Zastava PAP Vs. Saiga Vs. WASR

[Nick5182]

I'm looking for a decent range/ throw-around AK-style rifle for range use. I'm only looking to spend around 500. I'd like the rifle to be able to accept hi-cap mags.

The three I've narrowed it down to are the EAA/ Zastava PAP rifle: http://www.gunforall.com/shopcart/mcartfree/product.asp?intProdID=160428

The CIA WASR-10: https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/40093

and the RAA Saiga: http://www.midwesthuntersoutlet.com/item.aspx?PID=62548&w=PQ+JDyOLrQE=

The EAA/ Zastava, I know next to nothing about. I have experience with EAA firearm's witness model, and am very impressed. I have no hands on experience with anything from their Zastava line of firearms, and was wondering if anyone knows about this. Since the rifle is imported, I'm sure that I'd have to convert it to be 922(r) compliant to use Hi-cap mags. Does anyone know if standard AK surplus mags will fit in this rifle, and if not, does anyone make Hi-cap mags for this rifle?

The WASR-10 has mixed reviews, some good some bad. The main thing with them is quality (front sights being canted, receivers coming apart, loose magazines, bolts not going into battery all the way, etc...) and I want something that I won't have to worry about those things.

When it comes to the Saiga, there doesn't seem to be enough good said about them. They are Russian made by Ihzmash and seem to be of great quality. The only thing is the conversion takes a decent amount of time, effort, and money to do, consisting of altering the receiver and whatnot, and I'd really like to have a complete rifle from the get-go.

The two I've really narrowed it down to are the Saiga and the Zastava, but I am keeping the WASR in mind. I don't think converting the Zastava will be as difficult as the Saiga (since the trigger is already directly behind the mag release), and it also comes with a detachable optics mount.

Since they are all roughly the same price, the decision is particularly difficult.

I'd like any input i can get regarding each weapon (opinions are welcome too).

Thanks,
-Nick

 

[ijosef]

Wow, I'd never heard of the EAA/Zastava until now. I'm interested in more info on these as well.

EDIT: I found this tidbit of information on them:
The rifles are good quality. The barrels are not chrome lined. They can't really be converted to double stack mags due to the way they are made. They would really have to be butchered to convert them. The rear of the receiver is angle cut and different from other angle cut AK's. The threads for the pistol grip are drilled out and a large wood screw is used for the thumb hole stock in place of the pistol grip screw. The single stack magazines are plastic and not many spares available. Other steel single stacks will fit or can be made to fit. The Romanian single stack mags look to be the best / closest fit. The pistol grip mount is riveted in place and could be changed for a Yugoslavian pistol grip mount with rivets or maybe screws. The bolt, bullet guide, magwell and plates welded inside the receiver make double stack conversion extremely difficult and not worth it. It is a nice single stack mag rifle though. Good price. Buy Romanian and other steel single magazines for it.

 

[Nick5182]

It kind of sucks that the Zastava is only single-stack, but I'm glad to hear they're good quality. I'm leaning more toward the Saiga now. The conversion to pistol grip wouldn't be too bad, but I'd go with a tapco stock and leave the trigger assembly where it's at.

 

[Hammerhead6814]

Buy the Saiga and convert it. It can be done for well under $500. The money you save can be used to buy ammo.

 

[Nick5182]

That's what I'm thinking. I see that surefire mags saiga mags that are Hi-cap, and I wouldn't have to convert standard mags or the mag well of the rifle to use them.

 

[-v-]

+1 for Buy a Saiga and convert it. You will be much happier. The EEA/Zastava offering looks to be too shy on features and accessories for it to seem worthwhile.

WASRs are generally OK if you can examine one in person. Sight unseens, I would be a hair hesitant to buy one, though.

 

[aztruth]

I have taken my Zastava PAP apart and would like to clear up a couple of details above. The thumbhole stock is NOT riveted on. It's bolted on with a single bolt through the stock and into the rear of the receiver ala yugo style. The pistol grip nut is NOT drilled out - it is threaded. There is a screw that goes through the hole into the composite stock. Modifying the receiver would be a moderate effort. Open up the receiver to double stack specs by dremeling a plate welded top and bottom only inside the receiver. The bottom mount point of the plate would re removed with the expansion of the receiver for double stack anyway and the top weld is out in the open with rifle disassembled. OK that said, the Zastava PAP is one of the highest quality built AK type rifles I have seen and I have had a few... still do. All parts are brand new not salvaged and the trigger group is crisp. The chrome lined barrel or lack of it is not an issue unless you plan on converting it to full-auto. Otherwise it's nice to have but not a major flaw.

Just my input for clarification.

Here is a link to a converted Zastava PAP with lots of pictures. They did a nice job!

http://www.ak47.net/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=122&t=755188

 

[sarduy]

just get a wasr-10 from classicarms.us for 389.00 and call it a day, or... save some money and get an arsenal ak47...... same gun better finish and details.

 

[aztruth]

If you are buying on price alone then buy the wasr 10. I have seen the mixed reviews and would want to actually inspect the rifle before spending any amount on one... CIA does not have the best reputation for quality. Another very good AK type rifle in the lower price range is the IO Inc AK47-C. I have one and am pleased with its overall quality. It is completely built in the USA with USA parts not imported parts kits. Check out the link below. I picked mine up for around $450. OTD through Davidson's gallery-of-guns.

http://www.ioinc.us/

 

[DMK]

You can get the Saiga for quite a bit cheaper here:

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/ak_firearms.aspx

Info about converting them here:

http://forum.saiga-12.com/

 

[DSAPT9]

Check out these all ready converted Saiga’s from Arsenal. I recently got rid of my AR15s and mini 14s and converted to the SGL20s. Nice looking well made firearms. So far the best production AK I have found. They run around 650 in my area. I know that is high compared to the WASR 10 but it is a much cleaner firearm.

http://www.arsenalinc.com/sgl20.htm

 

[glshop20]

I just picked one up and I am very impressed with the quality. It seems that any rifle "YUGO" made is of good quality and value. I understand you dislike of a 10 round mag. but depending on where you live it can be less of a problem. I (live in NJ by need not choice) and this limits any "AK" type rifle severely. I am not quite sure what the big deal is about "MAG" capacity except htat is is another stupid law that violates your rights. If you are able to use an "AK" for hunting 10 rounds should be plenty. If you like making a lot of noise, shoot of large packs of fire-crackers. This will save you lots of money.