what's the best powder & bullets for .45's

[silent one]

Hi all,
Finally going to start hand loading. What is the best and cleanest burning powder available for .45 acp? Also would like to know what bullets are best for .45's. Should I use round nose, flat point, or jacketed bullets?
Thanks for any help you can give me on this subject. Being a newbie, I can use all the help I can get.
Good luck, and be safe.


SILENT ONE

 

[Bacchus]

I think that you will get lots of responses here. If you normally shoot hardball, then I'd go with FMJ bullets. Winchester or Remington are a little under $10 for 100 bullets. They also manufacture lots of hollow points--some in 230 gr and others in 185.

 

[Valkman]

You're probably going to get 20 recommendations on powder and another 20 for bullets, so it may not help. When I started a few months ago I asked a gun shop owner who reloads what to get for powder and he said Winchester 231, which I've used ever since. You can pretty much pick a bullet - seems most here use a 200gr SWC or a 230gr RN. Then you have to pick lead, copper clad, FMJ, moly coated, etc. I'd start with lead 230gr RN or Berry's 230gr RN from Cabela's.

Good luck!

 

[HankB]

You're going to get a LOT of different opinions on this.

As a point of reference, the military 230 grain hardball round was loaded with Bullseye powder - around 4.6 grains or so, IIRC. Hundreds of millions, maybe billions, of rounds were loaded. The military probably used a non-cannister version of the powder, so check this in a good reloading manual yourself before you try it, work up to it, etc.

The "traditional" ultra-light target load called for a 200 grain lead semiwadcutter on top of 3.5 grains of bullseye. Rated at about 725 ft/sec, it actually clocks about 630 out of my Colt National Match. It may be too light for reliable function in some guns, in which case increasing the powder charge to 4.2 grains still gives a nice target load.

I've been using 700-X lately with a 230 grain cast lead bullet. (I used to shoot a lot of shotgun, and loaded target loads with 700-X powder. When you buy 12 lb kegs, price is cheap.) A charge of 4.8 grains gives me "hardball duplication" ballistics.

With a 185 grain JHP, I've seen loads with up to 8.5 grains of Unique recommended, for well over 1000 ft/sec. (This is a really hot load for an unaltered 1911, and not all sources go up this high today.) Plus, Unique is not particularly clean. I'd look at using SR4756 or Power Pistol instead if I wanted a hot load - whatever the manuals recommend.

 

[Cortland]

I say shoot lead. It's cheaper; you'll shoot more. 230 gr. LRN is a popular bullet, so you might as well start with that. I've used Bullseye, Titegroup, Unique, 231, etc. with these. You're never going to get a consensus on which is best, so my advice is just pick a powder and try it. 4.0 gr. of Bullseye with a 230 gr. LRN is a classic load that I like-- you could try that.

The bottom line is that you'll eventually end up trying lots of bullets with lots of types of powders -- which ones you happen to try first probably won't matter much

Just make sure you get a good load manual and use only published, verified data.

 

[silent one]

Bacchus, Valkman, HankB, and Cortland,
Thanks for the help. I can see where this could really stir the pot. Well I asked for help, and you are certainly giving me a wide selection to go on. All opinions are appreciated. Thanks to all of you.
Good luck, and be safe.


SILENT ONE

 

[Waitone]

Start simple and cheap.

--230 grain LRN lead is cheap and is what the 1911 was designed to use.

--Garden variety powder like W231 is cheap and readily available.

--Get a couple of reloading manuals. Make your first loads well within safe limits as determined by at least two manuals.

Reason I say simple and cheap is you will be hit with a blizzard of details all at the same same time--powder weight, primer seating, OAL, will my hand blow off when I shoot my first reloads, how can I know I didn't screw up, will the slide come off and stick in my face, do I need to strap this puppy to a tree and touch it off from the next zip code, ad nauseum.

Simple and cheap is the way to go. There is plenty of time to get complicated and expensive.

Keep us posted.

 

[Zak Smith]

For games (IPSC, 3Gun), I use a 200gr West Coast plated round-nose bullet with 5.1gr Titegroup at 1.260" nominal. Just makes 165PF.

For anything "more serious", I just buy Proload.

-z

 

[swager]

cleaning

If you shoot cast, and are tired of scrubbing out the lead, I have a bullet for you. What ever weight in .452 you want and will clean your barrel as it shoots. I'm not kidding. I swage them. I shoot a couple per mag out of my subgun and keep the barrel clean, although one will clean a fouled barrel. The brush is no longer needed at my house. I would post a pic, but they are way to large here. I'm not a puter whiz,lol. bottom pic

 

[Cortland]

With regards to lead fouling, they say that leading towards the chamber indicates too hard an alloy (the bullet doesn't get a good seal and gas blows by, melting the lead), whereas leading towards the muzzle indicates too soft an alloy (bullet smears on the rifling).

