What is the .25acp capable of?
- Thread starter WestKentucky
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Zaydok Allen
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Better than nothing.
herrwalther
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A police officer buddy of mine carries an old semi-auto made by Unique in .25ACP for a deep concealment piece. He has no reservations that it will stop a determined attack so it is more for getting to his weapons stored in his vehicle.
Panzerschwein
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For some reason, not sure why, the little Beretta 21A Bobcat in .25 ACP has been on my "DO WANT!" list for a while now. No particular reason why.
The cost of ammo for it has driven me off several times.
The cost of ammo for it has driven me off several times.
the walther model 9 is smaller than the baby browning.The Mauser 1910 Model has a 4 1/8" barrel, and is probably one of the larger or largest .25's.
I don't know which brand or type of .25, but an elderly man killed an attempting car jacker with one, about a mile from where I'm sitting.
I have a Bauer .25 (stainless steel copy of the Baby Browning), which I think is probably the smallest .25 made. Some people think of it as a "Girlie Gun", but it surely hides out easily, when needed.
Onward Allusion
Member
The Seecamp is 3.25" high & .86" thick. The Colt is 3.08" high & 1" thick. So, yeah, dimensionally pretty much identical. I don't carry either caliber these days. These days, I rotate between .22LR (BUG), 32S&W (BUG).380, & 9mm.
However, back in the day while in Chicago I carried a 25 ACP that saved my butt a number of times. One time my wife, her friend, and I were being herded by about 5 punks into an alley after leaving a nightclub. I could only guess what they had planned... Once the little Tanfoglio came out those punks scattered like roaches. Sure 25 ACP is a wimpy cartridge but it's a heck of a lot better than hard looks.
JR47
Member
I have several .25 ACP caliber pistols in my collection. Made By Beretta, the Model 950, and a Model 21A, or an Ortgies Vest Pocket,. I have a Raven, a Gradoga, and a Colt Vest Pocket as well.
Unlike the .22 long rifle equivalents, I've never had a failure to fire with a .25 ACP. That cannot be said of the .22 rim-fire version. Even if they were actually equivalent rounds, the .25 ACP usually carries at least one more round.
While neither caliber is exactly "powerful", they do beat that nasty stare by a mile.
I'm glad that somebody can find rim-fire ammunition at .05/round. Here, that is a myth.
Unlike the .22 long rifle equivalents, I've never had a failure to fire with a .25 ACP. That cannot be said of the .22 rim-fire version. Even if they were actually equivalent rounds, the .25 ACP usually carries at least one more round.
While neither caliber is exactly "powerful", they do beat that nasty stare by a mile.
I'm glad that somebody can find rim-fire ammunition at .05/round. Here, that is a myth.
Carl N. Brown
Member
.25 ACP has been made in the Heckler & Koch HK4 which could be converted by the user between .25ACP, .32ACP, .380ACP and .22LR., with a 3.35 inch barrel. Judging from the Ballistics by the Inch table, that would be a significant improvement over the usual 2" barreled .25. However, in that size of a pistol, you can find a more impressive 9x19mm today.
I have found that of random guns kept for self-defense by casual owners, .25 ammunition will fire in .25 pistols under conditions of age and non-maintenance (as in years in the bedside table) where I would not trust a .22 rimfire in similar condition.
I have found that of random guns kept for self-defense by casual owners, .25 ammunition will fire in .25 pistols under conditions of age and non-maintenance (as in years in the bedside table) where I would not trust a .22 rimfire in similar condition.
zxcvbob
Member
Isn't a .25 what Archduke Ferdinand was shot with, snowballing into The Great War? Or was that a .32? (I know it was something less than a .380)
It would seem the little mouseguns are capable of quite a lot!
It would seem the little mouseguns are capable of quite a lot!
In the opening post, WestKentucky ask a question:
The cartridge’s common use in small vest pocket pistols wasn’t a consideration, nor was the supposed lack of performance this cartridge’s has vs. its use for self-defense. What he wanted to know was if the little center-fire round could be a substitute for the .22 LR in a larger platform, such as for example, Ruger’s Mark III. Given the extreme shortage and accelerated cost of .22 ammunition these days the question was a very practical one, given that the .25 ACP can be reloaded.
There is no reason that larger platforms such as the above mentioned Ruger couldn’t be offered in .25 ACP because in this case the cartridge’s lower power would enhance the possibility of it being used in a larger blowback action pistol.
