Which 1911 survey!

1911

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Let's be honest about 1911s and reliability. Even Ed Brown suggests using one or two brands of ammunition, both 230gr FMJ and he even goes so far as to say that you should stick with what works. My Kimber runs 100% reliably using 230gr FMJ factory ammunition (tried four different brands with zero failures) and my 200gr LRNFP (Oregon Trail) reloads using crappy PMC brass, W231 powder and WLP primers. When I say 100%, I'm not talking about a box of 50 in an afternoon at the range, I'm talking 150 rounds in an IPSC match which puts more stress on the pistol since all of those rounds are shot within less than five minutes. I've been shooting my way through thousands of 185gr LSWC bullets from Western Nevada that I bought many years ago. These bullets are 100% reliable in any of my SIG P220s, but I'll admit, as accurate as they are, they simply aren't reliable in my Kimber. At this point, I won't use them for an IPSC match for that reason. I haven't tried any HP bullets in my Kimber yet and probably won't since it's not a defensive pistol per se. My Ed Brown fills that role.
 
It is the rail that I want. Whatever weapon I end up with will have a dedicated rail mounted light. As for the front checkering, it's not a big deal either way.
 
speaksoftly said:
It is the rail that I want. Whatever weapon I end up with will have a dedicated rail mounted light. As for the front checkering, it's not a big deal either way.
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OK ... that makes sense. I doubt you'll be anything but very happy with the Operator. You'd probably be happy with the Kimber TEII as well, and if you're into tinkering as I am, the Kimber has a higher "fun" factor. When I buy a TRP, there won't be anything to do except shoot it. That's kind of good, but also kind of boring.
 
The Colt's XSE Rail should be on this list, especially since it is in the price sweet spot.

ColtRailGun-Cerakote.jpg

As it is not, the SA Operator gets my vote.

The S&W, SIG, and Kimber are all 1911-like objects.

A real 1911A1 pattern pistol is not going to have an external extractor nor a FP safety that is deactivated via the grip safety.
 
Wow, four choices, and a dozen different opinions, preferences. If you can check these out, side by side your preference will be clear. All are fine pistols get what you like, I would be happy with any of these. All things being equal I would probably go with the best "deal", but of course they are not "equal" and would narrow the list to your choices that start with S. Just another $.02
 
If you can check these out, side by side your preference will be clear.
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Biggest problem. I apparently live in some sort of void. My local gun stores (including a Gander Mountain and Academy) only have Rock Island 1911's, two Kimber Crimson Carry, and a few Taurus 1911's. They don't even have "real Sigs" but only carry the low priced polymer models. It's something I absolutely hate about this town. Though you can't shake a stick without seeing a Glock for sale. Ugh...
 
For the "purists" out there, which 1911 that JMB designed had a light rail on it? Try not to knock external extractors too much as the final JMB design, the HP included just such a feature.

Those who think S&W quality is lacking must not be shooting them. Try and get a stoppage with an M&P or one of their 1911s. Also, as previously stated, the Enhanced series has eliminated the Swartz safety system. For that matter one could argue if it doesn't say Colt and stick to the original pattern it is merely a "1911-like object". Disqualifying any of these pistols because they don't fit a 100 year old mold is silly. Try changing a few parts without fitting and see how many 1911s don't fit the original specs.
 
Try and get a stoppage with an M&P or one of their 1911s.
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HUGE fan of the M&P line here. I see what you're saying. In response, I have little interest in the nostalgic value of the pistol. The nostalgic aspect of the pistol is nice but to me, they are tools and I'd prefer one with modern reliability.
 
Problem with a thread like this is now you've got me eyeballin' a new 1911 that I don't really need. But what the hey, Maw can wait on that operation ... .
 
For the "purists" out there, which 1911 that JMB designed had a light rail on it? Try not to knock external extractors too much as the final JMB design, the HP included just such a feature.
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That JMB had much to do with the final design of the BHP is one of the biggest myths in all of the firearms world. I wish the ignorant would quit repeating this canard about the origins of the BHP design.

Dieudonné Saive is the real father of the BHP. It was his magazine design, and it was his work after Colt's patents on the 1911 expired in 1928 that allowed him to build the BHP off of the very rudimentary designs that Browning left behind at his death in 1926. The BHP was not in final form until 1934.

Besides, a rail doesn't affect function on a 1911. An external extractor makes detail stripping the slide without tools impossible.

Those who think S&W quality is lacking must not be shooting them. Try and get a stoppage with an M&P or one of their 1911s. Also, as previously stated, the Enhanced series has eliminated the Swartz safety system. For that matter one could argue if it doesn't say Colt and stick to the original pattern it is merely a "1911-like object". Disqualifying any of these pistols because they don't fit a 100 year old mold is silly. Try changing a few parts without fitting and see how many 1911s don't fit the original specs.
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Try changing the extractor on a S&W 1911 style object without factory support and let us know how that goes.

At least SA builds a fairly faithful 1911 clone. S&W, Kimber and SIG simply do not.
 
Pizzagunner said:
That JMB had much to do with the final design of the BHP is one of the biggest myths in all of the firearms world. I wish the ignorant would quit repeating this canard about the origins of the BHP design.

Dieudonné Saive is the real father of the BHP. It was his magazine design, and it was his work after Colt's patents on the 1911 expired in 1928 that allowed him to build the BHP off of the very rudimentary designs that Browning left behind at his death in 1926. The BHP was not in final form until 1934.
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The Browning Hi-Power has JMB written all over it. Not only did JMB invent the locking breech design used by numerous pistol manufacturers over the years, Dieudonné Saive incorporated a number of features found in the 1911 into the Hi-Power after the patents expired. I'll count myself among the "ignorant" thank you very much. As for Dieudonné Saive, he invented the FN FAL so he was obviously a genius in his own right. I wonder if he would have been as indignant as you to see JMB receiving most of the credit for the Hi-Power among the ignorant masses ... somehow I doubt he would be.
 
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Either way the HP enjoys it's external appendage regardless of which genius invented it. No need to remove the extractor on the Smith and breakages are rare.

By the way pizza guy, Springfield doesn't build anything, they assemble. Hecho en Brazil. They do however remove those markings on their higher priced models for "ignorant" buyers. I don't have anything against Springfield, spent a week helping the owner move in to his house (nicest people I have ever met, gracious and down to earth) but the fact remains they are little more than an assembly line and importer.
 
"Hecho" is Spanish, not Portugese smart guy. Most SA pistols are marked on the bottom of the dustcover "FI Brazil" or "Imbel," and Indústria de Material Bélico do Brasil is a world class operation which is ISO 9001 certified.
 
Ok guys I've made a decision.

DSC00130.jpg

Reason's why.

1) The Smith gets very high marks on THR and in the 1911 forum that I also posted this thread.
2) It has all the bells and whistles that I was looking for.
3) I'm a huge fan of Smith's warranty department.
4) In terms of continuity, it would go well with my S&W MP-15 as well as my M&P's.
5) She's sexy

Thanks for all the opinions and advise.

-Marcos

Edit: Just a note. I'll be selling a FS M&P with .40 and .357 Sig barrels shortly to keep from going to the poor house over this 1911. So yeah...look for that. ;-)
 
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The Colt Model 70 is not available as a choice? :cuss: If I'm going to pay $1000 for it I want the name too or else I'm buying a full custom for Les Baer.
 
In a railed 1911 around that price I'd rather have just one STI Duty One over any 2 or 3 of those... if you gave me all four I'd just sell 'em and buy a bunch of ammo and the STI anyway.
 
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