Why do we register the action when crimes are traced by bullet/barrel markings.

[MinnMooney]

This is something that I've yet to understand. If someone wanted to use a firearm in a crime and not have it traced then they could buy the handgun and a spare/used extra barrel. After the crime (w/the spare bbl.) our budget-minded offender would just toss the spare barrel that was used in the crime and reinstall the original.

As long as they destroyed or tossed the brass there'd be no matching of the bullets to the original handgun and it's still original barrel.

It should have been the barrels with the serial numbers, not the receivers.

What am I missing?

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

What am I missing?

The complete lack of logical thinking and understanding of firearms by anti-gun politicians and the bills they ram through (shoulder thing that goes up, et.al)
The whole registration for the purpose of "ballistic fingerprinting" was a big lie IMO and there are other reasons our employees (who supposedly represent us) want to know what you have.

 

[1911Today]

Either way, you're getting rid of the evidence. If you take the time to remove the barrel of a gun, it doesn't matter if you're worrying about barrel markings or serial numbers, the evidence is gone.

The receiver of a gun is the part where all of the other, smaller parts attach. It would be silly to add a serial to barrel because it is a popularly replaced part. Would you really want to apply for an FFL every time you wanted to put a .22 conversion on a 1911 or AR, some model handguns even have interchangeable-caliber barrels, would you want to pay $5 and have 4 FFL entries for 1 handgun? I'd imagine the ATF would pay a visit.

 

[esquare]

I may be cynical but I think you're missing the idea that gun control has never been passed as an effective way to reduce violence and crime. It's pretty obvious to me that at best, the legislators were incredibly naive and hoped for the best but legislated with no data to prove that it would work. At worst, the real intention is to remove the ability for the people to resist a governmental power grab.

Great question!

 

[lexjj]

Ballistic forensics is basically bull anyway.

Here's a good place to start research http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military_law/4325797.html?page=2

 

[billybobjoe]

Don't use a gun to commit a crime--just use a rock.

 

[billybobjoe]

Then they'll have to give all rocks serial numbers. When a meteor falls.....

 

[DeathByCactus]

Cool people use a shiv.

Rocks are sooo mundane.

 

[Frank Ettin]

Why do you want to give the politicians ideas?

 

[ClayInTX]

I don't believe the OP was missing the point. I believe his question was rhetorical.

 

[MinnMooney]

No one has really answered this question. I've gotten some interesting replys, however.

from 1911today (post 3) :

Would you really want to apply for an FFL every time you wanted to put a .22 conversion on a 1911 or AR, some model handguns even have interchangeable-caliber barrels, would you want to pay $5 and have 4 FFL entries for 1 handgun?

I've paid about 50 FFL fees in my lifetime ($250 total). I've only purchased 5 or 6 extra barrels so my total would have been $280. Certainly not a concideration for me but it might be for anyone who buys 2-5 barrels for most every gun they own.

I'd imagine the ATF would pay a visit.

P.S. The ATF wouldn't know because only the barrel would be registered and they'd have no idea that they were all for the same receiver.


from esquare (post 4) :

I may be cynical but I think you're missing the idea that gun control has never been passed as an effective way to reduce violence and crime.

In a way, I was being very facetious. This rule, I believe, was made so the gov't knows who owns what and how many.

Almost everything that you own is known to someone and can be found out by those who know the system. Think about it.... Cars, hunting, fishing, houses, every add'n to your house, income, (& if you claim deductions on taxes) all medical expendatures, work expenses, car mileage, losses to anything that you own, day care, insurance costs, etc.

Unless you pay cash for most things then they know your whole life!


from fiddletown (post 9) :

Why do you want to give the politicians ideas?

Hell NO !! They get way too many on their own.


from ClayinTx (post 10) :

I don't believe the OP was missing the point. I believe his question was rhetorical.

Thank you. Except, not rhetorical but maybe facetious. I really would like to know why the idiots in Washington, when trying to be able to trace a criminally-used weapon, chose to serial number the wrong part. There is nothing about the receiver that that is used (legally in court) to ID the bullets that were collected at the scene or from the body. Sure, the casings from a semi-auto will leave identifiable marks but semi-autos weren't very popular back when this law was written. Certainly not like they are now.

