Elk hunting with a 223

[berettashotgun]

Legal to hunt deer in Oklahoma with a 22 caliber 55gr bullet (min) from the regs.
Legal firearm for deer -" Rifles: Centerfire rifles firing at least a 55-grain weight soft-nosed or hollow-point bullet and having an overall cartridge case length of 1 1/4 inches or longer"
"Centerfire handguns: Chambered for .24 caliber or larger and 100 grain or heavier soft-nosed bullet having an overall cartridge case length of 1 1/4 inches or longer are legal (.357 or larger) and a minimum barrel length of four (4) inches.
Semi-automatic handguns: Chambered for any centerfire ammunition with a 100-grain or heavier soft-nosed bullet and having a cartridge case size of .40 caliber or larger (includes 10 mm, .357 Sig., and 40 cal. or larger and a minimum barrel length of four (4) inches.
Handguns chambered for any centerfire rifle ammunition: Chambered for any centerfire rifle ammunition using at least a 55-grain soft-nosed bullet and having an overall cartridge case length of 1 1/4 inches or longer and a minimum barrel length of four (4) inches."
Elk regulations- "Gun: Equipment described as legal for deer gun season."
:banghead:We officially have retards doing this. common sense or proofreading ----PLEEEAASE--:banghead:
I think I'll take my 357sig ELK hunting. I'm sure it'll GIT-HER-DONE
We USED to have a minimum 270 for this.
I thought this lady I work with was crazy to take a 30-40 krag ( sweet all original rifle) on a elk hunt, but she said that people were taking 357 mag pistols out there. This is Oklahoma, we ain't got many trees where the elks are, and those trees have seen about a 20year drought in that country. Close isn't likely.
What would you consider the min cal for elk (bulls)
I personally think a min energy or projectile SD and weight should be required.

 

[MCgunner]

The .223 is always brought up because the tacticool crowd want's to kill everything up to brown bear with their AR15s, never mind the .223 is a prairie dog round at best. It's just the way it is. Fortunately, the .308 is available in tacticool guns, even the AR platform, so some of them can has some sense pounded into them. LOL

 

[Ridgerunner665]

Prairie dog round my ...

223 is a fine deer round with good bullets. I'll agree it may be a bit small for elk.

 

[MCgunner]

A bit small? Ya think?

I know .22s can kill Texas deer under a feeder at 40 yards, but reaching out across a New Mexico canyon for a mulie is a little different. It's just not the best choice for an overall deer caliber when you have maybe a hundred better rounds available, lots, anyway. If recoil is your problem, the .243 is light on the shoulder, or the .25-06 even. The .270 is pretty easy on the shoulder and is a good elk caliber to 300 yards. 6.5x55 or 260 Remington are good all around deer/elk choices that don't kick too bad. No reason to go after a deer or elk with a smaller caliber IMHO unless you just can't tear yourself away from the idea of using an AR15.

 

[mgregg85]

minimum for elk? The smallest I would take is my .30x06.

 

[Ridgerunner665]

I've killed 180 lb. Tennessee deer with a 223 at 105 yards...1 shot kill. The key is good bullets. 100 yards or so is about the ethical max for a 223. If you are hunting where the shots are longer, then yes, there are better rounds...but within reason and its capabilities...the 223 is more suited to take deer than a 30-30.

Minimum elk round....270 Win.

 

[redneckrepairs]

Living right across the line from " where the elk are " in OK ( i live in Baca co CO which borders cimmaron i think it is in the panhandle of OK ) i would use the same for elk there as here in CO , my .308 and my 06 both have worked fine for me .

 

[jimmyraythomason]

A .223 is overkill for prarie dogs. While I think it is too light for most deer hunting situations,it is about perfect for coyote and similar sized game/varmits and predators. I can't rationalize why anyone would want to hunt elk with it though.

 

[ArmedBear]

223 is a fine deer round with good bullets.

Depends on the range. 105 yards is a short shot in some places, and a long shot in others.

the 223 is more suited to take deer than a 30-30.

That, it's not.

 

[eliphalet]

World is full of guys hunting with what they shouldn't.

I have seen em walking around with SKS's that still had a bayonet during elk only seasons. My guess is he was using Chinese steel cored FMJ ammo as it was everywhere and cheap then, but I figured it was no use even asking, and just hoped he didn't see any.

The difference between "can be done and should be done" escapes some folks.

