herrwalther
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I don't care one bit WHY open carry was banned at such places. All that matters is their attempt to destroy the 2A. If you see less people carrying, less people will support carrying.
Permit yes/no?
- Thread starter Texasgrillchef
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I don't care one bit WHY open carry was banned at such places. All that matters is their attempt to destroy the 2A. If you see less people carrying, less people will support carrying.
Trunk Monkey
member
The reason stores and other establishments ban open carry is because of people like the idiot in Springfield Missouri who walked into the store carrying a long gun and wearing wearing Tac gear
WheelGunMan
Member
++Sadly you're spot on. Proof that idiots looking for attention abound. He now has his 15 minutes of fame that someday will bring him regrets.
Texasgrillchef
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if that’s truly the case then why isn’t it banned legally? Makes no sense. If the general population didn’t like it, then it would be against the law.
WheelGunMan
Member
I live in the here and now. Not in the "What might happen in the future". When I travel, I want to have the ability to defend myself and my family NOW...that is why I have a concealed carry permit. Besides...when I purchased the handgun it was registered and my name went on a list somewhere stating what gun I bought and where I live. If you come on this and other forums and talk about your guns...you're probably on a list somewhere. I guess one could probably obtain guns via the underground black market, stay off any forums where they are traceable and pray they never come into contact with law enforcement because they're breaking a law that will make them a felon and legal gun ownership darn near impossible. I don't want to live looking over my shoulder all the time.
George P
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Considering the 2A does not matter with private business, your statement is moot. The 2A is between you and your government
Trunk Monkey
member
Oh no, his 15 minutes aren't over yet. They charged him with communicating a terroristic threat for that
Trunk Monkey
member
The general population doesn't like it. Keep pushing the issue and it will be against the law.
It used to be perfectly legal to open carry in City owned buildings in Colorado Springs until a guy named Donald Ortega went to a city council meeting with the shotgun. The third time he did it open carry in City buildings was banned
Trunk Monkey
member
Seeing people open carry doesn't make people support carrying. Any chance we ever had that it would positively influence people was thrown away by the open carry extremists who insisted on carrying long guns to Starbucks
huntsman
Member
I OC before CCW was the law in Ohio. but with CCW carrying a handgun in a motor vehicle is more practical.
so if I never left the state or carried in the city it’ll still be worth the license to carry loaded in the Jeep.
so if I never left the state or carried in the city it’ll still be worth the license to carry loaded in the Jeep.
No permit required for open carry in PA, but I have a concealed carry permit. In PA you can not have a loaded handgun in your car unless you have a permit, so you would have to unload upon entering your car, reload upon exiting, etc.
herrwalther
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Not talking about those folks. Just the people who go to the store with a holstered handgun and not draw any other attention to themselves.
I used to subscribe to the idea that open carry desensitized people to all kinds of carry. While I think the idea is valid in principle, I suspect the problem is not enough people carry at all, much less open. Unless there is sufficient stimulus, it won't have a desensitizing effect. Instead, it will just continue to appear as an obscure, unpopular, unreasonable practice unjustified by mob opinion.
Because open carry is often ill-advised even where it is socially accepted, few people will do it and there's a proportionally greater probability that people will do it for the wrong reasons. So I've changed my mind. Instead of hoping that open carry would normalize all carry, I now think that we should instead hope that concealed carry will continue to have some normalizing effect on all carry, including open carry. Certainly, both concealed and open carry should be protected.
In spite of the egregious infringment embodied in carry "permits," I believe they have done more than anything else to normalize concealed carry. To the majority of people that fail to see that carry is acceptable for all free people, permits give the perception that carry is "acceptable" provided the carrier has a permit. The warped thinking of many people is that a person needs permission for something unfamiliar to them to be acceptable. We see that with other things like service animals. Some people are really determined that a service animal must be "certified" and given permission by some authority to be legitimate, even though US law does not support this idea at all or recognize any certifying authority. We also saw it with "medical marijuana" cards for a while. Basically, the cards gave permission to the holders to do something that most people were conditioned to think of as illegal and illicit. If it was somehow justified by some (medical) authority, then it was acceptable. The remarkable thing is, as un-"certified" and un-"approved" service animals, especially those for invisible disabilities, are given public access, and more people are smoking dope without any kind of permission, the perception that these things are corrupt and illicit may be increasing.