 

[w_houle]

I thought you were suppose to use a bullet made from frozen meat (CSI)?

 

[hso]

Ever tried changing the barrel out on a revolver or a rifle?

 

[texas bulldog]

Ever tried changing the barrel out on a revolver or a rifle?

that's what i was just thinking. when this law was written, revolvers were much more common. while it's still possible to change the barrel on a revolver, it's not nearly as common or as easy as with a semi-auto where you can just drop it in. let's just say it isn't something i'd plan to do without the assistance of a gunsmith.

still...the other posters are right. it has everything to do with knowing how many and which guns you own.

 

[The Gunman]

MinnMooney

Your premise that they wanted to serialize firearms to solve crime is what you are missing. We can not know the true reason they decided on what to serialize, only what they say the reason was.

Didn't most of the laws covering manufacturing and dealing firearms start under the tax code.

 

[NMGonzo]

In Argentina; a country with a long history of gun control, the slide and the barrel MUST have matching numbers.

I an owner wants to replace the barrel; the owner must do some paperwork.

Still ... utter nonsense. Criminals get their crimes done with or without guns.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Why do we register the action when crimes are traced by bullet/barrel markings.

We don't register any part of the gun. There is no such thing as gun registration here in Arkansas. If you have gun registration in your state, you need to do something about that.

 

[MinnMooney]

from Vern Humphry (post 17) :

We don't register any part of the gun. There is no such thing as gun registration here in Arkansas. If you have gun registration in your state, you need to do something about that.

Perhaps you misunderstood my meaning of "registration" or I'm missing your meaning. Every gun I buy from a dealer or from out-of-state has to be registered (or recorded, if you will) thru an FFL holder. Those serial numbers, mfg'rs, makes, models & calibers are recorded in permanent records that can be accessed by LE - on all levels : local, state and federal.

That might not be "registering" to you in Arkansas but it sure is to me here in Minnesota.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Perhaps you misunderstood my meaning of "registration" or I'm missing your meaning. Every gun I buy from a dealer or from out-of-state has to be registered (or recorded, if you will) thru an FFL holder. Those serial numbers, mfg'rs, makes, models & calibers are recorded in permanent records that can be accessed by LE - on all levels : local, state and federal.

That may be how it is in Minnesota, but here in Arkansas (and in most other states) the records remain in the possession of the FFL. While a LEO may review his records, they are not centralized.

 

[MinnMooney]

That may be how it is in Minnesota, but here in Arkansas (and in most other states) the records remain in the possession of the FFL. While a LEO may review his records, they are not centralized.

Let's not argue about this, as we're saying exactly the same thing.

They ARE "Registered" because :
They ARE permanent records.
They ARE kept at the place of purchase.
They ARE NOT centralized (Federally).
They ARE easily accessed by all levels of L.E.

That's how it is in Minnesota, Arkansas and probably all other states.

Now....... can we put the "registration" definition to rest?

 

[Jim K]

Maryland has had "ballistic fingerprinting" of cartridge cases (new guns only) for years. There was never a record of it having solved a crime or even pointing at a suspect. But when the legislature was about to repeal the law, the state police (puppets of the governor) suddenly "solved" a murder through the cartridge case ID. Coincidence? Of course. No one could possibly accuse our noble state police of lying through their teeth, or of being dishrags for an anti-gun administration.

Jim

 

[MT GUNNY]

Shhhh!!!

 

[eye5600]

The OP's miserly criminal would have to be sure the purchase of the extra barrel could not be traced. Bad news to have it on his Mastercard statement.

 

[benEzra]

For the same reasons your state DMV tracks VIN numbers instead of using pics of your tire treads, even though it's tire tracks that are left at crime scenes.

Ballistic markings are too similar to each other to be individually identifiable when the sample size is in the millions; the markings change with normal use and wear, just like tire tracks; and thus are unusable for identifying an individual gun or proving ownership of same.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Now....... can we put the "registration" definition to rest?

Yep -- by agreeing that filling out a form which is kept by the seller is not "registration."