Why we should all have SXS's (101)

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Okiecruffler

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Didn't want to hijack the other thread, but I couldn't leave this be. I know it's hard to believe, but I think the SXS is the superior shotgun design. I offer these simple reasons*.

1. Quick choke/shot choices. Got a modified choke on you slide gun but need a full for this shot. Even with one of those old dial a choke barrel warts, by the time you change you'll need a XXXfull choke to hit that bird. With a SXS, you just move your finger back a bit. You can even tailor you shot loads. For quail in the open, 8's for you open choke, 7 1/2's for your tight one, give yourself a few extra feet on that double. You could even put 8's in your open tube and buckshot in your tight tube. Instant quail/deer gun, just don't forget which barrel is which.

2. Quick follow up shots. I try to stay out of the "which is faster, pump vs. auto" arguements, but I'm willing to bet neither is as fast as a SXS. You don't even have to reverse your finger movement, just slap that bad boy on back. Sure, you only have 2 shots, but where are you guys shooting that you need that third shot?

3. It's like carrying a backup gun. Something happens to the firing pin, barrel, etc of your pump gun, game over. With my SXS, sure it's annoying, but I still have a very useable single shot.

4. Follow thru. Nothing swings like a double. Heck, half the time I can't even stop swinging my 12's when I want too with all that weight out there.

5. Compactness. Sure they're heavier, that just helps with recoil, and you guys could use some excersize anyway. But that ugly reciever on the pump adds at least a good 4 inches to the over all length of the gun, that's 4 inches that could be used for more barrel.

6. Coolness factor. Sure much has been said about the "fear Factor" of the sound of a pump racking, but who can argue with the look of those two enormous tubes staring back at you. And in the field you feel like you're back in the 20's, when men were men and birds were so plentiful you could hunt them with a slingshot. A double barreled slingshot of course. And you can alway pretend you're on African safari with that double rifle that you'll never really be able to afford.

So as I'm sure you'll now agree, the SXS is the superior design.

* It should be noted that none of these reasons mean that the O/U is a good design. The O/U is a child of satan, requiring the shooter to hold his head at a 90 degree angle to line up his eyes correctly with the misplaced barrels.
 
I have a 16 gauge 311 and a 16 gauge Marlin Model 90 OU.

I prefer the feel of the Model 90.

Please smile when you say mean things about it! :D
 
There are lots of good things to say about SxS shotguns. Despite the Okie's (understandable) bias, they typically apply to the O/U as well.

The problem I have is that most of the SxSs which I find interesting are also priced about the same as a car. :uhoh:

I've got a birthday coming up in a few weeks, and I keep dropping hints to my wife for a beautiful Model 21 which is available locally. It's very much like Ralphie in "A Christmas Story".

Of course, the ulterior motive is to make a Model 42 seem like a reasonable buy. :D

[Insert evil laugh here]
 
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I've always wanted,

and maybe it's time to start seriously looking for, a Winchester mod 24. Don't get me wrong, I can see the beauty in a pidgeon grade 21, but something just draws me to the utility grade SXS's. Those guns that are just total no-nonsence. Made for business, for common folks who had to work for a living.
 
but something just draws me to the utility grade SXS's. Those guns that are just total no-nonsence. Made for business, for common folks who had to work for a living.
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I think of SxS's as a step up. My family (uncles, great uncles, granspa, dad et. al) all owned only single shots because the SxS's were too expensive. :)
 
Okie-

Great Post !!

I have no problem with SxS - none at all . I like the ability ,as you mentioned of double triggers, instant choke selection, and reliability.

In shooting clay games the single sighting plane of O/U , semi, and pump have ruled for many years, and this will continue.

I contend it is the shooter, not the shooting iron - and I harp this no matter the platform - be it rifle, handgun or shotgun - as my posts bear out.

The simple truth is , if a person were to INVEST in ammo and shooting - one gets to a level " give 'em a stick and they'll fell it" .

SxS have become pricey , and hard to find the classics like the 311's and Model 24's. O/U are next in this price point. Semis- well good deals can be found, still fall in 3rd - that Pump is still a lot of gun for the monies spent.

I have always thought, if the 28 gauge shells were more affordable , and the Mfgs made a more affordable SxS in 28gauge , field grade if you will - this would be a GREAT starter gun to teach new shooters.

Of Course - I myself wouldn't mind having a Webly & Scott in 28 ga right now...:D

Of course a 311 , one of each please , would make me very happy too! :D

Heck - my problem is - I like them all. Too many classics, in too many platforms.

As an old mentor once shared , " Folks may find I died in my sleep - they'll find I died with a good dog at my side and one of shotguns recently used for sport or game... my 42, a model 21, a model 12 or Citori...they damn sure won't find any plastic or stainless guns on my property, in my house, or on my hip".