I have found this to be generally true. In my 9mms, I rarely get any fouling with hardcast bullets even with hot loads, and when I do it's near the muzzle. However, I do get quite a bit of lead fouling just past the chamber in my 45s with hard cast bullets. Swaged 45s are harder to find, and often slightly more expensive, but the softer swaged bullets don't lead as bad in my 45s.

Nevertheless, I still shoot cast. All you need to clean the lead fouling is a worn out 38 caliber bronze brush, and an all-copper pot scrubber. Cut a patch of the pot scrubber, wrap it around the bronze brush, apply a little oil, and in 5 to 10 passes the lead is completely gone.

 

[bigjim]

Waitone said: --230 grain LRN lead is cheap and is what the 1911 was designed to use.

I don't think so. It was designed around a 200 gr rn. Military later spec'd a 230 grain.

Right fellas?

 

[Bob C]

The Berry or West Coast plated bullets are a little more expensive than lead, but not much. Cleaning afterwards is easier with these, and if you're shooting indoors they don't smoke.

I've had excellent results with their 230 RN.

The cleanest powder with which I've consistently gotten good accuracy is Universal Clays.

 

[Paul "Fitz" Jones]

Commercial Reloader

As a commercial reloader I had to figure the best materials for the price. The best powders were WW231 and 700X. Bullets cast from wheel weights/linotype alloy. Best Brass GI 45 and in other calibers, Starline, Federal and Winchester.
Primers Federal and Winchester. I avoided CCI as they caused all the injuries I investigated that caused injuries in hand operated progressive reloaders.

JohnPaul

 

[silent one]

Waitone, Zak Smith, swager,Cortland, bigjim, Bob C, and Paul "Fitz" Jones,
Ditto my last reply. You all are a diverse group. I'm getting a wealth of info here, and it's greatly appreciated. "thanks"
good luck, and be safe.


SILENT ONE

 

[Sunray]

It depends on what you're using it for and how much money you want to spend on bullets. Jacketed of any kind will cost you lots more than cast. That's why I only use cast. I prefer a cast 230 grain flat point and 4.5 grains of Bullseye powder with a taper crimp. I developed the load for pins and found it works well in my .45 for punching paper too. You will have to develope a load for your pistol though. No two guns will shoot the same load the same way.

 

[Brasso]

Not a good idea to try and clean the bore with a jacketed bullet after shooting lead. It may get some of the lead out, but it also plates whatever lead is left in the bore really tight and smooth. It appears to be clean, but isn't. The best way I have found to clean lead fouling is to go to Wally World and get a 100% pure copper pot scrubber from the kitchen supply aisle. Cut off a piece and wrap it around a standard bore brush and go to work. It works really fast and does not take any more time than cleaning a normal barrel.

 

[Ala Dan]

Based On Over 30 Years Experience

Greeting's Silent One Sir-

Now, for my take on handloading for the .45 ACP. For
bullet choice, I chose the Magnus 200 grain hard cast
bevel base L-SWC; over top of 5.0 grains of Hodgdon
Universal Clay's, with Federal large pistol primers. I
believe that if this load were put on a chrony; it most
likely would be in the neighborhood of about 730 fps?
My COL is set at 1.240" for use in my SIG P220. It will
eat this load all day long, without even a burp!

Also, I'm one of the few persons who swear by the
Lee Precision factory crimp die for the final stage of
handloading the .45 ACP. And as a final check, I run
each round into a Dillon .45 ACP case length gague
to make certain that the round will chamber. Like I
said on another thread, I like to produce a quality
ammunition product; I don't get caught up in the
numbers game of how much ammo I can produce.

Stay safe, shoot straight, and may all your bullets fall
into the X-ring, my friend!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[silent one]

Hey, hey, hey Dan,
How's it goin my friend?. I appreciate the info. Lord knows I can use all I can get I've heard from others that the Universal Clays is good powder. If you say it's good then I'm goin with it. The Magnus 200 gr hard cast bullet along with the federal primers primers seem like a good option also. I've heard the CCI primers are not so good, and the jacketed bullets are a little on the expensive side, and don't really make a lot of difference in accuracy. I have a lot to learn before I attempt doing any loading. I'm finding out this is something you don't take lightly. I've been reading up on the subject, and there's a lot more to it than meets the eye.