However I doubt that large manufacturers would consider doing it because any market it had would likely drop sharply as (or if) the availability of more affordable .22’s eventually returned. On the other hand if it looked like current market conditions were going to continue over an extended period of time some custom maker might offer converted-to-.25 pistols, or 22 > 25 conversion kits that would retail for less then an entirely new gun.
The cartridge’s common use in small vest pocket pistols wasn’t a consideration, nor was the supposed lack of performance this cartridge’s has vs. its use for self-defense. What he wanted to know was if the little center-fire round could be a substitute for the .22 LR in a larger platform, such as for example, Ruger’s Mark III. Given the extreme shortage and accelerated cost of .22 ammunition these days the question was a very practical one, given that the .25 ACP can be reloaded.
There is no reason that larger platforms such as the above mentioned Ruger couldn’t be offered in .25 ACP because in this case the cartridge’s lower power would enhance the possibility of it being used in a larger blowback action pistol.
However I doubt that large manufacturers would consider doing it because any market it had would likely drop sharply as (or if) the availability of more affordable .22’s eventually returned. On the other hand if it looked like current market conditions were going to continue over an extended period of time some custom maker might offer converted-to-.25 pistols, or 22 > 25 conversion kits that would retail for less then an entirely new gun.
*Kemosabe*
Member
Our "mouser" died...
Yeah, we used to call them “throw downs”. A LEO on another department made the news when he got caught utilizing one. He got caught because some time prior to the incident he was showing it off in the roll call room and subsequently one of his fellow officers dropped-a-dime on him (adjusted for today’s inflation that would be 50 cents)
When our “mouser” died there was a rise in the field mice population and since I had already been carrying my Bauer .25 in my shirt pocket as defense against feral and pack dogs while riding my lawn tractor (I keep the Massey under the carport for the big jobs) it was pressed into mouse control.
Because it fits into a quickly accessible shirt pocket I began reloading for it to keep costs down on mouse duty. I make less than half of the mouse shots and all of the dog shots. It serves me well in that capacity and I never intentionally carry it as a SD gun, but if a perp came up to me while I was mowing I would not feel completely at his mercy.
Yeah, we used to call them “throw downs”. A LEO on another department made the news when he got caught utilizing one. He got caught because some time prior to the incident he was showing it off in the roll call room and subsequently one of his fellow officers dropped-a-dime on him (adjusted for today’s inflation that would be 50 cents
)When our “mouser” died there was a rise in the field mice population and since I had already been carrying my Bauer .25 in my shirt pocket as defense against feral and pack dogs while riding my lawn tractor (I keep the Massey under the carport for the big jobs) it was pressed into mouse control.
Because it fits into a quickly accessible shirt pocket I began reloading for it to keep costs down on mouse duty. I make less than half of the mouse shots and all of the dog shots. It serves me well in that capacity and I never intentionally carry it as a SD gun, but if a perp came up to me while I was mowing I would not feel completely at his mercy.
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PRD1
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The Archduke...
fell to a Model 1900 Browning in 7.65 mm (.32 Auto).
Also, FWIW, many years ago, I knew a surgeon who worked in the emergency department at Dallas Parkland Hospital: he hated .25s with a passion. He said that never a Friday or Saturday night went by that the PD didn't drag-in at least one participant in a bar fight (or other close-and-personal encounter) who had been perforated with a .25 auto, and, often, the entire contents of the magazine. He then had to try to track the little slugs through the victim's plumbing, repairing the damage he found - when possible. He said that the tiny bullets almost never followed a straight path, whether or not they struck bone, and he never knew from the entrance wounds where they would finally come to rest (and few of them actually exited from a body wound). He said that the amount of actual damage inflicted in such shootings was often all out of proportion to the (supposed) ineffectiveness of the caliber, and that the percentage of those shot with .25s who survived was actually lower than in shootings with more 'effective' calibers, in his (not inconsiderable) experience.
PRD1 - mhb - Mike
fell to a Model 1900 Browning in 7.65 mm (.32 Auto).
