Duke of Doubt
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It definitely pays to make friends with a pawnbroker.
I tried to buy locally.
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Matt-J2
Member
I try and buy local, or at the local branch of the big chains.(ot many truly local owned shops I'm aware of) At least for firearms, I'm leery of buying something I can't handle first. For other stuff, it's a matter of supply. If you don't have it in stock, I can't very well buy it from you. I may travel to find it, or start going online.
In any case, it has very much to do with the kind of service I get at the store. Treat me like a person, and I'll spend money in your store, even if it costs me a little extra(provided you have things I want). Treat me like a profit margin, or a leech, and you'll only see a penny of mine if it falls out of my pocket, even if you're the only shop that carries X within 100mi. Lucky for me I seldom encounter the latter.
In any case, it has very much to do with the kind of service I get at the store. Treat me like a person, and I'll spend money in your store, even if it costs me a little extra(provided you have things I want). Treat me like a profit margin, or a leech, and you'll only see a penny of mine if it falls out of my pocket, even if you're the only shop that carries X within 100mi. Lucky for me I seldom encounter the latter.
I think most everybody on this site believes in the RKBA.
So what's wrong with a business person charging whatever price they believe is reasonable and fair, in their opinion?
And what's wrong with potential customers choosing what person to do business with, based on price and service and selection and convenience?
Seems to me that everybody made a reasonable choice, some just like to complain more than others.
So what's wrong with a business person charging whatever price they believe is reasonable and fair, in their opinion?
And what's wrong with potential customers choosing what person to do business with, based on price and service and selection and convenience?
Seems to me that everybody made a reasonable choice, some just like to complain more than others.
Impureclient
Member
When I bought my Kahr CW9 I almost bought it online for $400-420 plus $20 shipping and no tax with the FFL transfer being around $35 from a pawn shop. Both of my local gun shops wanted $560.
When I asked if they would match closer to the online price(another gun shop in another state) this one guy gave me the story that he needs to feed his wife and then went on to say that he knows
he has a nice truck outside but he worked hard for it. Outside were two new, jacked up, extra cab, full size diesel trucks which one of belonged to him the other the owner. Now I didn't ask about
the truck he just thought he would throw that in there and somehow try to comfort me that his $50k truck outside was earned the hard way, by standing behind a counter and talking. I almost had
to laugh as I work outside year round doing hard labor in weather from 40 to 100 degrees and drive a Chevy Cavalier. I almost bite to help out the local shops. Then a friend of mine told me he knew
another local pawn shop owner that wasn't such a you know what. He got it from his supplier and sold the gun to me for cost ($350) plus 10%, plus tax, transfer and shipping. Total was $420. He
makes a profit, the 10%, and doesn't have to rape me to make his living. He also drove a nice truck. I think it wouldn't have hurt much for the two dealers by me to come down some but, due to the
scare in everybody right now they know they can take advantage of shoppers who don't research right now. The point is I would look to local first as buying from another state doesn't help your local
economy but, when they cross the line it's time to look elsewhere.
When I asked if they would match closer to the online price(another gun shop in another state) this one guy gave me the story that he needs to feed his wife and then went on to say that he knows
he has a nice truck outside but he worked hard for it. Outside were two new, jacked up, extra cab, full size diesel trucks which one of belonged to him the other the owner. Now I didn't ask about
the truck he just thought he would throw that in there and somehow try to comfort me that his $50k truck outside was earned the hard way, by standing behind a counter and talking. I almost had
to laugh as I work outside year round doing hard labor in weather from 40 to 100 degrees and drive a Chevy Cavalier. I almost bite to help out the local shops. Then a friend of mine told me he knew
another local pawn shop owner that wasn't such a you know what. He got it from his supplier and sold the gun to me for cost ($350) plus 10%, plus tax, transfer and shipping. Total was $420. He
makes a profit, the 10%, and doesn't have to rape me to make his living. He also drove a nice truck. I think it wouldn't have hurt much for the two dealers by me to come down some but, due to the
scare in everybody right now they know they can take advantage of shoppers who don't research right now. The point is I would look to local first as buying from another state doesn't help your local
economy but, when they cross the line it's time to look elsewhere.
rbernie
Contributing Member
Reading comprehension FAIL.
