The Bushmaster
Member
Not sure just what all the fooforah is all about here, but if you are DEAD you sure as hell can't be sued. Don't know 'bout you, but I'd rather be alive. Then worry about being sued...
Self defense and your insurance
- Thread starter DBR
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swinokur
Member
When i got my CCW permit, I added a 2 million dollar umbrella liability policy to my coverage. it runs about $250.00 a year. after reading this thread, I need to go reread it. I may be wasting my money.
The Bushmaster
Member
I believe you left out Missouri on your list...
Zombie
member
Early 2007 list
Zombie:
Thank you very much for the references. In the case of my inquiry to Allstate, I called my local agent and he said he would call their underwriter. He called me back and said he had been informed injury caused to another in self defense would not be covered.
My current carrier is Nationwide Insurance. They will not cover SD. According to my local agent many insurers have changed their policies to address this issue and exclude coverage since the mid 1990s.
Thank you very much for the references. In the case of my inquiry to Allstate, I called my local agent and he said he would call their underwriter. He called me back and said he had been informed injury caused to another in self defense would not be covered.
My current carrier is Nationwide Insurance. They will not cover SD. According to my local agent many insurers have changed their policies to address this issue and exclude coverage since the mid 1990s.
The Bushmaster:
The "fooforah" is if I am paying for high personal injury liability limits or an umbrella because I'd like some protection "in the gravest extreme" I want to know it is really there. I thought it was but it wasn't!
The "fooforah" is if I am paying for high personal injury liability limits or an umbrella because I'd like some protection "in the gravest extreme" I want to know it is really there. I thought it was but it wasn't!
DAVIDSDIVAD
member
I thought I'd posted this along with my first post in this thread.
You should contact these people, DBR; maybe they know someone in your state.
http://www.concealedcarrylegal.com/index.cfm
You should contact these people, DBR; maybe they know someone in your state.
http://www.concealedcarrylegal.com/index.cfm
swinokur
Member
exactly.
DeputyRet
Member
"Not sure just what all the fooforah is all about here, but if you are DEAD you sure as hell can't be sued. Don't know 'bout you, but I'd rather be alive. Then worry about being sued..."
You might want to think about that. Granted, I wouldn't want to be dead. But I sure wouldn't want to lose EVERYTHING I worked for all my life either. Juries are weird things. Especially if you live in an area that is heavily ethnic and doesn't like other ethnics. An extreme decision against you and the dirtbag's family could be living in your house and driving your vehicle while you are in a flophouse with your family trying to figure out where your next dime is comig from. I think I would prefer to use a non-lethal weapon like peppergas or a stun gun rather than something permanent as a handgun. Obviously, if the bad guy already has a gun out and is pointing it at you or your family, all bets are off. But just blowing someone away is a risky affair at best. Especially if he is unarmed and poses no apparent threat to you.
You might want to think about that. Granted, I wouldn't want to be dead. But I sure wouldn't want to lose EVERYTHING I worked for all my life either. Juries are weird things. Especially if you live in an area that is heavily ethnic and doesn't like other ethnics. An extreme decision against you and the dirtbag's family could be living in your house and driving your vehicle while you are in a flophouse with your family trying to figure out where your next dime is comig from. I think I would prefer to use a non-lethal weapon like peppergas or a stun gun rather than something permanent as a handgun. Obviously, if the bad guy already has a gun out and is pointing it at you or your family, all bets are off. But just blowing someone away is a risky affair at best. Especially if he is unarmed and poses no apparent threat to you.
You mean like the United States?
While I agree the last thing any of us wishes to do is take a life, anyone NOT supposed to be in my house is a threat. Trying to decide between pepper spray and a handgun at 3AM could negate the entire argument.
The Bushmaster
Member
You mean you won't shoot a bad guy because your insurance won't cover you? A guess you'll be dead. While I'll be alive and sued. I much prefer the later...
rd2007
Member
I'm seriously not worried about this because I am not going to shoot anybody. I will defend what is mine and stop something that is threatening me, my family, or my property. If it takes a firearm to do this, then so be it. I know that Texas law has my back because I am completely in my right to do it and the person I need to stop or protect against will be 100% stopped; the threat will be over and out gone. The family won't be able to do jack either because I was working within my rights.
DeputyRet
Member
"You mean like the United States?"
I mean SPECIFIC locations in the USA. In my town, if I go to a jury trial, the majority of the jurors will NOT be "among my peers". Do I have to spell it out for you? PM me if you need more clarification.
"While I agree the last thing any of us wishes to do is take a life, anyone NOT supposed to be in my house is a threat. Trying to decide between pepper spray and a handgun at 3AM could negate the entire argument."