For the record, I'm not a drinker or dope user, but it is a curious requirement for a CCW permit in my state that the permit holder not use dope even though the same state has a statute establishing the lawfulness of recreational use. Now the permit also forbids the use of alcohol, but only while carrying the gun, whereas dope use at any time precludes a person from obtaining or keeping a permit.
While "permission cards" have done a lot to normalize and increase the popularity of concealed carry, they have also reinforced the idea that permission and approval is necessary for legitimacy.
When I visited a Disney property, I realized that they had created a sort of utopia for their guests. More than anything, this utopia consisted of someone other than the guest being responsible for everything.. It's under those conditions that a lot of people feel secure and "happy." Unless this is changed, no amount of desensitization will content them in a world where they must be responsible for themselves. They will certainly want someone else, if not the government, then Google or Apple or Disney, etc. to take all the responsibility, and they will gladly hand over everything that's necessary for them to do so. They fully expect that they will need to be submissive and supplicant and are ready and willing.
Because open carry is often ill-advised even where it is socially accepted, few people will do it and there's a proportionally greater probability that people will do it for the wrong reasons. So I've changed my mind. Instead of hoping that open carry would normalize all carry, I now think that we should instead hope that concealed carry will continue to have some normalizing effect on all carry, including open carry. Certainly, both concealed and open carry should be protected.
In spite of the egregious infringment embodied in carry "permits," I believe they have done more than anything else to normalize concealed carry. To the majority of people that fail to see that carry is acceptable for all free people, permits give the perception that carry is "acceptable" provided the carrier has a permit. The warped thinking of many people is that a person needs permission for something unfamiliar to them to be acceptable. We see that with other things like service animals. Some people are really determined that a service animal must be "certified" and given permission by some authority to be legitimate, even though US law does not support this idea at all or recognize any certifying authority. We also saw it with "medical marijuana" cards for a while. Basically, the cards gave permission to the holders to do something that most people were conditioned to think of as illegal and illicit. If it was somehow justified by some (medical) authority, then it was acceptable. The remarkable thing is, as un-"certified" and un-"approved" service animals, especially those for invisible disabilities, are given public access, and more people are smoking dope without any kind of permission, the perception that these things are corrupt and illicit may be increasing.
For the record, I'm not a drinker or dope user, but it is a curious requirement for a CCW permit in my state that the permit holder not use dope even though the same state has a statute establishing the lawfulness of recreational use. Now the permit also forbids the use of alcohol, but only while carrying the gun, whereas dope use at any time precludes a person from obtaining or keeping a permit.
While "permission cards" have done a lot to normalize and increase the popularity of concealed carry, they have also reinforced the idea that permission and approval is necessary for legitimacy.
When I visited a Disney property, I realized that they had created a sort of utopia for their guests. More than anything, this utopia consisted of someone other than the guest being responsible for everything.. It's under those conditions that a lot of people feel secure and "happy." Unless this is changed, no amount of desensitization will content them in a world where they must be responsible for themselves. They will certainly want someone else, if not the government, then Google or Apple or Disney, etc. to take all the responsibility, and they will gladly hand over everything that's necessary for them to do so. They fully expect that they will need to be submissive and supplicant and are ready and willing.
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Trunk Monkey
member
Nope.
Unfortunately, you don't get to separate the two. Like it or not the extremists have become the face of open carry
herrwalther
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To the news, maybe. To everyone else, I doubt so. In states where open carry is legal, and where large chain companies haven't banned open carry, there are still casual open carriers walking around. Those who do notice, NOTICE they aren't looking for attention. I do believe open carry can be normalized. If the extremists and attention seekers get shut up first. I still see tons of open carriers at Target, Academy, and other spots. Occasionally I ask why they open carry, most of the time is it is more comfortable.
George P
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And other extremists have become the face of NO GUN ownership
Texasgrillchef
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well Texas just past a ew law effective 9-1-19 that city’s can no longer bans guns anywhere on public property other the courthouses, police stations and jails. We have very preemptive laws here in Texas.
Zaydok Allen
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BSA1
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So be it. I fail to see the point of having laws that allow a legal activity but not doing it for fear that by doing so will make it illegal.
Open carry seems to be a bigger issue on discussion forums than in the real world.
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