Seen elk killed with a CCI Stinger from a 1 5/8" barrel NAA, shot between the eyes after a '06 had cut it's neck bone into, but that doesn't mean it is a good idea to hunut elk with a NAA revolver and Stingers.

 

[MCgunner]

.the 223 is more suited to take deer than a 30-30.

Li'l off topic, but I'll take the .30-30. Even in my 12" contender, it's fantastic on deer/hogs out to 200 yards where it drops below 1000 ft lbs shooting a 150 grain Nosler BT or 140 Barnes X.

 

[plexreticle]

the 223 is more suited to take deer than a 30-30.

 

[learningman]

I think the poor old 223 gets more grief than any other round out there. I've used that round (out of a rifle configuration not an AR platform) to take every thing from Montana mulies on down. Good bullets and placement are key. I would never use one on an elk though. I've seen first hand how far they can travel after being hit by substantially bigger rounds. The 223 has it's place but it's not on an elk hunt. Minimum round for my taste would be a 270 win.

 

[rklessdriver]

With proper shot placement you could kill and Cape Buffalo with a .22LR, but I wouldn't consider the .22LR a Dangerous Game caliber.

I'm a fan of the .223. It has served me and thousands of other Marines well in combat. I have also killed quite a few deer in eastern NC with my Little Weatherby Vanguard VGX in .223. Using either handloaded 60gr Trophy Bonded bullets or the Winchester 64gr PP. Both did a good job and provided quick efficient one shot kills at moderate ranges (50-150yrds). I got some minor jacket fragmentation from some of the Winchesters but the majority of them were expanded and intact lodged in the hide on the oppisite side of the deer, provided I missed any large bones. About the same performance out of the Trophy Bonded 60gr's but I noticed when I compared bullets that had come in contact with heavy bones (ie Spine or Shoulder) the Trophy Bonded bullets were far superior in their weight retention and ability to resist seperating its lead core from its jacket.

I chalk that up to knowing the rifle, the bullets performance and your ability to place a shot where it will do it's job the best. Don't take shots you know are not going to provided you with the optimum ablility to kill that animal cleanly. It's just proper and responsible hunting.

That said; A bigger caliber gives you more lee-way in making the a less than perfect shot and still being able to cleanly kill the animal. Sometimes depending on how big the caliber is A LOT MORE lee-way.

As big of a fan as I am of the .223, I wouldn't dare try one on an ELK or any other animal roughly twice the size of a white tail deer.
Will

 

[MCgunner]

The .223 gets grief from ME because I just think it's stupid to choose such a minimal round on deer when there are so many better rounds available. Why would I buy one? I have a .257 Roberts, a .308 Winchester, and a 7mm Remington Magnum, all of which are better deer calibers, let alone elk, than a .223. .22-250 is popular for deer hunting in Texas and I feel the same way about THAT one, though I know it's taken a lot of deer. 95 percent of those deer were around feeders out of box blinds and stands at under 200 yards. That's kinda the way it's done in Texas, the eastern half anyway. I've also spot and stalked and still hunted. Moving deer deserve overkill in caliber. Shot placement might not be quite ideal. I've knocked deer down running at 50 yards with a liver shot before from a 7 mag. I wouldn't take that shot with a .223. I was a little behind where I intended to place the bullet, but it was still a bang/flop, probably because I was about 3" from the spine and the pressure wave immobilized him, for lack of a better explanation.

BTW, you got big deer in NC. A half ton bull elk would be about 10 times your average Texas buck. ROFL!!!!! Few are that big, but hey, few Texas bucks are over 100 lbs. When you shoot one that dresses 125, you got a real monster. LOL!

 

[Harley Quinn]

Those who argue these items are generally not really to well suited for hunting partners, but here is a tid bit, the 30 carbine is not designed to hunt Elk, some say it is ok, it is more powerful than all the pistol rounds you mentioned. The 223 for Elk? Come on they should have some more respect than that round. Thou I do know a guy who hunted them with his 220 swift and always bagged one (shot placement folks).

Many locations will not allow the use of .223 to hunt Elk. The Hand gun enthusist will usually go for the 44 mag or better. But the distance is a major factor.

270/308/30-06 are ones that are thought of as good ones. 30-30/35/rem. as long as the distance is not over 150 they say. Still on the light side, but they have taken lots of Elk if within the above range. One of the reasons for the 7mm Mag was a step up for Elk. Others will not go with anything smaller than the 300 win mag.