That may work in locations where there is a Castle Doctrine. My state DOESN'T have it. We are also a red state that has far left leanings and liberal DAs in my county. They have already done away with the death penalty in NM. We have already been told in our neighborhood watch meetings we WILL be prosecuted if we use lethal force for ANY reason. Even the police warn us that we have to be 100% CERTAIN before we pull the trigger that we are justified in doing so. So we CAN'T just blast anyone we encounter in the house. We have to be able to PROVE in a court of law that either we or our family members are in imminent fear for our lives. Not exactly an easy thing to do. And if it's pitch black and you can't see what's in the hand of the bad guy, it definitely puts you at a disadvantage, which is EXACTLY the intention of the DA. They are pro-criminal and anti-honest citizen. So if I have a close encounter of the unpleasant kind, I will uneash my fire extinguisher-sized peppergas on him and hope he doesn't have something lethal to counter it. I spent 22 years working in and around jails and prisons. That is NOT somewhere I would want to spend my retirement years in.
I mean SPECIFIC locations in the USA. In my town, if I go to a jury trial, the majority of the jurors will NOT be "among my peers". Do I have to spell it out for you? PM me if you need more clarification.
"While I agree the last thing any of us wishes to do is take a life, anyone NOT supposed to be in my house is a threat. Trying to decide between pepper spray and a handgun at 3AM could negate the entire argument."
That may work in locations where there is a Castle Doctrine. My state DOESN'T have it. We are also a red state that has far left leanings and liberal DAs in my county. They have already done away with the death penalty in NM. We have already been told in our neighborhood watch meetings we WILL be prosecuted if we use lethal force for ANY reason. Even the police warn us that we have to be 100% CERTAIN before we pull the trigger that we are justified in doing so. So we CAN'T just blast anyone we encounter in the house. We have to be able to PROVE in a court of law that either we or our family members are in imminent fear for our lives. Not exactly an easy thing to do. And if it's pitch black and you can't see what's in the hand of the bad guy, it definitely puts you at a disadvantage, which is EXACTLY the intention of the DA. They are pro-criminal and anti-honest citizen. So if I have a close encounter of the unpleasant kind, I will uneash my fire extinguisher-sized peppergas on him and hope he doesn't have something lethal to counter it. I spent 22 years working in and around jails and prisons. That is NOT somewhere I would want to spend my retirement years in.
I was being a little facetious. Seems it's hard to travel anywhere without passing through such an area.
I feel for you having to live in a less than free state. My grandfather was quite fond of the old cliche, "I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by six." I'm willing to risk prison to ensure the safety of my family, but that's a choice we each have to make on our own.
rd2007
Member
I did not say I would shoot someone because I would not ever shoot someone. I would defend myself, family, or property with a gun and would stop a threat, but I would never shoot someone. You never say that just like you don't say you tried to kill someone or you did kill them. You feared for your safety, felt threatened, were protecting your property and you stopped the threat. The cops will figure out the gun part on their own, they don't need you to explain it to them.
DeputyRet
Member
EddieNFL: LOL...sorry Eddie. It whooshed over my head. But you are correct. 
We are still working on a Castle Doctrine here. Unfortunately, right now it's on the back burner because we have nothing but Communists, oops, I mean "progressives", in power in our state.
HexHead:"Get a drop piece."
A bunch of us have come up with another possible solutiuon. Shoot the dirtbag, throw him in the back of the pickup truck under a tarp, and dump the body out in the desert. It would be YEARS before they found his picked-over bones.
We are still working on a Castle Doctrine here. Unfortunately, right now it's on the back burner because we have nothing but Communists, oops, I mean "progressives", in power in our state.
HexHead:"Get a drop piece."
A bunch of us have come up with another possible solutiuon. Shoot the dirtbag, throw him in the back of the pickup truck under a tarp, and dump the body out in the desert. It would be YEARS before they found his picked-over bones.
TheWarhammer
Member
EddieNFL said:
rd2007 said:
What rd2007 is saying here is that you should never SAY that you would shoot someone, regardless of whether you would or not. A sleazebag lawyer could argue that by SAYING ahead of time that you would kill someone who invaded your home, you were looking for a reason to kill someone, even though it wasn't necessary.
This is the same reason that most lawyers will tell you never to put a "beware of dog" sign on your property. The sign itself could be used argue that you KNEW the dog was dangerous and yet you did not take proper steps to protect the guy who jumped your fence and was breaking into your house when your dog bit him. The best tact is to post no signs, and then act horribly shocked that your gentle little pet could have ever bit anyone... "Cujo has never acted aggressive to ANYONE before. Surely that bad man must have attacked my dog first and he was merely defending himself."
Is this all semantics? Yes. Is it total BS that we have to think this way? Yes. Is it a real concern that we all need to take into consideration as gun owners? Unfortunately, yes.
Okay, I follow. You can tell I'm not a lawyer.
Deputy, I did not realize NM was so liberal. Guess I've read too many stories about Sheriff Joe Arpaio.
I would sue the owner for not posting a warning. Like the burglar who sued (and received a settlement) because there wasn't a warning on the skylight he fell through.
DeputyRet
Member
Eddie: I'd LOVE to have Sheriff Joe in NM. Maybe I'll kidnap him from AZ
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