Wild West Gunfighters

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Movies, TV programs and Buffalo Bill's Wild West Show account for some of the misunderstandings about the West. Consider the following information. Wyatt Earp is viewed by many moderns as one of the top gunslingers of the West, but his reputation did not achieve its current status within his lifetime. It took Hollywood to make him into the creature of legend that still exists today. I would love to read some more information that separates fact from fiction about these men.


Timthinker
 
TallPine - can I get permission to hand that great ditty off to our "High Noon" shootout crew - I got a real kick out of it!
sailortoo
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You don't need permission from me for anything. That song was on the radio back sometime in the 1980s.

I found the lyrics by doing an internet search.

Yippee yi yay :)
 
There is no lack for decent vehicle armor in theater.
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Amen to that!!

I can remember driving around Viet Nam in a jeep, with a flack jacket and sandbags on the floor boards. My second tour, my command track hit an anti-tank mine that opened up the left side like a sardine can.

What they have today is unbelieveable compared to what we had.
 
why the early complaints and the guys welding up the plates for the HumVees themselves?
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Originally only some HMMWVs had kevlar armor. These were for vehicles thought likely to need protection from small arms and fragments.

As the use of IEDs increased, it became clear all HMMWVs would need armor, and that the keflar panels were not up to the task. Despite that, the up-armoring went pretty fast -- in the famous case where a reporter primed a soldier to ask when his unit's vehicles would get armor, all but three of the vehicles in his unit already had armor, and the remaining three were scheduled for armor installation the next day.

We have gone beyond that, adopting and developing vehicles that have proved almost impervious to IEDs, and using them for the most dangerous missions.

Don't believe everything the media tells you -- they lied about Viet Nam, too.
 
Ok, still OT, but here's another hearing related question. Why not equip all our guy's weapons with suppressors? Besides saving their hearing, I could see how limiting the sound would be a major tactical advantage. I know you can't fully suppress a fully auto rifle, but even if you just suppress it enough to make it harder to pinpoint....
 
What I can't hear, is what I wish that I still could hear.
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Ain't it the truth.

I used to enjoy listening to music, the rustle of a woman's dress and the night sounds of the great out doors. Those days have been gone for 25 years or so. Nowadays I can still hear them only if they've been recorded and amplified several times. Even then the whistles and bells of tinnitus interfere. Way too many days hunting ducks and geese and other shooting activities as a youngster without hearing protection. Of course, hearing loss is hereditary from my father's side, too. :(

On the bright side, I can hear the phone ring... even when it doesn't! :D

Poper
 
I "hear" you on the loss/tennitus.
A problem I had with working with explosives/tracked vehicles is that you couldn't really just let the plugs in all the time.
At times, it was advantageous to take the ear plugs out in case someone were to say, screw up royally and shout "run for your life!!!" in my direction.
Unfortunately, that also led to some exposure to things that damaged my hearing.
But it was enough that I started to use ear plugs pretty much any time I shoot.
I had forgotten how loud a .22LR from a rifle was until the other night when I fired one round without ear plugs.
It's loud!
 
Why not equip all our guy's weapons with suppressors?

Its my understanding that this was tried by the Germans in the big one.
It seems it was decided that the MG-42 was more effective if it COULD be heard!
robert
 
Why not equip all our guy's weapons with suppressors?
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The Army experimented with that in Viet Nam, using the Syonics suppressor. While there is a slight tactical advantage (it makes it difficult for the enemy to locate you in combat), the maintenance requirement was unsupportable -- the suppressors would burn out in fights, and the advantage be lost. The effect on accuracy was also pretty serious when the suppressors burned out.
 
Sorry to take this a bit off topic, but I would really like to hear (no pun intended) from any sailors that served on the Missouri class battle ships. What hearing protection was provided for the 16" guns? How effective was it?
 
I forget who they were talking about but an old gun rag eluded to the fact that when the old gunwriters Cooper, Jordan,Keith or O'conner wete havin' a conversation you needed ear plugs because they all talked damn loud from hearing loss.
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As much as I would have loved to eavesdrop on those conversations, I had my own group of old gunners to deal with. My Dad and a couple of uncles were all either ex career military or old competitive shooters. Give them a beer or two, just to break down the concentration level, and just a talk about the weather could reach decibel levels that drove the dogs out of the house. The noise, and Uncle Bill shouting, every few minuets, "is that the phone?", used to provide us yununs with hours of amusement. I'm quite happy dad always made us wear ear protection.
 
My relatives that were in WW2 combat never seemed to have much hearing loss.
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My Dad never mentioned it either, although he did still have the ear plugs he was issued. But then again, he never mentioned anything about his time on Iwo, Saipan, or Guadalcanal. And I wouldn't have expected him to mention any problems he was having from those times.
 
Dad served 31 missions aboard a B17, as waist gunner/toggalier. In his middle life, the VA provided him with hearing aids, on through his lifetime. His was considered a service-related hearing loss. Besides the .50 Browning he fired, the constant drone of four 1200 horsepower Wright engines could have that effect.


Edit: On topic, it's interesting to note Wild Bill Hickock's first credited gunfight occurred in SE Nebraska.
 
I remember shooting .22 rifles in the late 60's when I was in the Boy Scouts. There was no hearing protection provided.

However, the RO made sure we all kept our mouths open when firing to equalize the pressure between the outside and inside of our ears.

Gotta run. I hear the phone ringing.
 
The, why the early complaints and the guys welding up the plates for the HumVees themselves?
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Early complaints. Back in the early days of the war that was true. There is no lack for armored vehicles anymore. The days of "billybob" armor are gone. Now they're working on replacing the HMWWVs altogether. I know this since I'm actually there.
 
My grandfather was an officer in charge of an artillery group/squad/battalion (whatever the Army would have called it, dont have his memoirs handy, dont recall, and I'm not real familiar with how the Army and Marines "group" things) in WWII, and I dont recall him having any hearing issues that I ever noticed.I'll have to ask Grandma next time I call though, now that it's come up, I'm a little curious, as I'd think firing rifles, tossing grenades, having explosions around you was plenty bad enough.I'd have to think firing artillery all day for years couldnt be much better.


The effect on accuracy was also pretty serious when the suppressors burned out.
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slightly OT, but ow does that work? not disputing it at all, I just didnt know than when a can wore out, it affected accuracy, as I thought the bullet didnt accually touch anything but the barrel? Does it just screw up the harmics of the barrel when it gets worn out, or what the deal? kinda curious as I plan to get a suppressor for my M4 someday.
 
When growing up in the 50's in 60,s we did not know about hearing protection. In the USGC in the late 60's same as Sailortoo stated no hearing protection and I was a Gunners Mate. Until the early 80's never did use hearing protection. Also working around heavy equipment did not help. Now I am going, what speak up.
 
However, the RO made sure we all kept our mouths open when firing to equalize the pressure between the outside and inside of our ears.
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Hopefully he provided lucky rabbit's feet as well!
 
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