Win Model 70: Finish?

[3Poults]

Hello all,
I've recently purchased a lightly-used Winchester Model 70 Super Grade and have taken it apart for a general cleaning before mounting the scope. This piece was made in 2019 and stamped on the barrel is "Imported by BACO Inc., Morgan, Utah - Made in Portugal by Browning Viana." While the barreled action is out of the stock, I started thinking about a treatment for the wood. Winchester's documentation lists the stock finish very simply, called it "satin." My question is "Satin what?" A call to Winchester yesterday provided no additional details. The finish appears to be some kind of satin poly.
While the finish is in perfect condition, what happens when I scratch or gouge it with use? What is the correct material to apply? Ideally, I'd like to strip the finish and re-do it completely with a home brew mix that provides the beauty, easy maintenance and repairability of oil, but with added water/moisture resistance. I have no time to do that now - I'm simply curious as to what the finish is and is there anything I can or should put on it to "feed/nourish" the wood. What material would be "compatible?" Any input from you Model 70 experts would be most appreciated! Thanks and good weekend to all!

 

[stringnut]

Whatever Winchester uses is going to be an industrial grade finish that you simply cannot get. Likely it is a type of polyurethane which means that it is a mixture of more than one urethane. All are technically synthetic varnishes. The all tend to bond quite well to previously applied urethanes or polyurethane. The upside of this is that any that matches the gloss level , of the original finish, may be useful for small repairs.

Switching finishes is a different story. Urethane finishes are very durable, and thus, are hard to remove completely. Finishes penetrate the wood to a certain extent. It is possible that to use an oil type finish a lot of wood would have to be removed to allow it to penetrate. A professional woodworker would be the person to consult about this.

Nothing nourishes wood in spite of all claims to the contrary. No wax or polish will add protection to a poly finish. Wax is very soft and just about everything takes it off eventually. Sweat , water, sunlight etc. Some waxes and polishes can actually harm the wood or your finish. It can add some shine and is hide minor defects, but, that is about it. Over oil finishes a good wax can add a bit of protection and helps act as a sealer.

There several good books about finishes out there. Mostly what I learned from them is how little I know about finishes. Also learned that refinishing is an art form in itself. If you get to point where you need a complete refinish you may want to consult an expert. It is pretty hard to get to that point. Since it is a super grade purchasing a synthetic stock for particularly abusive conditions may be the way to go.

 

[3Poults]

Hi stringnut - thank you for your very thoughtful reply. For now, I'll do nothing. The finish, while not my preference, is about as nicely done as one can expect for that type of finish. For now I'll just put the rifle back together and move on to mounting the scope.

I'm a total neophyte at finishing guns, but I've re-done my Auto-5's, a Ruger M77 .22 Hornet and my old Marlin Glenfield .22. I simply followed the directions from a very generous guy on one of the shotgun forums who seemed to be "the man" when it came to refinishing Auto-5's. The goal for his finish was to, as best possible, combine the beauty and easy repairability of hand-rubbed oil with the water resistance of urethane. The recipe is a 50/50 blend of tung oil and oil-based spar varnish, thinned with mineral spirits. I must say I'm thrilled with the results on my guns. It was a real labor of love to strip the finishes, re-cut the checkering and then refinish, but now those guns all look great and feel like they're truly "mine." I'd love to do the same with this M70 super grade but simply don't have the time to take that on now. To your point about the difficulty of completely removing the polyurethane, maybe I never will. Maybe somewhere down the road when my kids are out and on their own! One thing's for sure, if I ever take it on, I'll do plenty of research first. Thank you again for your time and efforts in responding!

 

[tark]

Maybe Gunny will weigh in. He is kinda sorta our resident expert on restoring/ refinishing gun stocks. I think he is retired now and we don't hear from him as often as we used to.

Anyway, welcome to the forum.

 

[stringnut]

If you can cut checkering and your past results have been good you are likely good to go. However , I have found the couple of Ruger stocks I have refinished to be very easy to strip. If you do try to strip the model 70 try the barrel channel first . This is make sure you don’t end up with gooey mess that seems impossible to remove. You can probably figure out why I say this. It was’t on a gun. It was only a few weeks that my cousin wouldn’t speak to me. Everyone can do with a folding table for a few weeks lol. Just pointing out that industrial finishes can be tricky.

Also , remember that refinishing the stock will drop the value by about 30%. If it is a forever gun then go for it. If you even think you may sell it you probably want to hold off. As it sounds like it will be a few years before you the time you can flip flop all you want without guilt.

 

[BigBlue 94]

I agree that its likely a polyurethane. It is the toughest thing shy of an epoxy for a finish.

The biggest thing is to determine for touch up if it is oil or water based. Oil base has a yellow hue and will continue to yellow over time. It yellows faster in the dark. Water based is generally nearly clear, and do not yellow over time.

To touch up, thin it down a bit and apply. Then squeegee any off the high spots. Repeat with un-thinned.

 

[citizenconn]

Ballistol. That is all. Let the hating begin. Mmmmm, what's that unique smell?

 

[Barnfixer]

Like bigblue said, oil based yellows and is harder to blend in later on. I like water based polys, clear, better for blending blemishes, no smell and ez cleanup. There’s also a oil modified water based poly that is nice to work with. I also do base coats in gloss and finish coats in desired finish, flat, satin, semi-gloss. Dull finishes have deadeners in them that doesn’t allow the wood grain to show through as well, gloss has no deadeners so you get a more transparent finish. I’ve done one with butcher block sealer as a experiment, working ok so far.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Like bigblue said, oil based yellows and is harder to blend in later on. I like water based polys, clear, better for blending blemishes, no smell and ez cleanup. There’s also a oil modified water based poly that is nice to work with. I also do base coats in gloss and finish coats in desired finish, flat, satin, semi-gloss. Dull finishes have deadeners in them that doesn’t allow the wood grain to show through as well, gloss has no deadeners so you get a more transparent finish. I’ve done one with butcher block sealer as a experiment, working ok so far.

Oil modified acrylics are usually a synthetic oil and have minimal or no yellowing. Old Masters brand Master's Armor is a great acrylic product with an optional catalyst to harden it even farther. It is tough as nails.

Gloss base coats with a low lustre or satin final coat will give the finish a very deep look. Like you could fall into it.

Our 100% acrylic poly comes in a flat. It is as you say, cloudy, compared to a gloss. Its nigh impossible to get it thin enough to minimize the cloudiness.