Winchester Large Pistol Primers (Bad Lot DBL594G?!)

[toecutter]

So I've been running the ammo load today, and I have been having some problems with high primers (a not-uncommon, but easily fixed issue). I made the normal adjustments but found the problem was not getting any better. I loaded approximately 2000 rounds with a high primer occuring approximately 1 in 5. Trying to reset the high primers in an RCBS bench priming tool did not fix it, in fact it made it worse. (flattening, and bulging the sides of the primer)

I spent some time measuring everything (the primer pockets, the primers, the machine). I'm running brand new starline brass and everything mic'ed out to the proper dimensions.

On a hunch, I ran out the rest of the primers I had in the machine and switched to a different lot (DCL611G) which performed flawlessly (they were too deep from the previous primer setting, but that was an easy fix).

So, in short, I'm looking to see if anyone else is having this problem. I talked to my coworker who apparently had a similar problem running the same lot of primers on a dillon 1050. I am going to call winchester tomorrow and see if they know what is going on. It seems the affected lot DBL594G may have been over-annealed, resulting in brass cups that are too soft, and instead of going into the pocket, bulge over and turn into a rivet that is impossible to seat.

 

[sourdough44]

FYI, I recently primed some Starline 45 Schofield brass, with LP primers. I noticed the primers were VERY tight compared to some other 45 Colt brass I had. They were almost to the point where I wanted to ream them out some. In my case it was the starline brass and not a bad batch of primers.

 

[MAXM]

Someone, knows, please, how to decypher the lot code WW uses for their primers?

TIA ,
Maxm

 

[steve4102]

I ran out the rest of the primers I had in the machine and switched to a different lot (DCL611G) which performed flawlessly (they were too deep from the previous primer setting, but that was an easy fix).

How can they be "too deep"? They should be seated till they bottom out in the primer pocket.

 

[loadedround]

I had a similar problem with Winchester Shotshell primers several years ago. I called Winchester they requested that I them send samples of the defective primers. Within two weeks I had a letter back from them and a rather generous package of replacement primers. However, YMMV.

 

[Sapper771]

What is "high primers" ? Sorry, I have never heard of the term. Thanks.

 

[8emem]

Couple of weeks ago I was priming Remington 45 Auto Rim cases with a Lee hand primer using Winchester WLP. I had a devil of a time getting the primers to seat at the proper depth. None of the primers were crushed or disfigured, but with the amount of force I had to use I wonder if I didn't fracture the priming compound inside. I wouldn't be shocked if some of them failed to fire. After 200 cases I switched to CCI LP and had no problems. Then yesterday I started a batch of .45 Colt using Winchester cases and the same WLP primers. No problems.

 

[LiveLife]

What is "high primers" ? Sorry, I have never heard of the term.

Perhaps primers not seated fully and sticking above the case bottom?

 

[medalguy]

Primers should always be seated about .003 below the surface of the case head. A high primer would be anything seated less than .003 deep or actually sticking above the edge of the case. This can cause all kinds of problems including out-of-battery detonation (known as a KABOOM!)

 

[ReloaderFred]

For clarification, the Ammo Load is an automatic loading machine run by an electric motor. It's an inline machine, with everything moving from left to right. I ran one for almost 3 years back in the late 1970's to load all of our department's practice ammunition.

steve4102,

This machine does everything automatically, and "with vigor". If you set the priming punch to push the primer into the pocket too far, it doesn't stop when the primer bottoms out. It pushes until it physically can't go any farther, thereby crushing the primer into the primer pocket.

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[toecutter]

Again, I measured all of the primer pockets and found them to be in spec, this is brand new starline .45LC brass, the pockets were of similar (within .0005) of other lots of brass I already had on the prod floor.

It seems what happened is these primer cups may have been annealed too much (which makes them too soft to keep shape during insertion). A high primer is a primer that's seated above the edge of the case, in wheel guns this can cause the cylinder to jam, in automatics it can cause a slam fire, or an out of battery fire. Both are bad situations.

A properly set primer is .002-.005" below the base of the case. (usually about .003" is the desired depth) If you are setting the primers too deep, they can be .005-.008 and sometimes deeper. For most reloading situations this is difficult to do, however, both the dillon 1050, and the ammo load will do this without issue if the punches are set incorrectly.

I will admit, this problem most likely affects commercial loaders more than the average guy out there. However based on what I have seen here, this problem is likely to affect everyone trying to load these primers, they are simply too soft.