Winchester 1300 Defender 8 shots Blonde stock
- Thread starter nathan
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Yeah, according to some. Plastic mag tube throats, aluminum receivers, and overall pretty cheaply made. Confidentially the 8 shot defender mag tube is probably worth about $150 alone. 
IME they are good shotguns and fun to shoot.
IME they are good shotguns and fun to shoot.
adcoch1
Member
Yup, total junk. And I will buy all of them I can find to save the rest of you from inferior shotguns... Just Kidding! I personally love 1300s and my brother's 8 shot is what started me on them. They are silky smooth actions, short throw to cycle and just pleasing to the eye. Better than Mossburg or a Remington 870? Not sure, but way nicer to use IMHO.Yeah, according to some. Plastic mag tube throats, aluminum receivers, and overall pretty cheaply made. Confidentially the 8 shot defender mag tube is probably worth about $150 alone.
IME they are good shotguns and fun to shoot.
SlowFuse
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1300 fan here. I like the "assisted" open action and mine just fits me right.
bannockburn
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Love my 20 gauge Model 1300! Recently added a 22" vent rib barrel for hunting upland game and an 18" barrel for home defense.
Virginian
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I't's not "according to some", it's fact with the plastic parts. A few guys who "love theirs" won't change that. The 1200 went to the 1300, then the Speed Pump, and now the Turkish made SXP. Over the same span the Mossberg and the Remington have made zero design changes. There is a reason for that. The 1300s actually feel good and point well in my opinion. If you have one and like it I am happy for you, but I would not advise someone to buy one.
This is not accurate. The 500 series started out with a single action, then went to two action bars. They also redesigned the trigger guard front "tabs" and reshaped the cuts in the receiver that they engage due to many failures. Hell, the entire 590 series could be seen as a "redesign" of the 500 to have desirable features like the clean out mag tube and metal safety/trigger guard.
The 870 has the famous "flexi-tab" upgrade for old guns and was a design change specifically done to overcome a problem that, while not necessarily common, was/is real. Additionally, as of the past few years, Remington has taken a beating over the 870 having rough chambers causing failures to extract. While not a design problem, it does speak to known manufacturing issues with a gun that had previously always had a sterling reputation.
Realistically, the differences between the 1200 and 1300 are minimal at best and the vast majority of the parts are interchangeable. In fact, the only real difference that I am aware of is the way the bolt and bolt slide bridge interact. On the 1200 there is a screw that holds them together and needs to be removed to get the bolt out, on the 1300 the screw is eliminated. Regarding the rest of the iterations of the gun, you can hardly blame it's design for the failure of Winchester or US Repeating Arms or anything else. It is a very clever and particularly strong design. Lastly, the plastic mag tube throats aren't so problematic that they prevent several hundred thousand, or more, of these guns to be used on a continuous basis since 1964, including by the US military.
So if you like the gun, $200 doesn't sound too outrageous.
Ironicaintit
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If it werent for the internet, i wouldnt even know that my 1300 Defender isnt as good as the others. To my hands at least, it feels better and has a faster action than the 870 (my prior favorite, not counting the model 12)
$200? Sold!
$200? Sold!
Virginian
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You can tout the wonders of the Winchester 1200/1300s to the high heavens forever, but many thousands of knowledgeable gun people will never agree with you.
Deog
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Typical Internet , there is always fanboys of a certain co, and will downgrade what goes against there way of thought.
I have them all, Remington, 870, mossberg 500, mossberg 590, Winchester 1300 defender.
I like them all, the Winchester is smoother then the others for sure. 2 bills, go get it.
I have them all, Remington, 870, mossberg 500, mossberg 590, Winchester 1300 defender.
I like them all, the Winchester is smoother then the others for sure. 2 bills, go get it.
Virginian
Member
Fanboy is a two way street.
I do not base my conclusions on internet rumors. I sold guns for many years. I can only remember two Mossbergs with issues out of the box, and one Remington. All were quickly resolved. After numerous issues, most NOT easily solved, I would no longer order a Winchester for someone. I was in it to make money so I did not make that decision lightly.
There used to be a Winchester Trap and Skeet range near me. A friend worked there. You could rent guns. They had a cardboard barrel in back and they would put broken guns in that and when it got full they would send them all back to Winchester for repair. 1400s and 1200s as I recall. I can only ever remember hearing of one 101 with any kind of issue. That barrel used to fill up frighteningly quickly.
I am not a fan of Winchester Model 12s, or the Ithaca 37s, or the Mossberg 500s, or the Browning BPS, or the old High Standards, but I would not try to dissuade someone who did like them from buying one because of any known problem issues. All are very good guns. I had three BPSs that never missed a beat, but I could never grow to love bottom only loading.
I regret my error regarding changes to the 500 action. Though I have shot many I have never owned one and I forgot. I do not consider the Flex-Tab a significant modification at all. All they did was reshape a couple of pieces to increase clearance between the bolt and carrier so people who incorrectly loaded their gun would not have a tied up gun. The parts are 100% interchangeable as a group. If you consider that a big design change I really don't care.
If it's any consolation, it appears FN may have finally gotten things right with the SXP.
I do not base my conclusions on internet rumors. I sold guns for many years. I can only remember two Mossbergs with issues out of the box, and one Remington. All were quickly resolved. After numerous issues, most NOT easily solved, I would no longer order a Winchester for someone. I was in it to make money so I did not make that decision lightly.
There used to be a Winchester Trap and Skeet range near me. A friend worked there. You could rent guns. They had a cardboard barrel in back and they would put broken guns in that and when it got full they would send them all back to Winchester for repair. 1400s and 1200s as I recall. I can only ever remember hearing of one 101 with any kind of issue. That barrel used to fill up frighteningly quickly.
I am not a fan of Winchester Model 12s, or the Ithaca 37s, or the Mossberg 500s, or the Browning BPS, or the old High Standards, but I would not try to dissuade someone who did like them from buying one because of any known problem issues. All are very good guns. I had three BPSs that never missed a beat, but I could never grow to love bottom only loading.
I regret my error regarding changes to the 500 action. Though I have shot many I have never owned one and I forgot. I do not consider the Flex-Tab a significant modification at all. All they did was reshape a couple of pieces to increase clearance between the bolt and carrier so people who incorrectly loaded their gun would not have a tied up gun. The parts are 100% interchangeable as a group. If you consider that a big design change I really don't care.
If it's any consolation, it appears FN may have finally gotten things right with the SXP.
Almost all of the commonly available pumps are very serviceable. The difference between best to worst is small and mostly personal preference. I've owned most of them including a 1300. It would be in the bottom half if I listed them in order of my preference. But I'd feel pretty confident it would work when needed.
Never tried a 1300, but I like my SXP way more than a Mossberg 500 and a Benelli Nova I have shot. To be completely honest, I must admit suspecting my friends to not have cleaned these shotguns as thoroughly as I did mine when they got them. However, I doubt they would have been as smooth even if they had.
I have a winchester 1400 from 1965 that has the same plastic feed throat others mention. It's the 2 piece version and I didn't even know they were and issue till I found a like new 1300 defender at my LGS for $200+ tax. My winchester runs flawlessly and I've pounded squirls and clays with it. No telling how many shells went through it before me.
From what I gather, the plastic feed throats are damaged when certain aggressive cleaning solvents are used on them. They get brittle and crack. The problem is these parts are now obsolete and hard to find. If you are able to find one, it has to be replaced by a gunsmith as the feed tube is pressed in. That is unless you are savvy with that sort of thing. For that reason I opted to purchase a LN mossberg 500 for $150. The mossberg is still being produced and every part can be replaced by the home diyer which can't be said for the winchester or 870 (pinned ejector).
From what I gather, the plastic feed throats are damaged when certain aggressive cleaning solvents are used on them. They get brittle and crack. The problem is these parts are now obsolete and hard to find. If you are able to find one, it has to be replaced by a gunsmith as the feed tube is pressed in. That is unless you are savvy with that sort of thing. For that reason I opted to purchase a LN mossberg 500 for $150. The mossberg is still being produced and every part can be replaced by the home diyer which can't be said for the winchester or 870 (pinned ejector).
Virginian
Member
One can replace the ejector on an 870, or change it from 2-3/4" to 3", without replacing the rivets and refinishing the receiver.
I can assure you friend, I'm not a fanboy of any design and if I was, it would be for the 870 since the 5 that I currently have comprise the largest group of a single model of any firearm that I currently own.
I edited what you said for brevity only. That being said, while you may not base your conclusions on "internet rumors", you seem to think that everyone else does. You represent your anecdotal experience as an accurate representation of a particular design while others anecdotal experience with the same design, being the opposite of yours, must be "internet rumors."
Okay. I'm a fan of them all and wouldn't feel short changed having to carry or use any of them. While they may not be a first choice for many, they are certainly serviceable, just like the Winchester 1200/1300 design.
Your error was just that, an error. We all forget things, I know I certainly do. I was just pointing out that what you said was not accurate. Regarding the Flex-Tab, your statement was:
Whether you feel it's a "significant" change or not is irrelevant. It is a design change, which disproves your assertion. Regarding your level of care, I share your sentiment. As for the SXP, it's not a consolation to me, but given enough money I'd gladly own and shoot one with little fear of problems, just like a 1200/1300.
And with that, I'm out of this thread. Thanks for the lively discussion but it's obviously swayed way off topic for you and I both and more importantly, for the OP.
If memory serves correct, the Mossberg 500 action was changed from a single action bar to twin action bars in 1970.
Design change?
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