 9 the size of the 380 and a 45 the size of the PF9. I like their pocket guns and would likely come back to KelTec for a tiny 9.
Then, a 9 the size of the 380 and a 45 the size of the PF9. I like their pocket guns and would likely come back to KelTec for a tiny 9.
redloki
Member
I would have to side with roscoe here. An SU-14 would be the ticket. I would love to see a them build a rifle in .308.
Byron Quick
Moderator In Memoriam
SWAT magazine published my review of the KelTec P3AT in the April, 2004 issue. I purchased that pistol from my regular dealer. KelTec had no clue it would be reviewed in a gun magazine. I shot several hundred rounds through it for the article. Several different types of ammunition. No malfunctions of any kinds. I carry it in a pocket holster as my BUG daily. Every now and then I take it out and blow the pocket lint out of the mechanism. Every now and then, I pull it out at the range and fire the pistol empty. Without blowing the pocket lint out first.
I've more than a thousand rounds through it now. The next malfunction will be the first malfunction. No 'fluffing.' No 'buffing.' Bone stock.
I also have a P32. It has had a few malfs in the time I've owned it. Nowhere near as many as my NAA Guardian, though. I'll carry the P32. I won't carry the Guardian.
1 old 0311
member
Hi Byron,
Looks like you are luckier than these people:
www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=160074&highlight=keltec
Looks like you are luckier than these people:
www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=160074&highlight=keltec
Byron Quick
Moderator In Memoriam
Sure am. I own five 1911's right now. They all have worked since the day I bought them. Box stock.
On the other hand, I have a Glock 20 that's acting hinky. And the NAA Guardian.
I get stuff that others are moaning and groaning about and it runs like a Singer sewing machine. I get the stuff they think is the bee's knees and I have trouble.
On the other hand, I have a Glock 20 that's acting hinky. And the NAA Guardian.
I get stuff that others are moaning and groaning about and it runs like a Singer sewing machine. I get the stuff they think is the bee's knees and I have trouble.
MachIVshooter
Member
These folks make the smallest and lightest .380 in the world and then price it for the working man, and all some people can do is gripe about 2 or 3 jams in the first 100 rounds or so. These same people will go get a $1,200 (or more) 1911 and excuse similar malfunctions as a "break in process". I call BS. Some people just don't like to admit that a $250 pistol works well.
Kel-Tec is very innovative; no other manufacturer offers guns that compare. All of Kel-Tec'c products offer more punch in a smaller and/or lighter package than any competitor. They are also 100% American and strong second amendment supporters. No chicken sh*t loaded chamber indicators or ILS devices. I will finish this rant by stating that their customer service is second to none. When the mag release on my early P3 wore to the point where it would not retain the mag, they had the gun back to me 12 days after I mailed it, and at zero cost, no questions asked. Only other firm this good in my experience is NAA.
BTW, my PLR-16 has run flawlessly from day one. Very fun gun, too.
On to the original question, I would like to see them build:
1: A PF9-style .45 and 10mm in the 18-20 ounce arena
2: A 5 ounce .22 or .25 (the P-32 is 7 oz; they can do it)
3: A .308 cal SU that takes FAL or G3 mags
4: the Sub-2000 in 7.62x25 Tok.
Kel-Tec is very innovative; no other manufacturer offers guns that compare. All of Kel-Tec'c products offer more punch in a smaller and/or lighter package than any competitor. They are also 100% American and strong second amendment supporters. No chicken sh*t loaded chamber indicators or ILS devices. I will finish this rant by stating that their customer service is second to none. When the mag release on my early P3 wore to the point where it would not retain the mag, they had the gun back to me 12 days after I mailed it, and at zero cost, no questions asked. Only other firm this good in my experience is NAA.
BTW, my PLR-16 has run flawlessly from day one. Very fun gun, too.
On to the original question, I would like to see them build:
1: A PF9-style .45 and 10mm in the 18-20 ounce arena
2: A 5 ounce .22 or .25 (the P-32 is 7 oz; they can do it)
3: A .308 cal SU that takes FAL or G3 mags
4: the Sub-2000 in 7.62x25 Tok.
i own everything that they make, except a plr, and all of my guns are 100% reliable. i can't wait to buy a pf9. i now own or have owned every major type of firearm and have a safe full of great guns. as a working pi, who spends a lot of time in VERY secluded areas doing surveillance, sometimes on Very unpleasant people, i find that the gun i carry most is my p3at. with my su-16, or sub 40 in th trunk.
mpi
mpi
yhtomit
Member
re: sm's .22LR suggestion
sm wrote: "Please consider adding .22 long rifle offerings to your product line. ...
These offerings would sell to folks. Keep them in a affordable price point, and folks would buy them for a variety of reasons."
I think there's a good marketing opportunity being lost by KT, too -- If they made a .22LR version of their pistols and their folding long-guns (even if it was at the same price) and they were found to be as reliable as I get the impression KT's products typically* are, people who buy and like the .22 version would likely upsize later, and use a grip / mechanism / heft they're used to from the .22. Even better if the .22s were priced a bit less, as a bit of a come-on.
I especially like the idea of a buttstock-feeding .22 rifle!
timothy
* I've handled a few KTs, don't recall shooting one, ever, so I'm basing my idea of typical on a calculus of complaint; it seems that there are some bad-apple KT guns out there, and yet I notice more KT owners praising their guns and scoffing at those complaints ...
sm wrote: "Please consider adding .22 long rifle offerings to your product line. ...
These offerings would sell to folks. Keep them in a affordable price point, and folks would buy them for a variety of reasons."
I think there's a good marketing opportunity being lost by KT, too -- If they made a .22LR version of their pistols and their folding long-guns (even if it was at the same price) and they were found to be as reliable as I get the impression KT's products typically* are, people who buy and like the .22 version would likely upsize later, and use a grip / mechanism / heft they're used to from the .22. Even better if the .22s were priced a bit less, as a bit of a come-on.
I especially like the idea of a buttstock-feeding .22 rifle!
timothy
* I've handled a few KTs, don't recall shooting one, ever, so I'm basing my idea of typical on a calculus of complaint; it seems that there are some bad-apple KT guns out there, and yet I notice more KT owners praising their guns and scoffing at those complaints ...
Last edited:
No_Brakes23
Member
My SU-16CA works fine.
I wonder how many of the folks crying about Kel-Tec's supposedly low quality are Glock fans?
As for what I would like to see from KT?
A pistol grip for the SU-16 would be nice, but how would it fold up?
A metal reciever SU-14 would be hella sweet.
A SUB2000 that takes 1911 mags would be nice since Marlin doesn't make the camp carbine any more
A bolt that comes out from the rear so I can actually get a cleaning rod in from the breech would be nice as well.
A 22LR rifle or pistol wouldn't break my heart either.
I wonder how many of the folks crying about Kel-Tec's supposedly low quality are Glock fans?
As for what I would like to see from KT?
A pistol grip for the SU-16 would be nice, but how would it fold up?
A metal reciever SU-14 would be hella sweet.
A SUB2000 that takes 1911 mags would be nice since Marlin doesn't make the camp carbine any more
A bolt that comes out from the rear so I can actually get a cleaning rod in from the breech would be nice as well.
A 22LR rifle or pistol wouldn't break my heart either.
- Status
