Why Yell A "STOP" Or Warning?

[Erik]

Most of the arguments for issuing a warning have to do with perceptions, real and imagined, that that warning will be a determining factor that the jury will use to brand the shooter righteous, and thus not guilty.

It is a lawyer's argument,a s opposed to a legal one. There is a difference.

Note: There are variations of the theme; that the police, prosecutor's office, etc will be swayed.

 

[jon_in_wv]

If I have the time of foresight to yell some type of "get back!" or "stop" I hope I do. Lets say a witness arrives just in time to see you firing a few well aimed shots into the BG but DIDN'T see the preceding moments where he was coming at you with a knife, would you prefer he heard you yelling, "STOP! STOP! GET AWAY FROM US!!" or not? Personally I wouldn't want the violence I meet out versus my attacker to be the first thing to get everyone's attention if I can help it.

 

[Averageman]

Lets say a witness arrives just in time to see you firing a few well aimed shots into the BG but DIDN'T see the preceding moments where he was coming at you with a knife, would you prefer he heard you yelling, "STOP! STOP! GET AWAY FROM US!!" or not? Personally I wouldn't want the violence I meet out versus my attacker to be the first thing to get everyone's attention if I can help it.
People will remember things and not remember things, thats why eyewitness's aren't very reliable. 10 Witnesses, 10 different stories and it will be that way every time.
I dont want to be worried about a District Attorney while I am fighting for my life. You can second guess and what if this thing to death.
You do what you KNOW to be right for you, you will live with the results the rest of your life.

 

[Cop Bob]

BOTTOM LINE: IT SOUNDS BETTER IN COURT.... IT LOOKS BETTER IN POLICE REPORTS.... IT SOUNDS BETTER COMING FROM WITNESSES.... It MAY keep you from getting True Billed by a Grand Jury.. and if they die... IT WILL go to a Grand Jury.. It probably will go to a Grand Jury if they don't die... You just want them on your side.. PERIOD...

Fact: this is a long thread...

Fact: you will sweat more in court if it gets to that than you ever did during the incident..

Fact: it is much easier to explain the use of a warning statement that to DEFEND against the lack of one...

Fact: post shooting, start calling out to bystanders, any one you can, CALL AN AMBULANCE, CALL THE POLICE...... if they didn't hear the verbal warning, they will have heard that... don't want to look like the calloused hardened killer that they are about to make you sound like in court..

SECURE THE SUSPECTS WEAPON... Stand over it if you have too... didn't say pick it up!!!! You will REALLY want to have that tagged into evidence by the police.. WITHOUT YOUR PRINTS ON IT!

Don't give a darn about any states law that allows you to shoot without an utterance... IT ALWAYS WILL GO BETTER FOR YOU IF YOU DID.... only exception, if they fired 1st... BELIEVE ME... somebodies lawyer will bring it up!!!!

Next, I'm outta popcorn...

 

[Cosmoline]

Don't give a darn about any states law that allows you to shoot without an utterance.

Are there any state laws that require a warning before defending yourself from imminent unlawful deadly force?

 

[WNTFW]

An instructor gave one reason to practice a predetermined 'Warning' that seems logical. You will probably end up yelling something. So you might as well pick what you are going to be yelling ahead of time. Otherwise you might end up saying something that is not going to help your case.

I think it was James Yeager of Tactical Response.

It can also alert others that are with you. This could be family members you are now protecting or that may be carrying a weapon themselves.

Defending yourself could also be a civil trial. The bad guys family suing you over wrongful death or something similar.

Like many have said the verbal warning should help you. If nothing else is an early indicator of you aren't a willing victim.

 

[jeffegg2]

My thoughts....

Yelling stop, may, just may cause him to think. If you don't yell, his thoughts are clear and intent, when you yell, now he must make a decision. That split second may save your life.

 

[Cosmoline]

Here's another thought, though perhaps not a very likely issue. Two good guys end up confronting each other after pursing the same armed criminal from different directions. If both are trained to yell "stop" as they aim and fire, the fact that both are yelling may prevent them from shooting each other. Maybe...

 

[txhoghunter]

Here's another thought, though perhaps not a very likely issue. Two good guys end up confronting each other after pursing the same armed criminal from different directions. If both are trained to yell "stop" as they aim and fire, the fact that both are yelling may prevent them from shooting each other. Maybe...

Two good guys are not supposed to be chasing a criminal....especially if they have guns drawn. That is the BIG difference between a citizen with a CCW and a sworn police officer

 

[Cosmoline]

Well one might be a citizen in his home and the other an LEO responding. Stuff happens. But I'll admit it is a bit of a stretch.

 

[03Shadowbob]

The only reason I would utter anything verbal is if some innocent person's life depended on me speaking/pleading with the bad guy. That said, if I have to draw my firearm because I am being attacked or about to be attacked with the threat of great bodily harm then I will focus on my breathing and trigger squeeze and not linguistics and shoot to stop the threat.
Having been through grand jury for a shooting, it is definitely something that is a nerve racking process and I would recommend doing what you have to do to NOT have to draw and shoot. However if you do, do so efficiently and accurately and hire a good attorney.

 

[MikeNice]

Of course, because if you have time to yell commands that means he isn't running at you full tilt. If he's just standing there, why are you engaging him at all? Instead of bandying words you could be backing off via those avenues of retreat you carefully maintained while entering the situation.

You could be like me. The guy may be trying to figure out how to get around an obstacle. I inserted a shopping cart between me and the attacker, but had my back against a car. At less than fifteen feet it gave me time to draw, and warn. Fortunately the bad guy dropped his knife and ran away. However, if he had began to push the obstacle out of the way, I would have shot.

It took seeing the gun and being yelled at for him to give up. He knew that his string was running short and left.

 

[Loosedhorse]

Are there any state laws that require a warning before defending yourself from imminent unlawful deadly force?

Most of the arguments for issuing a warning have to do with perceptions, real and imagined, that that warning will be a determining factor that the jury will use

Well, my number one reason for issuing a warning would be to avoid shooting someone I could stop in some other way. Color me odd. I would shout a stop command if I felt I could do it safely (I'm behind cover), or if it doesn't cost me anything (I'm already drawing my gun and moving to cover, he's already seen me).

Perhaps we should be careful to avoid the impression that "legality" is the only determinant of shooting someone. As in the attitude: "As soon as I get AOJ lined up, man, I'm gonna light him UP!" I suspect we've all heard of instances when the defender "would have been justified" in shooting someone, but managed to end the attack without doing so. Personally, I don't want to shoot someone unless there's no other way to end his attack.

(I have run into people who think that it is a civic duty to shoot an attacker "if they can", to prevent future victims. Perhaps no one here thinks that way).

As to the "managing the jury" argument, it also goes to "managing the witnesses:" there is a difference between these two statements:

Gosh, officer, it happened so fast. First thing I noticed was that guy shot the other guy.

and

Gosh, officer, it happened so fast. First thing I noticed was that guy shouted "STOP!" really loud, and then the other guy came at him--so he shot.