Sumbitch died with Gummit 45 on his nightstand and dog crying at his side and he last shot a model 12, and model 42 .

I know - I was the one that last shot with him , I was the one that found him.

A 20 ga 311 was leaning against the wall....so was a Model 94 in 30- 30 and a model 70 in '06.

If he could see it - he could fell it ....give 'em a stick and he could fell it .
 
"In shooting clay games the single sighting plane of O/U , semi, and pump have ruled for many years, and this will continue."

While it may be wider, a SxS also has a "single sighting plane."

Do any guns have multiple sighting planes?

I guess if I sighted, rather than pointed my gun, it might matter. ;)

I have several examples of both, and like them all.




Scott
 
TaxPhd,

You know what I meant . You know that I know a shotgun is pointed not aimed.

Granted , as I get a bit older , and with eye problems I'm going through...well...dragonflies and such should be better advised to NOT fly with some upland birds.

There is no good way to breast out a dragonfly. Too much work - for the meat. :D
 
I've used 'em all, as a hunter. I've never been much of a clay bird shooter, although I'll admit it is fun.

Learned on pumps, have used autos, now I use a Citori. But the one and only shotgun I regret trading off was my LC Smith field grade. Best handling of the bunch, and it had a lot of character. I retired it when the steel shot laws came into effect, and then traded it off. :(
 
I personally feel SxS's would be more popular if the guns most were exposed to were not the cheaper versions for the most part. Though there is nothing wrong with a Stevens 311, but it isn't a British double with the between the hands balance that weigh's around 6 1/2 pounds in a 12 ga! The truth of the matter is you can own a rather high grade over and under for what it costs to own a medicore grade double. It comes down to cost as much as anything else. :scrutiny:
 
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5. Compactness. Sure they're heavier, that just helps with recoil, and you guys could use some excersize anyway. But that ugly reciever on the pump adds at least a good 4 inches to the over all length of the gun, that's 4 inches that could be used for more barrel.
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I don't think they're heavier. My side by side 20-gauge weighs in at 6 lbs., with 28" barrels. Its not particularly light for a bird gun, either. Really light 20-gauge side by sides go about 5-1/2 lbs. I'd like to see any all-steel pump or auto that weighs less than that.
 
Well guys, I started this thread tongue in cheek.

Well partially anyway, I don't think the SXS gets the respect it deserves anymore, mostly because you can't hang cool do-dads all over it. I love the SXS's in all flavors, and will come to their defense whenever the need arrises, but in the end they're just a tool like all other shotguns. I've known 3 great wingshooters in my life. The kind of guys who if they missed it warranted a trip to the town doctor. The kind of guys who at some time in their life hunted, not because it was alot of fun, but because they had to. Only one of them used a SXS, my grandfather who started my obsession. The second used an old, and I mean OLD, 870. The third, my father, used a Mossberg bolt action .410. But I'll touch on a few points.

First, on the single vs. double plane debate. I have absolutely no idea what you guys are talking about. I just spent 15 minutes shouldering my old beloved 311, and that goofy bottom shucking pump of the wife's, and the only thing I notice on either is the front bead. Maybe I'm shooting all wrong, but I'm too old to change now.

Second, perhaps I shouldn't have stated "heavier" but rather muzzle heavy. I started shooting a SXS before I started looking at girls, so instead I think of a single barrel as being "muzzle light", but most people who try my SXS's remark about how they don't feel right to them.

Third, I'll never hint that my 311's are the equal of good english double. My grandfather has a few English guns, and they are true works of art. But 90% of what you are paying for is that art. My favorite, and first 311 is still as tight as it was the first time I shot it, and I've shot it, hard, for the over 20 years now. My grandfather didn't exactly baby it for it's first 30 years either. Still, his Greener will just bring a tear to your eye.

And finally, SM, you're doing it all wrong. Dragonflies ain't for broasting, you just throw the whole thing into a soup. How I miss my grannies dragonfly and tater soup. How it stuck to your ribs. Now that's eating.:D

FWIW, I believe 2 things have led to the decline of populaity of SXS's in the US. The first is steel shot, which makes me glad I don't hunt anymore. If there's been a bigger clusterhump forsed upon hunters I don't know what it is. The second is cheap imports. I'm not talking about the rusky guns we have now, they seem decent if not pretty. I'm talking about the abortions that were imported mostly by FIE, the RG of the shotgun world. Too many people bought those thinking they could get a good SXS for that price (and they could have if they had looked at the used market), and were totally disappointed.
 
