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Can we put an end to...

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Ragnar Danneskjold, Oct 17, 2010.

  1. Ragnar Danneskjold

    Ragnar Danneskjold Well-Known Member

    People saying "if you don't think caliber X is good for ____, than why don't you volunteer to get shot with it" or other variations on that theme? That sentiment seems to come up over and over, especially when you have people defending their choice of a low end caliber like .22 and others for CCW. That is a terrible standard for any sort of caliber choice. As a poster noted on another thread, I wouldn't volunteer to get shot with a pellet gun, but that doesn't mean a Crosman air pistol from Wal Mart is a good CCW choice.

    Someone not wanting to get shot with caliber X does not mean that caliber will effectively stop a deadly threat. Please, stop using that as an excuse.
  2. Justin

    Justin Moderator Staff Member

    I don't know about a moratorium on that particular line of thinking.

    After all, seeing someone spout that particular line is kind of like a sign saying "Do not take this person seriously. Ever."
  3. mbogo

    mbogo Well-Known Member

    If you put an end to people saying that, how would you know when you were dealing with an idiot? :D

  4. mack

    mack Well-Known Member

    Hey, if you don't think .22lr is an adequate stopper then why don't you volunteer to get shot with it? The fact is that more people who die from being shot with a .22lr - die from being shot with a .22lr than any other cartridge. The .22lr shot out of a 1911 with a .22lr conversion kit will be just as lethal as any other .22lr. And the fact remains that the elite of the US military still often choose to use the 1911 platform. The accuracy and power of the .22lr is almost unmatched and legendary - it is a known fact that Russian tanks have been taken out by shooting a .22lr down the barrel of the tanks main gun thereby exploding the chambered tank round and exploding the tank.

    And there is a reason that the .22lr is the cartridge of choice for professional assassins - because it travels faster than the speed of sound and is therefore silent.

    Any self-defense expert - if they are worth their salt - will tell you that they would rather carry a gun chambered in .22lr for self-defense over carrying any other caliber of ammo without a gun.

    Finally, the .22lr for years was the standard for slaughtering farm animals sent to slaughter - including 2,000 lb cattle - with that kind of stopping power it is easily a match for Grizzlies or any other predator - animal or human.
  5. writerinmo

    writerinmo Well-Known Member

    Mack, you really should post a disclaimer on posts like these for those of us on cold medications... I had to reread it like five times to make sure what my brain was telling me it said was actually what you had written! Love it...
  6. Jbabbler

    Jbabbler Well-Known Member

    Ok, but only if we can ban "I would never trust my life to a gun that only cost $XXX.00 "
  7. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer member

    I always find the front sight prevents me from jamming the .22 far enough up their nostril to be effective. I'd take the front sight off but we all know sight picture is everything!
  8. herkyguy

    herkyguy Well-Known Member

    let's not forget that long range performance of the mighty .22lr. I know for a fact that it shoots perfectly straight out to 784 yards before dropping at all and it is too small to be affected by wind but still big enough to vaporize cattle. another reason snipers exclusively use the .22lr.
  9. writerinmo

    writerinmo Well-Known Member

    Dont forget that the soft lead melts at super-sonic speed, destroying any tell-tale markings that could be used to trace it back to the weapon.
  10. mack

    mack Well-Known Member

    Jbabble wrote: "Ok, but only if we can ban "I would never trust my life to a gun that only cost $XXX.00 " "

    Oh come on now - you can't be serious - life is priceless - that is why I have never paid less than 1,000 dollars or more for any of the hipoints, jennings, of davis firearms that I carry for self-defense. Also regardless of the firearm you should only use ammo for self-defense that you have already shot out of the gun and therefore know will function properly - that is why I always reload all my carry ammo - even though it is a pain to dig those bullets out of the berm.
  11. daorhgih

    daorhgih member

    Excellent thread!!

    Best humor I've seen since John Browning came out of the gave to straighten out good ole' Gaston Glock. Is there any way to work them in here??
  12. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

    I would love to see that mythbusters episode!
  13. mack

    mack Well-Known Member

    daorhgih: "Best humor I've seen since John Browning came out of the grave to straighten out good ole' Gaston Glock. Is there any way to work them in here??"

    Please do not be disrespectful or disingenuous - it is a well known apocryphal fact that Gaston Glock is the unclaimed son of John Moses Browning - as Glock’s mothers family was not accepting of their daughter being married to a man who already had multiple wives in the Mormon tradition of polygamy- they therefore married her to a second husband to cover up the fact she was already married. That fact is substantiated by even a cursory examination of the life of Gaston Glock and a comparison of the Browning Hi-power and the Glock pistols.

    The facts - both Browning and Glock have designed and produced guns - both Browning and Glock designed pistols - both the Hi-power and the Glock were originally chambered in 9mm - both pistols have hi-capacity magazines - both pistols are or have been used widely around the world. Sure some people say - but what about the 1911 - well of course the answer is obvious - the 1911 chambered in 45acp is considered perfection in a combat pistol - John Browning died before he could perfect the Hi-power and its design had to be finished by another designer who did a great job - but not a perfect job - therefore it was up to Gaston Glock to perfect it and thus the Glock 17 - the worlds first perfect pistol in 9mm.

    I wish more posters here would be respectful of the facts and the truth - I only make up facts and truth that I can verify.
  14. Jbabbler

    Jbabbler Well-Known Member

    True, I always carry pre-expanded JHP's. Unfortunately I have to shoot 70gr .32's from my 50 G.I. to do it but I know I'll never have to worry about expansion.

    At the last gun show I saw a vendor with some Keltec P11's for $199.00 I would never trust my life to a $199 gun so I offered him $750 for it. He resisted, we haggled, I walked away and pretended to be disgusted. Later, as I walked by on my way to the door, he motioned me over and we worked a deal. In the end I got it for $725 out the door. Not quite what I was hoping but still better than the original price.
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2010
  15. smartshot

    smartshot Well-Known Member

    yeah man, this conversation is weird
  16. Carter

    Carter Well-Known Member

    I would love to hear Mack's "facts" on the AR-15 vs AK debate. :D :evil:

    I've seen a pellet gun take down a boar/pig with a good shot to the head. Wouldn't carry it for SD, wouldn't wanna be shot with it either.
    Personally, I don't see why people get so worked up over caliber wars. It doesn't effect someone personally, unless you have highly over worked feelings that a talk show wouldn't even want to touch.

    I second this ban...except for those who wish to show their stupidity.
  17. CraigC

    CraigC Well-Known Member

    IMHO, it's not to be taken literally. More of a "put your money where your mouth is" sort of sentiment. In other words, if you think a particular cartridge is useless for any particular task, or that a particular firearm is only effective within a certain range, volunteer.
  18. mack

    mack Well-Known Member

    Jbabbler - I feel your pain. I too have a Kel-tec P11 - sure it was reliable out of the box - sure I could put all the rounds in the ten ring from seven yards - sure it was concealable and light weight - but I was not so much a fool as to trust my life to it. Unfortunately, I had bought my P11 from a wholesaler at list price and was unable to haggle as you did. But there is a simple but brillant solution - I pawned it - and then insisted on paying one grand to get it out of hock. At first the pawnbroker thought I was nuts - but I explained the reason for doing so and then he was very helpful and even showed me a lot of other high dollar hipoints, jennings, and davis pistols.
  19. Jbabbler

    Jbabbler Well-Known Member


    ................ Nope. :)
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 17, 2010
  20. MrWesson

    MrWesson Well-Known Member

    I want to carry a sling shot.. you say its not adequate let me shoot you in the forehead with a rock.. I'm right!

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