Where would you look for bucks?

[buck460XVR]

Most deer will live and die within a one square mile radius of where they were born. Only thing that drives them from that area is lack of food and pressure from predators......two legged and four. In the case of bucks, the strong instinct to procreate makes them extend their home range during the rut and pre-rut. I have personally witnessed bucks(with obvious characteristic racks) as far as 4 miles between the spots where he was seen. This is why one generally sees so many more bucks during the rut and pre-rut. They are not just cruising for does, they may be establishing new territory because they are being pushed out by other bucks or there is not enough does to go around. Thus one is seeing bucks that are outside of their normal home range. That same drive makes them move during daylight hours, not only making them vulnerable to hunters, but just more visible overall. Once the rut is over(naturally or because of hunting pressure), they return to those home ranges and go nocturnal again. The deer may be there, but just aren't visible. Deer are very pressure sensitive and attuned to what goes on in their surroundings. They also pattern humans and their habits quickly when exposed to them. I have witnessed deer getting up and leaving an area from the sound/sight of a truck pulling into a field access, long before the sound of vehicle doors slamming is heard. Those same deer stayed relaxed in their beds when it was a tractor pulling in.

Regardless of how good the photographs are, it takes feet on the ground to really know what deer habits are in any given area. While escape routes are more readily identified, those escape routes only work when the deer are pressured(as in opening weekend) and they are being pushed. Big bucks in heavily pressured areas don't take the same trails as the rest of the herd, many times taking routes that are harder to get thru and offer more cover. These trail are hard to see in the woods other than in relatively wet areas or when there is snow on the ground. Old snow or areas that are constantly moist are good for finding these trails because they are used so infrequently. The photographs did not tell me where the mast trees were or what kind of mast they are. There were fields that looked as if they may have hay taken off, but could just be marginal pasture. Many times when loggers select cut, they take the best of the mast trees and do not open enough of the woods up for new dense growth or the regrowth of preferred browse. Identifying food preferences while important, sometimes is tough. Especially when we are talking big woods without a Ag field for a draw. Deer have a preference for specific acorns and sometimes for acorns from a specific tree. But if there are acorns everywhere, as in big woods, deer will eat where they are at and least pressured. Thus jump them outta a spot on your way in and outta stand several times and they move to another Oak grove and don't come back unless driven back. Often, they will come back to those areas after hunting season to finish what's left of the acorn crop. When acorns are scarce, knowing where any acorns are can be a hotspot. Knowing what other browse the deer in the area prefer can tell you where they will be when the weather turns cold and they need energy. One area of big woods I hunt is dotted with small swamps and wetlands. On the edges of those there are areas of wintergreen that deer prefer when the snow is deep and the temperatures are cold. The areas are small and widely dispersed, but when the deer are there, all the deer in the area are there, and not bedding far away. Sometimes it's the small things you notice that makes the difference.

 

[wombat13]

Most deer will live and die within a one square mile radius of where they were born. Only thing that drives them from that area is lack of food and pressure from predators......two legged and four. In the case of bucks, the strong instinct to procreate makes them extend their home range during the rut and pre-rut. I have personally witnessed bucks(with obvious characteristic racks) as far as 4 miles between the spots where he was seen. This is why one generally sees so many more bucks during the rut and pre-rut. They are not just cruising for does, they may be establishing new territory because they are being pushed out by other bucks or there is not enough does to go around. Thus one is seeing bucks that are outside of their normal home range. That same drive makes them move during daylight hours, not only making them vulnerable to hunters, but just more visible overall. Once the rut is over(naturally or because of hunting pressure), they return to those home ranges and go nocturnal again. The deer may be there, but just aren't visible. Deer are very pressure sensitive and attuned to what goes on in their surroundings. They also pattern humans and their habits quickly when exposed to them. I have witnessed deer getting up and leaving an area from the sound/sight of a truck pulling into a field access, long before the sound of vehicle doors slamming is heard. Those same deer stayed relaxed in their beds when it was a tractor pulling in.

Regardless of how good the photographs are, it takes feet on the ground to really know what deer habits are in any given area. While escape routes are more readily identified, those escape routes only work when the deer are pressured(as in opening weekend) and they are being pushed. Big bucks in heavily pressured areas don't take the same trails as the rest of the herd, many times taking routes that are harder to get thru and offer more cover. These trail are hard to see in the woods other than in relatively wet areas or when there is snow on the ground. Old snow or areas that are constantly moist are good for finding these trails because they are used so infrequently. The photographs did not tell me where the mast trees were or what kind of mast they are. There were fields that looked as if they may have hay taken off, but could just be marginal pasture. Many times when loggers select cut, they take the best of the mast trees and do not open enough of the woods up for new dense growth or the regrowth of preferred browse. Identifying food preferences while important, sometimes is tough. Especially when we are talking big woods without a Ag field for a draw. Deer have a preference for specific acorns and sometimes for acorns from a specific tree. But if there are acorns everywhere, as in big woods, deer will eat where they are at and least pressured. Thus jump them outta a spot on your way in and outta stand several times and they move to another Oak grove and don't come back unless driven back. Often, they will come back to those areas after hunting season to finish what's left of the acorn crop. When acorns are scarce, knowing where any acorns are can be a hotspot. Knowing what other browse the deer in the area prefer can tell you where they will be when the weather turns cold and they need energy. One area of big woods I hunt is dotted with small swamps and wetlands. On the edges of those there are areas of wintergreen that deer prefer when the snow is deep and the temperatures are cold. The areas are small and widely dispersed, but when the deer are there, all the deer in the area are there, and not bedding far away. Sometimes it's the small things you notice that makes the difference.