We can go bigger than these and feel good about it. But the ones mentioned have been standbys for years, the heavier bullets are usually preferred.

I would not hunt an Elk with anything like a 223 Total survival mode and stuck out in the wilderness surviving and that is the only gun you have well that might be ok but if I was going to go to the wilderness I would have been carring something a lot more powerful than the 223 in the first place.

 

[leathermanwave]

My brothers were out hunting elk once. And there was about 15 kids and their parents with semi auto .223's. It so happened about 100 head of elk ran in between the row of kids and parents. The parents and kids opened up the the elk ending up shooting at each other. They ended up hitting one elk in the hind legs that the never found. also none of the parents had cow tags so they were shooting illegally.

I have shot two elk with a .270 and they each soaked up 3 round before going down. the one was hit perfectly thru the heart with the first round. The other was hit thru the lung on the 2 shot. They both ran about 150 yards after a vital shot.

I think the .270 to be the minimum for normal elk hunting. A .243 is big enough if you restrict yourselves to bow hunting shots.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

No doubt a .223 with a well placed shot will work, but you really need more gun. You should take into consideration that you're out to make a clean, humane kill. Get a bigger rifle.

 

[moooose102]

i own both a .223 and a 30-30, unless the 30-30 is broke, the .223 will stay in the gun safe during deer season. actually, it'll stay there anyway. because i also have a 300 win mag. but you get my point. a .223 is just to small for an ethical shot UNLESS everthing is perfect! and perfect is very seldom when deer hunting. but, on the other hand, it is leagal in some states to hunt deer with a .25 automatic pistol also. go figure. you just gotta be smarter that the govt. !

 

[Harve Curry]

A .223 bullet is to light weight and frangible of a bullet for the heavy muscle mass and bone of elk. It's made for thin skinned creatures like us.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Get this I hear it's actually legal to hunt big game in some states with patched round ball from a flintlock. What kind of yahoos at the game and fish commission allow such blatantly irresponsible behavior.

EVERYBODY knows the bare minimum should be .338LM for any game weighing over 100lbs


You want retarded here's a retarded REG

IN Arkansas it's illegal during coyote season to use anything larger than 30 caliber. That's right you can blast yotes with a 30-378WBY but a .357 magnum carbine is forbidden.

Top that!

 

[Art Eatman]

I'd sorta hate to be out deer hunting with a .223 and figure "No problem" for the typical average 8-point at maybe 50 to 100 yards: And off at 250 to 300 yards, there's the B&C critter I've dreamed of for decades.

And that's why I don't hunt with a minimum cartridge...

, Art

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

.223 and handguns (.357 sig?), heck NO.

.30-40 Krag, yes, definitely. That's about like .303 brit, which has taken many a moose and elk over the decades cleanly, in my understanding. More oomph than a .30-30 win.

I'd say at a bare minimum, .25 cal should be the min for elk, with a case length at least 55mm long, and bullet weight at least 115 grains (.257 roberts, .25-06, etc.). Personally, my own minimum would be 6.5x55 or .270 win. My actual *choice* would be .30-06 or .35 Whelen.... -ish. If I *were* to hunt elk with a .25-06, I'd limit myself to neck shots only. It's kind of a moot point, though, as those tags are darn near impossible to get, and the private lands cost an arm and leg to hunt on (where the elk are).

Hey, if you like that one, then stew on this one awhile: the regs also say no shot size LARGER than BB may be used on feral hogs on public lands, except during deer season. No, it doesn't say "no shot size SMALLER than BB" - you read it right, it says no shot size LARGER than BB allowed. So birdshot and rimfires are all you can use before/after deer season. No slugs. No buckshot. No centerfires. Sheer unethical lunacy.

Get this I hear it's actually legal to hunt big game in some states with patched round ball from a flintlock. What kind of yahoos at the game and fish commission allow such blatantly irresponsible behavior.

You're trying to be sarcastic/rhetorical, but your point falls completely flat, since patched ball from a flintlock, in the say, .50 cal range, is somewhere on the order of 10-20 times better of a choice than .223. Large heavy bullet for large heavy game - that works. .223 rem, notsomuch.

 

[22-rimfire]

223 for elk, heck no. Have some respect for the game animal. I believe the 270 win may be a bit light for elk at ranges over 100 yds.

 

[eastwood44mag]

Nothing on this continent that can't be killed with a .22 LR. However, just because it CAN be done doesn't mean it SHOULD be done. Death might be 2 weeks later of sepsis....