I have never owned a SxS, but have shot several including a 28ga Parker reproduction,sweet,a 20ga Parker repro ,sweet,sweet,and a couple of Browning BSS's. I don't daily or even weekly peruse the used gun stores in my area, but I have never seen a used 311 on anyones shelf around here. :(

Now I would dearly love to own a nice SxS in a small gauge of 20 or 28. There have been many times that I have drooled over a nice SxS in the bigger gun shops, but can't see paying that kind of money for one. I own 5 autos, 3 O/U's, 7 or 8 pumps and a few single shots. I try to get them all out to play once in a while. But there is still that spot for a good SxS. That recent thead about Dehaan Shotguns got me thinking though..... ;)




I can shoot all those shotguns just about the same regardles of action, some fit a bit better than others, but it all boils down to.... BA/ UU/R :D
 
Okie, you forgot a few...

7. Ease of training: My wife is not an avid shooter, but she easily learned how to clear my Stoeger Coach Gun, load it, and shoot it w/ enough accuracy to hit a target at living-room distance (it's our main house longgun). I have no qualms about leaving it with her or worrying about it jamming or short-shucking.

Pumps are easy to learn, but they require a lot more effort than a double to learn. New shooters are better off learning on a single/double barrel before moving up.

8. Price: While the "quality" doubleguns (Parker, Winchester, Beretta, etc.) are inargueably pricey, there are plenty of doubles priced to compete with most semi-autos & even pumps. Thanks to Cowboy Action, a lot of importers are bringing good quality, affordable double-barrel coach guns into the US--makers like Baikail, Stoeger, & Huglu. Even Savage's 411 (made by Baikail) is priced under most semi-autos & some pumps. And affordable long-barrel hunting versions are available too (look at the Stoeger catalog).

KISS: Just as important in shotguns as in life...and doubles make for good KISS-ers... ;)

9. Ammo compatability: Modern semi-autos are reliable w/ most ammo. Pumps are slightly more reliable w/ a wider variety of ammo. But only doubles can span the entire range from Aguilla mini-shells to 3.5" magnum shells (in the appropriate chamber) without any modification. And, with the appropriate chamber inserts, you can shoot different gauge ammo in the same shotgun--even pistol & rifle ammo. Just try THAT with a pumpgun.

I don't slight the pumps or semi's at all. They do what they do well. But I'll always have a slight preference for Ol' Reliable--the double-barrel, double-trigger shotgun.... :D
 
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery....

More to the point, I happen to like most SxS shotguns myself. The two chokes and loads are a very good point when paired with two triggers as the Diety intended doubles to have.

The thread I started was just to list the advantages of the pumpgun as a GP goto, a basis for a shotgun collection that may well include SxS, O/U, and even those dratted autos.
 
Dave,

Like I said, I started this one tongue in cheek, more or less. I used to tout the SXS as the best all around gun, but I can't help but notice that my old trusty 311A has lost it's spot next to my bed to a Maverick pump. I still say that if you own only one shotgun you'd be hard pressed to find one better than the 870. But what kind of fun would it be if you only owned one shotgun? And people change, I've even learned to like those pumps, and now I'm in the market for a nice Auto-5. Heck I even toy with the idea of a 28g O/U from time to time (don't tell my dad.). There's something to be said for all the actions, and what a wonderful world we live in to be able to choose.







And BTW, SXS's rule.:D :neener:
 
The two chokes and loads are a very good point when paired with two triggers as the Diety intended doubles to have.
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Absolutely right. I believe He also intended a sxs to have a straight grip and splinter foreend.;)

There are two other reasons why the sxs is superior to an o/u in the field, one practical, one not. The gape of an open sxs is much less than an o/u which makes loading easier and moving with a loaded gun more convenient. You are less likely to fill your barrels with snow with a sxs.

The other reason is elan. With a sxs over your shoulder or cradled in your arms you are much more stylish as you stroll through the cornfields behind your favorite pointer. ;)

Paul
 
SxS shotguns are just classy. Even the inexpensive one's have an "air" about them, shoulder better and swing faster.

i got to hold and shoulder a 3000 dollar parker shotgun of early vintage about 2 weeks ago....Talk about perfection in weight, balance, swing and agility.

I'm working on my 5th:
A Baikal 20 SxS.
A Stevens 530a 16 gauge.
A Stevens 311H 12 gauge
A lefever field 12gauge.

And if all works out, the Spanish 20 Okie was speakin' 'bout in the other post.

I've got an O/U in 12, which has served me weel for many years, but the SxS's are just too much fun to forget.
 
i've always wanted a coach gun because i love the hammers on them. the wife is getting me one for christmas. went by the local dealers yesterday and he said he could get one. told him to go ahead and get a 20 gauge for the wife too. his and hers sxs's. got a single shot .410 for the daughter. now that's a family christmas.:D
 
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