You hit a lot of key points in this post. The property was owned by a forestry company that high-graded it a few times then sold it. Current owner is slowly working on timber stand improvement projects, but it is a multi decade process once the forest has been degraded. I’m thinking my best bet is to scout the saddle near the clear cut. The only negative is an oil company is drilling the property to the north of the saddle. They often start at 2:30am and make a heck of a racket that I find annoying even a mile away. Not sure any deer will stick around that area. Only one way to find out.

 

[redneck2]

I kicked up a nice buck about 150 feet from a mobile home that had two barking dogs tied up outside. As long as the deer don’t see the noise as a threat, they don’t care

 

[entropy]

Yup and don't care. I do edit some stuff, but write in a "stream of consciousness" style. Don't like it? Don't read it.
If my style is in poor taste, your complaint or "polite attempt" at informing me, is worse.

Thanks but no thanks.

No big deal, I just didn't know whether you knew that or not.

 

[buck460XVR]

You hit a lot of key points in this post. The property was owned by a forestry company that high-graded it a few times then sold it. Current owner is slowly working on timber stand improvement projects, but it is a multi decade process once the forest has been degraded. I’m thinking my best bet is to scout the saddle near the clear cut. The only negative is an oil company is drilling the property to the north of the saddle. They often start at 2:30am and make a heck of a racket that I find annoying even a mile away. Not sure any deer will stick around that area. Only one way to find out.

20 years or so ago I was hunting pre-rut in an area on public land, where there was generally a scrapeline every year. Was a few days before Halloween when scrape activity is highest around here. Got there early, about two thirty in the afternoon knowing deer would probably be active early. No sooner got into my treestand and was greeted by the sound of multiple chainsaws very close to me. So close I could hear the men talking to each other clear as a bell. I had purposely come in from another direction as to not spook the bedding area close by. My options to move were limited due to the terrain and distances to other viable spots. So I stayed, thinking iffin they got done early, I might see something right before dark. Wasn't there but an hour when the chainsaws stopped, I heard voices and then multiple truck doors slamming and the sound of several vehicles leaving via a newly made logging road. Thinking I had a long wait till I saw something, I relaxed and hung up my bow. I could still hear the last truck hitting the county road a half mile away, when one of the largest bucks I've ever seen in that area appeared, cool, calm and relaxed. He came in so quickly, I barely had time to grab my bow and draw. In my haste and because of the size of the buck, I misjudged the distance and watched my arrow just shave hair off the bottom of his rib-cage. Never saw him again. Talking to the loggers later that week, they said they had been there for about two weeks before that, working everyday from 7-3:30. I assume the deer had patterned the loggers and knew they were not a threat, but were probably knocking down browse. Odds are the deer were bedded fairly close and sound of trucks leaving meant it was safe to come out. I doubt if the drilling and any commotion it creates will impact the deer unless some of the help is hunting the area.

 

[wombat13]

20 years or so ago I was hunting pre-rut in an area on public land, where there was generally a scrapeline every year. Was a few days before Halloween when scrape activity is highest around here. Got there early, about two thirty in the afternoon knowing deer would probably be active early. No sooner got into my treestand and was greeted by the sound of multiple chainsaws very close to me. So close I could hear the men talking to each other clear as a bell. I had purposely come in from another direction as to not spook the bedding area close by. My options to move were limited due to the terrain and distances to other viable spots. So I stayed, thinking iffin they got done early, I might see something right before dark. Wasn't there but an hour when the chainsaws stopped, I heard voices and then multiple truck doors slamming and the sound of several vehicles leaving via a newly made logging road. Thinking I had a long wait till I saw something, I relaxed and hung up my bow. I could still hear the last truck hitting the county road a half mile away, when one of the largest bucks I've ever seen in that area appeared, cool, calm and relaxed. He came in so quickly, I barely had time to grab my bow and draw. In my haste and because of the size of the buck, I misjudged the distance and watched my arrow just shave hair off the bottom of his rib-cage. Never saw him again. Talking to the loggers later that week, they said they had been there for about two weeks before that, working everyday from 7-3:30. I assume the deer had patterned the loggers and knew they were not a threat, but were probably knocking down browse. Odds are the deer were bedded fairly close and sound of trucks leaving meant it was safe to come out. I doubt if the drilling and any commotion it creates will impact the deer unless some of the help is hunting the area.