Thanks again for the help. I'll keep you posted on my progress.

good luck, and be safe my friend


SILENT ONE

 

[Khornet]

Not to contradict anybody

but I've used nothing but CCI large pistol primers for 12 yrs now without a hiccup. With light lead target loads, and stout jacketed defense loads. Fitz was talking about progressive loaders and CCI primers; I just use my ol' Rock Chucker, so maybe I'd be singing a different tune if I had a Dillon.

Excellent lead bullets can be had from National Bullet Co., Zero, D&J, many others.

.45 ACP is a great choice to start handgun loading.

 

[wingman]

I use titegroup and 200gr westcoast bullets with great results, also the Lee
factory crimp die.!!

 

[silent one]

Khornet,

Thanks for the reply. Right now, it's a toss up between the Dillon 650, or the RCBS rockchucker supreme. I know the cost between the two is considerable. Many hand loaders suggest getting the progressive from the start, that way you have everything you would ever need right from the start. Others say the single stage is the way to go. I could always get the rock chucker single stage, then purchase the piggy back set up later to convert to progressive.

The most important aspect of this is safety. I want to know exactly what is going on during each stage of the loading process. Another member of THR, my good friend Ala Dan, uses a rock chucker and is very happy with it.
His recommendation has helped me to lean toward the RCBS unit. How does your unit perform for you?.

At any rate, I am going to make a decision soon. I have accumulated 300 lbs of .45 brass that's begging to be loaded.

Thanks again for your input, I appreciate it.

Good luck, and be safe.


SILENT ONE


P.S. Happy [belated] birthday

 

[Zak Smith]

silent one,

If you are loading pistol calibers, you will eventually buy a 650. You will want the ability to smoothly and safely produce large batches of ammunition, and the 650 gives you that. With the casefeeder and powder check, it's fast & safe.

I know that the new reloader wants to understand what's going on at every stage and to inspect every round. This is easier on a single-stage press, but it is not much harder on a progressive press. As long as you take the time to study the machine and the operations, it's pretty self-explanatory.

I actually believe that a well-designed auto-indexing progressive press (with powdercheck stage) is safer than a single-stage press simply because there is less chance for human error. You can still visually inspect the powder charge in each case before the bullet is seated.

I started with a Rock Chucker, added a pair of Square-Deal B's, and finally got a fully decked out 650. I currently load .45ACP, .44RM, and 308 on the 650. I will add .40 and 9x19 soon. The only thing I pull out the 'Chucker for is 8x57JS because I shoot it so little.

-z

 

[Khornet]

Silent,

I am very happy with my Rock Chucker. I think there's alot to be said for learning with a single-stage, though Zak's point is well taken: if you want to pay attention and learn the ins and outs, you ought to be able to use a progressive from the start.

Cost is a big factor for me just now, and though I expect to someday get a progressive, I just can't. And I'm doing fine with my RC, which keeps me in ammo for my .45s, .40s, M1, Springfield, K-Hornet, and AR. Also, I still have small kids (and their friends) at home, and I couldn't leave the thing set up the way you do with a progressive. And I do worry about all those primers all stacked up.

But thousands of loaders use progressives all the time, and I'll be one of them someday. In the meanwhile, I must say I really enjoy the feel of it all: sizing, priming, flaring, seating, crimping. I love to feel the case being sized, and the snug feeling as a bullet seats. I just hasn't become drudgery for me yet after all these years. I enjoy handling those bright new cartridges as I box them up. So I'm some kinda pervert, who cares? I'm happy.

One change I've really been glad I made was to go to carbide pistol dies. Not having to lube means I can clean before sizing and be done with it.

But I guess I am, as my friends say, a "retro-grouch". I tie my own flies, build my own leaders, fish bamboo with silk fly line. My racing bike has only ten speeds, and sew-up cotton tubular tires. And yes, I can sew them up. It's good being a retro-grouch.

 

[silent one]

Wingman, Zak Smith, and Khornet,

Thanks for your input. What to do?. I may just flip a coin, and take it from there. Hey !!!, I have an idea. Maybe if I contacted RCBS and Dillon, and asked them to loan me one of each for about six months to help me decide which one I liked, that would be good customer relations, wouldn't it?. You don't think so huh Well, I guess i'll go to plan B. All I have to do now is figure out what plan B is gonna be.

Thanks again.

good luck, and be safe.


SILENT ONE

 

[BuckeyePPC]

I've just started re-loading RNFP rounds for my .45LC and was wondering if anyone gets lead in their dies ? After a couple hundred rounds I noticed a lead buildup in the seating die. I got it cleaned out but I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrong.