Which Knife Handle Material?

[AStone]

Ah, phenol formaldehyde.

Yes, as a biologist who dissected in the 70's
before going to organic chem class,
I understand them well.

It's all about those cross linkages
in 3D made possible by the hydroxyls.

 

[rcmodel]

As an afterthought.

That is what you smell when the circuit board in your gameboy leaks the smoke out, and it doesn't work anymore!

Phenolic circuit boards smell just like Micarta on a belt sander when the smoke leaks out.

rc

 

[AStone]

I've never owned a gameboy,
but I've burned enough electronics
to know exactly what you mean.

 

[hso]

Micarta was once known as phenolic resin.

Not quite. Micarta is just one of the phenolic resin binder and cloth or paper composites formed under pressure and heat. Micarta is just the trade name that was used. There were/are other composites using phenolic resin as well as polyester, epoxy and other binder material. I've laid up kevlar cloth/epoxy and glass cloth/epoxy kayaks. I've also worked with polyester resin/glass composites.

As you already know the phenolic resin systems involve formaldehyde and phenol. Phenol has a remarkably low odor threshold and may be what you're smelling (sweet/tarry?).

 

[AStone]

Back in the mid 70's, before OSHA, as a bio TA, I dissected frogs soaked in formaldehyde without gloves.
(It was way far easier to dissect out an intact jugular for my students with a scalpel w/o gloves.)

And that was after washing wheel bearings in my dad's repair shop with an organic solvent
that no doubt included at least a trace of phenolics, and some benzene ... also w/o gloves.

I'm surprised to still be alive. I expected to be dead by 50. Over a decade later,
I'm still not only kicking, but buying knives with intent (and capability)
of using them in the wild. (See location; 100 mile wilderness.)

So, talking about phenolic formaldehyde
carries special meaning for me.

Can't wait to see, feel
and smell it.

 

[hso]

http://chem.chem.rochester.edu/~chem424/novolak.htm

 

[AStone]

^ Yeah.

That's it.

"Tautomerizes".

Haven't seen that in a while.
Not a common water cooler word.

 

[hso]

Depends on where the water cooler is (or more likely distillation unit).

 

[AStone]

^ < laughs >

Yup.

 

[rcmodel]

I'm surprised to still be alive.

BTDT!

Back in the 60's & 70's, we washed moly grease out of our maintenance uniforms before going home every night for years.

With Trichloroethane!

I mean heck, it worked so good dry cleaners used it too.
So the wife didn't bitch about the black grease she couldn't wash out of my cloths.
And it dried completely before I got home, so she didn't bitch about the smell either!

It was a win-win situation to wash in TCE every evening before going home!

The company bought it in 55 gal drums for us to wash big machines with a compressed air sprayer, without a respirator or remote air supply.

So:
What could possibly go wrong?

PS: Don't even get me started on free-hand grinding and polishing copper beryllium injection mold die inserts for 10 years with no dust protection!
I'd still be blowing green snot out of my nose on weekends!

If I had known then I was going to live this long, I would have taken better care of myself.
At the time, I expected to be killed in Viet Nam before I was 30.
But that was nearly 40 years ago, and I wasn't, because I didn't end up going to Viet Nam afterall.

rc

 

[Lone Star]

Buck still uses the term "phenolic resin" for many of their handles. And I don't see the graininess and layers in their handles that I see in Micarta used by others. But they endure well, although I've seen dents and scuffs in them if carelessly handled. Dropped on rocks, that sort of thing.

My son says that the darker the polymer, the stronger. Don't know where he read it, but he's probably right. But that's relative. A white polymer handle might last a 150 years or more, a black one far longer. I sort of want a white one, for variety and appearances sake. I think the Buck custom shop can make white ones. They should be stronger now than those that cracked in severe cold back in the early 1960's. I think they were made of something called Melomene, if I spelled it right.

I think Buck's black handles are the right choice for their standard knives. The knives are good values. I've heard that Wal-Mart has them at exceptional prices.

I've never smelled an odor from a polymer handle.

 

[AStone]

Yes, Lone Star, you're close: melamine.

It's commonly used for countertops as a laminate. Hard stuff.
Never thought of using it for a handle, but makes sense.

 

[Zeke/PA]

Lone Star,
The "graniness" that you talk about can be traced to the base of the Micarta to start with.
Paper base: No "grain" of course.
Linen base: No APPRECIABLE grain but it's more expensive.
Canvas base: Can be rather course.
I used a "CE" grade canvas based in colors black and brown for quite a few knives that I sold.
The "CE" grade APPROACHES linen in it's fineness.

 

[Jason_G]

I always thought phenol smelled a little like a freshly opened Band-Aid. FWIW, that's still what they preserve the cadavers with at our local med school. The smell is unmistakable. Like some of you already said, it will cross link amino acid residues, denaturing proteins and killing microorganisms. Also works great for precipitating protein for centrifugation during DNA extractions when used with chloroform. You don't want to get straight phenol on your hands. In a cured resin, it's inert.

Some billiard balls are made with phenolic resin as well. I've actually thought about whether old pool balls would work as scale/spacer material, but Micarta is pretty cheap, and would require less work. I think I still may try it one day though.



Jason