The dealer was going to have to order it. He had no capital investment. He was flipping something, and getting his investment back as soon as he took delivery.
He didn't respect that arrangement, and he lost a sale as a result.
Sux to have a bad business plan. At some point, it *should* hurt.
I have no quarrel supporting my local shops, and making it worth their while to stock stuff for me to fondle and buy. I will pay a premium for that, and I try very hard to give them my business specifically to help keep them going and respect their capital investment. But when they have to order something in for me, I expect that they'll not GOUGE me on the deal.
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Kentucky Jelly
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$2,000 sounds like price gouging to me I would not give him any business either. What model colt was this for? I just saw a colt hbar last night at a local shop for 1300.00. Considerably cheaper than some other local places, but they are using the same distributors.... Guess who would get my business?
Well add me to the list of customers who "whine" about gun shop service.
I stopped by the only gunshop in town here to inquire about their line of safes. Owner guy, rotund and low energy, wouldn't answer my questions about his Fortress Security line of safes with anything inspiring confidence in me. He doesn't know gauge thickness, doesn't know country of manufacture, and told me he'd call me back with some answers. He didn't. After 3 trips into his shop, I ended up ordering a safe online.
That a guy can run a gunshop and make money at it doesn't necessarily reflect on his business acumen and human skill set. I'd bet he's losing a lot of money by his methods, even if his net allows him to continue in the business.
And that I can go somewhere else with my business doesn't in any way mean that the gunshop owner/operator isn't a lazy, egotistical slob who deserves round criticism. Yah, I get the "Free Market" idea, but does the fact that we don't operate under a communistic command economy protect these slugs from customer complaints? By not complaining, we encourage poor service.
I stopped by the only gunshop in town here to inquire about their line of safes. Owner guy, rotund and low energy, wouldn't answer my questions about his Fortress Security line of safes with anything inspiring confidence in me. He doesn't know gauge thickness, doesn't know country of manufacture, and told me he'd call me back with some answers. He didn't. After 3 trips into his shop, I ended up ordering a safe online.
That a guy can run a gunshop and make money at it doesn't necessarily reflect on his business acumen and human skill set. I'd bet he's losing a lot of money by his methods, even if his net allows him to continue in the business.
And that I can go somewhere else with my business doesn't in any way mean that the gunshop owner/operator isn't a lazy, egotistical slob who deserves round criticism. Yah, I get the "Free Market" idea, but does the fact that we don't operate under a communistic command economy protect these slugs from customer complaints? By not complaining, we encourage poor service.
Lone_Gunman
Member
After reading threads like this, its no wonder that so many gun stores go out of business.
Kentucky Jelly
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There are definitely better shops then others. I drive an hour away from 5-6 "local shops" to buy all my new gun's @ Bud's. Not only do they kill everyone on prices, but they are extremely helpful people. I have been to multiple shops that act like they do not care if you spend your money else where.
Impureclient
Member
wrs840, Do you mean that the gun shops change the price tags? All of my local shops have price tags that clearly state the price.
If I went into a store that didn't label prices I would walk out. Ensuring I didn't ever have to pay the "special" PITA rate.
If I went into a store that didn't label prices I would walk out. Ensuring I didn't ever have to pay the "special" PITA rate.
JWF III
Member
Just to clarify (before I make my case), I have never bought a gun from anybody other than a local shop or FTF . So I have never had to go to an FFL for a transfer. Also, everything that I'm about to say only pertains to dealers with storefronts, not the guy that has an FFL and operates out of house.
But, for a gun he can get (in a timely manner), I see no problem with the $100 charge for the transfer. Like has been said, he's in business to make a living. A buyer going somewhere else to get a gun cheaper, and then wants a cheap transfer. A dealer would go broke rather quickly just doing transfers. The dealer has a lot of overhead that has to be paid (each month) before he makes a profit. Think about it this way, if it's a gun that would sell for $2000, the dealer would be making more (than $100) if he ordered it, and sold it. So right there he is losing money in doing the transfer (for $100) instead of making a sell. He has every right to do what it takes to feed his family, just like any one of us. You want to bust his balls, for doing something that he already is losing money on, because of the price.
