Which Garand?

[Warpt762x39]

I'm looking into buying a Garand from CMP in the near future. I decided on the Service Grade and was wondering if there was any quality difference between the Springfield Armory models and the Harrington & Richardson models.

Prices are the same but I want to know if there's any overall quality difference. Such as wood to metal fit, triggers quality, finish quality especially in the pre finishing prep.

Anybody have an opinion?

 

[bcaill4]

The only diffrence is the name stamped on the reciever. The other parts could be a mix match of diffrent manufacturers and years. Most of the rifles have been refurbished at one time.

 

[Birddog1911]

All Garands had to go through rigorous inspection before they were released, so they are all going to be pretty much the same. Bcaill was right; chances are good that parts will be mixed; armorers just pulled parts off and threw them in a bin, then rebuilt with whatever they grabbed.

That said, the last buy back from Greece had, to my understanding, quite a number of rifles that were pretty much the same as when they were shipped. So, from what I'm hearing, and take that for what it is worth, chances are better now than before that you could get a rifle with matching, or atleast closer to fully matching, numbers.

They will most likely be post war. HRA will definately be post war, as they didn't receive the contract till after 1945. HRAs are known to have "nicer" finishes than all others.

For what it is worth, I ordered an HRA SG on the 18th of March. We'll see what I get!

 

[USSR]

...I want to know if there's any overall quality difference. Such as wood to metal fit, triggers quality, finish quality especially in the pre finishing prep.

The quality of the rifle you get is more an indicator of the past life (and abuse) of that particular rifle. Since you live in Pennsylvania, why not drive out to the North Store and pick out your own rifle? I live in NY, and I made the 6.5 hour drive earlier this year and got exactly what I wanted. Ordering directly from the CMP is the luck of the draw; maybe good, maybe not so good.

Don

 

[az_imuth]

If you're just looking to get a good shooter, then either one will be fine. The postwar SA and the HRA will be a toss-up, as both were very nice rifles when new. If you want something with a little history, order the SA and attach a sticky note requesting a WW2 era rifle. That won't guarantee that you'll get one, but I hear the odds are much better that way.

I've ordered several HRA's in the past and it seemed like they all came with a lot of post-war SA parts on them. I later ordered a SA and received a post-war model full of HRA parts. Worked out perfectly in the end, but made me wonder why all the parts swapping had gone on in the first place.

My final word of advice...plan to get both.

 

[Nikdfish]

I picked up a service grade HRA a year or so back. Looked to be original parts all the way around, the only non HR part being the Springfield op rod. Bore, crown & chamber looked pristine, stock had some "character marks" (incl. a couple of pock marked places on the butt stock where it looked like a loaded clip had been tapped). Very happy with it!

Nick

 

[hub]

Do you qualify to order from CMP? The only reason I ask is that you have to be a member of a club affiliated with CMP to buy from CMP. I'm not bashing CMP at all and I am a member of a club "now" but when I was looking to buy a Garand I was not so I had to go another route.

I recently dealt with Tony Giacobble "The Garand Guy" and was very pleased with his work and fast turnaround. I kinda paused at the price on his website but after sending and email we worked out a good deal. Not to mention the three day turnaround was a lot better than three months plus before your order is shipped.

http://www.garandguy.com/index.html

 

[NJGarand]

Tony is who I got my Garand from. Great guy to deal with and he does excellent work with Garands. I got one of his "Premium Shooters" with a TE 2 barrel. May 1943 Springfield Garand.

 

[Orlando]

First, there is no such thing as matching numbers on a Garand
A Service Grade is a Service Grade no matter who the manufacture is. Read the Service Grade description and expect to get that
I have seen a few to many complaints lately on various forums of the Garand guys Garands. For what he charges there should be zero problems. Good thing is he always seems to make things right

 

[CZguy]

If you can, it's best to go to one of the stores in person.

If you can't you might get lucky.

Here's a Service grade SA with a new CMP stock. The muzzle gages a 1.

 

[Birddog1911]

Wow Cz, you did good on that Garand! What range did you shoot that group? I'm assuming shooting off of bags.

 

[Warpt762x39]

Do you qualify to order from CMP? The only reason I ask is that you have to be a member of a club affiliated with CMP to buy from CMP. I'm not bashing CMP at all and I am a member of a club "now" but when I was looking to buy a Garand I was not so I had to go another route.

I recently dealt with Tony Giacobble "The Garand Guy" and was very pleased with his work and fast turnaround. I kinda paused at the price on his website but after sending and email we worked out a good deal. Not to mention the three day turnaround was a lot better than three months plus before your order is shipped.

I just sent in my membership dues for the Garand Collectors Association. It'll be a couple weeks before I can order my Garand so that should be taken care of by then.

The age and citizenship part isn't an issue at all and I have my LTCF so there's my final requirement taken care of.

The one and only Garand I got to shoot was last August at a group shoot. We had some guys set up some clay targets on the berm at 100yds and were trying to bust them with their suped up ARs.