The landowner tells me that when he is doing timber work, the deer come in to browse the tops while he is still working. Often they come with in 50 yards of him while he is working. They get more brazen as the winter wears on and they are desperate for food. However, he says that he never sees bucks come to browse the tops. Maybe they're waiting til he's gone. Logging work creates food for the deer. Oil wells are just an incredible racket (while they're drilling).

 

[redneck2]

Just saw a blip on The Pursuit Channel last night. Guy from Wisconsin hunts public land and has gotten a record book deer something like 46 out of the last 50 years.

Says he approaches it as though someone is hunting him. So, he goes to the most difficult to get to, most inaccessible places. Wades thru chest deep water, goes thru brush too thick for most guys to get thru.

Like i had posted above, big bucks will not leave an area with food, cover, and water except during rut unless it’s dark.

As for noise, deer don’t care. What really spooks them is if you invade their bedding area and DONT make noise. If you spook them close, they no long feel safe and move. If they know you’re coming, they just slither off, or just as likely stay put because they know exactly where you are.

My brother owns the farm where I hunt. He will see deer laying in the woods or fence rows while he works the fields. They just lay there and watch while he drives back and forth.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

My brother owns the farm where I hunt. He will see deer laying in the woods or fence rows while he works the fields. They just lay there and watch while he drives back and forth.

That's because they've become accustomed to that particular activity. Don't be fooled that deer "don't care" and don't get spooked from noise. (There's a reason why Mulies have large ears. ) I've seen whitetails completely ignore the trash truck and the guys jumping on an off, wrangling plastic trash bins and bags into the truck. Banging about and making all sorts of racket less than 30 yards from where the deer were standing. The deer continued to feed and occasionally looked at the men as the men and the truck made their way down the street, which to the West was homes, and to the East was the farm where I was hunting. When the deer got closer to me as they fed, I inadvertently broke a twig on the ground, and I was fifty yards away...they all bolted. The sound of the twig snapping was different, and from a different direction, than the twice a week garbage pickup noise and activity to which the deer were accustomed. That's why the deer just watch your brother drive back and forth, and don't react..., they've heard and seen it before.

LD

 

[wombat13]

I’m thinking maybe I should ride in on an atv and bring a chainsaw with me like the land owner. They’re like Pavlov’s dogs when he starts the saw. Mostly does though and they aren’t too hard to find most days.

 

[Hookeye]

Private ground. First week of gun season.
Saw one doe and an 8 pt opening day (Sat).
Nothing the next 4 days.
Guys running chainsaws next door Mon and Tues.
Wed all was quiet and I popped my best buck

 

[buck460XVR]

Mostly does though and they aren’t too hard to find most days.

Iffin you have does, and plenty of them, you have bucks. Just how it works for the most part. Odds are they have pressured to being totally nocturnal or most of them have been shot off. Is there any way you can find out your deer density and buck to doe ratio in your area? Around here, because of the QDM mindset on much of the private land, does have learned they are not a prime target. Same with young bucks. So, they tend to be less cautious and come out more in daylight hours. Then, 3-4 years later after those young bucks have be trained to come to an area and ignore that guy in the tree, he is surprised by an arrow/bullet thru his chest. Not so much on more heavily pressured private land and most public land. The scenario is more like the OPs. On public land, less cautious deer are shot. Cautious deer have figured out what's going on and iffin they make it to their sanctuary before being shot, they go completely nocturnal and live another year. On heavily pressured private land they all go over to a neighbor's where the threat is much less. Tracks and sign are a good indicator o how many deer are in an area. Still, I have seen deer trails that looked like cowpaths, but produced virtually no deer during daylight hours, during the gun hunting season. Deer that were seen, were not moving naturally, but being pushed, either on purpose or by accident. Iffin there are plenty of deer there and plenty of sign later in the season, that may be the secret to seeing more and larger bucks.

 

[wombat13]

Can't find anything on the deer density or buck to doe published by the state. The state regulates by "region" and "unit" within the region. Here is what the state says about our area: "Large tracts of mature forest dominate the landscape. As these forests continue to mature, the need for habitat improvement will become more apparent. Landowners willing to put forth the effort and expense to improve their lands through active forest management and creation of young forest habitat will see better hunting." I believe there is higher than the area average deer population on this property because it was cut heavily 10+ years ago and the landowner continues to do TSI work creating food for them. The land was treated as public access by the locals until about 6.5 years ago when the current landowner purchased. Activity on the land has decreased significantly in the last 2 years.

I've sat in spots where I thought I'd see plenty of deer, "cowpath" trail right next to an easy spot to cross the creek, and not seen deer for days. Trail cameras are the same. They might show deer several days in a row and then no deer for a week or more. There's just a lot of land that is roughly the same so they don't really need to be in any particular spot it seems.