On the other hand, for a gun that the dealer is unable to get (one of a kind, out of production, etc.), I think that $50 is extremely high for their 5-10 minutes of work. $15 dollars would seem about right, but $25 is fair also.
Wyman
On a side note, not pertaining to anyone in particular. But it's generally easy to tell the people that have never been in business for their self. It's easy to get on a soapbox when you've never been in the other guys shoes.
But, for a gun he can get (in a timely manner), I see no problem with the $100 charge for the transfer. Like has been said, he's in business to make a living. A buyer going somewhere else to get a gun cheaper, and then wants a cheap transfer. A dealer would go broke rather quickly just doing transfers. The dealer has a lot of overhead that has to be paid (each month) before he makes a profit. Think about it this way, if it's a gun that would sell for $2000, the dealer would be making more (than $100) if he ordered it, and sold it. So right there he is losing money in doing the transfer (for $100) instead of making a sell. He has every right to do what it takes to feed his family, just like any one of us. You want to bust his balls, for doing something that he already is losing money on, because of the price.
On the other hand, for a gun that the dealer is unable to get (one of a kind, out of production, etc.), I think that $50 is extremely high for their 5-10 minutes of work. $15 dollars would seem about right, but $25 is fair also.
Wyman
On a side note, not pertaining to anyone in particular. But it's generally easy to tell the people that have never been in business for their self. It's easy to get on a soapbox when you've never been in the other guys shoes.
.
Most stores around here will negotiate price. You can tell which ones they are because their marked prices are a little high. I'm talking about pawnshops and dedicated storefront "Gun Shops", not the big nationals. They don't come down much for the "confrontational" types because they know they're the ones that will be more likely to end-up a "high-maintenance" customer (payment hassles, every other thing is "defective", delays picking up special orders), it's always something...
Even the shops where the marked price is the "real" price are going to set the price if I ask them to order something or especially if I ask them to "find" something for me... The customer is only king in the world of platitudes. It's a two-way street. If I value the shop-owners efforts, they're more likely to value my business and give me "favored client" prices and service.
Les
aka108
Member
I try to buy local. Go to Sportsman's Whse, Wally, and a few others. Never have what I'm looking for so I'm back at Midway, Natchez, Champion and others.
Lonestar.45
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Bingo. Many of my local shops also sell on gunbroker, so the line is blurred.
If a local shop is good, I'll buy there even at a slight premium. If I walk in and they act like they're doing me a favor by showing me something, or they proceed to trash 1911's even though they SELL them and that's what I'm looking at....sorry. I'll do my homework and buy online. If they're charging me a $25 ffl transfer fee to hand over the new Colt AR I bought online, I don't want to hear about how DPMS is just as good (because that's what they sell). No, they're not just as good and I'm not a newbie. I just want them to fill out the paperwork and pocket the $25 they just made for 5 minutes of work and zero hassles other than opening the door for the UPS guy.
colorado_handgunner
Member
What it all comes down to is a business decision for both the buyer and the seller. If the seller feels that his business can receive a benefit by doing transfers, it is his responsibility to set the price based on what his overall cost of doing the transaction married to the reality of pricing in the open market.
Customers must then decide how much service in the transaction they want and pair that to the cost they are willing to pay.
Again, this comes down to a business transaction, and market forces determine prices.
Customers must then decide how much service in the transaction they want and pair that to the cost they are willing to pay.
Again, this comes down to a business transaction, and market forces determine prices.
Ironjarhead
Member
I shopped around in my hometown and found a gunstore that I really enjoy. He sells new and has a pawn shop nextdoor so also sells used. I have seen him take some uninformed "mall ninja" types for all they are worth. I have always found that any "shop" that I go to the sticker price was negotiable. I have also found a jewelry shop that is the same way(gotta keep momma happy about the weapon purchases) If someone will go in there and pay the man $2000 for an AR then more power to him. He knows when I come walking up that I will negotiate untill I'm happy. There have been times when I got a really good deal and there have been times that I came back in a couple of days and paid the price he quoted (always lower than the price on the tag)
I actually think the bargaining is half the reason he's in business. The way I look at it if he didn't mark everything up the way he does he probably wouldn't be able to cut some of us the deals he does.