After at least a half a magazine each, only about 4 of the 9 or 10 clays were shattered. They seemed to have given up so I call over from the bench I was using to ask if they minded that I try.

They gave me the go ahead assuming my luck would be similar to theirs. Seeing as I had only fired maybe 24 rounds of Greek surplus from that rifle that day, I was assuming the same with my luck.

So I line up the sights with 3 or 4 of the guys watching (the rest were adjusting sights and such) and squeezed off the first round. Nailed the clay.

So I line up on the next one and hit it just as easily.

Of the 5 clays I shot at with 8 rounds of ammo, I had no clays left and three rounds left in the gun. Right then and there I fell in love with the Garand.

That's why I decided to get a Garand before an AR. The history is definitely cool but showing up all those other guys with their ARs was even cooler.

Oh and I got a round of applause from all of the AR guys that had missed all those times. Lol.

 

[Birddog1911]

Funny you should say that. I was watching one of the gun shows this evening on Outdoor Channel, and they were showing a few guys going tactical on targets with their ARs. Then I see one of the guys is running the same course of fire with a Garand! Nice to see the ol' girl still runs with the new kids!

 

[CZguy]

Wow Cz, you did good on that Garand! What range did you shoot that group? I'm assuming shooting off of bags.

It's the internet so.............about 1,000 yards.


It was 100 yards, from a front and rear rest, and I've done a lot of work to that rifle to get it to shoot that good.

 

[Orlando]

CZguy could you share with us what mods you did to your rifle? Thanks

 

[KCAce]

Just bought my first garand at N Store

Ditto on the suggestions you go directly to a store if you can. I'm fortunate to live within an hour of the N Store, and just bought my first garand last weekend - a service grade with a mix of SA and H&R parts. Muzzle was a 1 and throat a 2. Wood was in good shape generally, with a nice clear cartouche. Can't wait to get out and shoot it.
Best part of going to the store was the great help from the people there, both the guys working the counter and some of the other experienced garand owners shopping there who offered helpful words of advice.
Living close to the CMP store will probably turn out to be expensive!

KCAce

 

[sarge83]

As others have posted, if you can go to the north or south store it's worth the trip to get the apple from the tree rather than the barrel.

I went in spring 2007 and brought back two really nice field grade Dane returned Springfield garands that gauged 2. I replaced the wood on one of them with a CMP stock and it looks great.

Last year I ordered an HRA service and was not disappointed, very nice.

 

[CZguy]

CZguy could you share with us what mods you did to your rifle? Thanks

Sure, because when I first got it it was nice looking, but an average shooter.

First I did the tilt check.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlIoxbtdPXY&feature=PlayList&p=8CA34B01DDA59EB1&playnext_from=PL&index=158

Then I relieved wood where ever it was touching the barrel. Then I throughly cleaned the barrel.

I finished up with a trigger job, bring it down to it's safe minimum weight of 4 1/2 pounds. (Any lighter and it may double)

All of this information was learned at the CMP forums. The best thing that you can do while you are waiting for your rifle is to read and learn about it.

 

[Orlando]

I have done all those things and installed a a NOS 1955 SA barrel and dont get near those groups at 100 yds. You shooting HXP surplus or handloads?

 

[CZguy]

HXP, I did mention that it's shot off a good rest. The muzzle on this one gages a 1.

Ask a friend to shoot it, everyone's eyes are different.

 

[Orlando]

My barrel is a USGI NOS Muzzle 0, I only have 50 rds through her so far. I need to try a lead sled and see how she does

 

[ol' scratch]

I read in Scott Duff's book about the finish quality of the H & R as compared to the Springfield, International Harvester, and Winchester. He wrote that the H & R had nice finish work. I agree, but I have seen some very nice finish work on Springfields too. My 43' Garand has some rough patches, but it was made during the height of the war and right around the time they really started pumping them out. My uncle's H & R has beautiful finish work, but they also had more time.

Winchesters have the worst finish work. Much of the metal has swirls (not the receivers). They were always on deadline during the war and only made their production quota once, hence they were always 'under the gun.'

It seems that Rifles produced during various points during WWII had worse finishes than during other times.

Mechanically, finish work doesn't effect accuracy. Shooting from a bench with reloads, I have shot 2 MOA with my 43' Garand. I also like that it has some character. I have not modified my rifle in any way. It does have a good barrel. It gages at 1.5 throat, 1.5 muzzle and has a good crown.

 

[Flash!]

has any one bought one of the Garand's that Southern Ohio Guns is selling?

 

[Orlando]

From what I have heard on gun forums they are pretty wore out. The guys that did buy them either sent them back or had them rebarreled and had more in them than they were worth

 

[CZguy]

My barrel is a USGI NOS Muzzle 0, I only have 50 rds through her so far. I need to try a lead sled and see how she does

A couple of thoughts. The barrel might not even be broken in. Is the crown good? I think the lead sled is a good idea, as well as having a second shooter.