I actually think the bargaining is half the reason he's in business. The way I look at it if he didn't mark everything up the way he does he probably wouldn't be able to cut some of us the deals he does.
Deanimator
Member
There's a gunstore near here in Brunswick Hills. I bought a Savage 10FP at the Medina gunshow. On the way back I stopped at the shop to try to buy a bridge mount for a scope for the Savage. I'd spent literally hundreds of dollars on range fees alone and hundreds more on ammunition, reloading supplies and accessories at the place before they changed hands. Their "gunsmith" kept trying to sell me two piece mounts that I didn't need or want. He asked me to bring the gun in. He then started giving me a load of crap about buying guns from gunshows. I took my gun and my money and left. On the way out, I ran into the decent guy who ran the co-located training facility. He said, "Hi!" I told him "Bye, for the last time." I've never been back and have been badmouthing them for ten years.
Not long after, I liked the Savage so much, I decided to buy a 110FP in .30-06. I went to the local gunstore in Fremont. His prices weren't cut-rate, but they were reasonable. He would do what he could to help you out within reason. They couldn't get any 110FPs in .30-06 so I special ordered a 112BVSS in .30-06, a better gun with a better stock for more money. I then ordered a Canjar single set trigger through that shop for the gun.
You have an inalienable right to be an ass. I have an inalienable right to give my money to somebody who's not.
Not long after, I liked the Savage so much, I decided to buy a 110FP in .30-06. I went to the local gunstore in Fremont. His prices weren't cut-rate, but they were reasonable. He would do what he could to help you out within reason. They couldn't get any 110FPs in .30-06 so I special ordered a 112BVSS in .30-06, a better gun with a better stock for more money. I then ordered a Canjar single set trigger through that shop for the gun.
You have an inalienable right to be an ass. I have an inalienable right to give my money to somebody who's not.
craig
Member
the fun part about some dealers who sell on gunbroker is how the price changes.
used ruger gp100 listed on gunbroker for $375. go look at gun in shop, price is $450. ask about best price. best price $430.
used daewoo dr200. gunbroker buy it now price $750. best price on gun in store. $840.
new gp100 gunbroker buy it now price $525.
best price in store $580.
new dpms ar. (8-1-08) gunbroker buy it now price $800. best price in store $880.
needless to say bud's guns gets most of my business.
used ruger gp100 listed on gunbroker for $375. go look at gun in shop, price is $450. ask about best price. best price $430.
used daewoo dr200. gunbroker buy it now price $750. best price on gun in store. $840.
new gp100 gunbroker buy it now price $525.
best price in store $580.
new dpms ar. (8-1-08) gunbroker buy it now price $800. best price in store $880.
needless to say bud's guns gets most of my business.
melikesguns
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- Nov 14, 2006
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around her $15 -$50 is the norm. Of couse I also have a shop dealer 30 miles down the road that charges $75, and has $14.00 a box on Wolf 7.62x39!!
Duke of Doubt
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One of my two favorite local shops has a sign: "Prices subject to change depending on customer's attitude." It's quite serious. I get a kick out of watching the proprietor sell or trade the same or similar guns to different customers for wildly variant prices. It's not all attitude, of course. Trading is a good way to get what you want for something the proprietor wants more than you do. So I tend to build up over time a group of guns I get for a steal of a deal too good to pass up even though I rarely shoot them. When I spot a gun I really want, but which isn't a steal of a deal, I bring in the trading group, and swap for a far better deal than if I paid cash, once you figure in how little I paid for the traders.
Lone_Gunman
Member
I don't believe it works that way usually, but OK.
Duke of Doubt
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If your question is directed at me, Lone Gunman, no, as we are trading by mutually agreed consent, and neither of us is trying to rook the other. Once in awhile I get a better than expected deal because of incomplete knowledge of the gun at time of sale (sometimes by both of us), but normally, while we enjoy haggling, and some deals are better than others for me or for he, neither of us ever feels "screwed."
Edit: Your original post asked, "So you're saying you're screwing your dealer?"
Edit: Your original post asked, "So you're saying you're screwing your dealer?"
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