Also, FWIW, many years ago, I knew a surgeon who worked in the emergency department at Dallas Parkland Hospital: he hated .25s with a passion. He said that never a Friday or Saturday night went by that the PD didn't drag-in at least one participant in a bar fight (or other close-and-personal encounter) who had been perforated with a .25 auto, and, often, the entire contents of the magazine. He then had to try to track the little slugs through the victim's plumbing, repairing the damage he found - when possible. He said that the tiny bullets almost never followed a straight path, whether or not they struck bone, and he never knew from the entrance wounds where they would finally come to rest (and few of them actually exited from a body wound). He said that the amount of actual damage inflicted in such shootings was often all out of proportion to the (supposed) ineffectiveness of the caliber, and that the percentage of those shot with .25s who survived was actually lower than in shootings with more 'effective' calibers, in his (not inconsiderable) experience.
PRD1 - mhb - Mike
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Gun Master
Member
.25acp
All things considered, I usually prefer .22LR over .25ACP.
I have a Taurus PT22, that is a little larger in the grip than I like, but it is reliable and dependable.
I like the smaller .25 Bauer (6rd. mag, 2.11'' bl.) when concealment is the issue. Like the PT22 (8rd. mag) and tip up 2 3/4" barrel for effect .
All things considered, I usually prefer .22LR over .25ACP.
I have a Taurus PT22, that is a little larger in the grip than I like, but it is reliable and dependable.
I like the smaller .25 Bauer (6rd. mag, 2.11'' bl.) when concealment is the issue. Like the PT22 (8rd. mag) and tip up 2 3/4" barrel for effect .
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OP
OP
WestKentucky
Member
The regurgitated answer that the .25 is crap when compared to 22 lr is a good one on performance of common guns, except that the ammo for the .25 is much more reliable, and is Reloadable, and a 2" 22 is equally wimpy.
David E
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That's a poorly thought out "plan."
By the time he gets down to the .25, that means his primary gun is out of ammo or out of service. Same goes for his backup gun.
So let's presume he's armed with a Glock 17 with two spare magazines. That's 52 rounds. Let's say his backup is a Glock 26 with a Plus 2 base pad giving him another 13 rounds. We are at 65 rounds of ammo divided between two guns.
But he goes through all that.....and STILL has something to shoot at? THATS when he will pull his .25 acp and THEN try to make it to other weapons?
I don't think so.
PedalBiker
Member
I'd rather have a hammer or a baseball bat.
My dad used to be able to sink a 16d cemented spike in to a 2x4 two good hits one to get it started and one to put it home.
Granted the 25 has more reach. If I don't have a way to conceal an LCP or a J frame I'm just not going to bother.
My dad used to be able to sink a 16d cemented spike in to a 2x4 two good hits one to get it started and one to put it home.
Granted the 25 has more reach. If I don't have a way to conceal an LCP or a J frame I'm just not going to bother.
Vern Humphrey
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Well, yeah -- but what if the other guy is hitting?
watergun
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.25
I know personally of two citizens who were killed with Raven .25's. I sold both of them when in the gun business. Police came to verify that they had bought them from me.
I know personally of two citizens who were killed with Raven .25's. I sold both of them when in the gun business. Police came to verify that they had bought them from me.
redneck2
Member
real life experience...couple of years ago I'm coming home at night. Two cars stopped on the county road ahead of me. First car was a girl that had hit a deer, maybe +/- 90#. Rear legs were both snapped and the deer is flopping around trying to get off the road.
So guy in car #2 says "I've got a pistol, I'll put it down". Pulls out his .25 acp. Walks right up to within an inch or two of it's head and pulls the trigger. Deer flops more, so he shoots again. And again. And again. Empties the gun. Every round bounced off.
Deer is still moving so we end up cutting it's neck with my pocket knife. So. in the real world it is less than useless. A .22 would have been fine. We've killed 1200# steers with one shot from a .22
You can read all the ballistics charts you want. I saw it first hand. Other than scaring somebody because you have a firearm, I'd consider them less than useless. YMMV
So guy in car #2 says "I've got a pistol, I'll put it down". Pulls out his .25 acp. Walks right up to within an inch or two of it's head and pulls the trigger. Deer flops more, so he shoots again. And again. And again. Empties the gun. Every round bounced off.
Deer is still moving so we end up cutting it's neck with my pocket knife. So. in the real world it is less than useless. A .22 would have been fine. We've killed 1200# steers with one shot from a .22
You can read all the ballistics charts you want. I saw it first hand. Other than scaring somebody because you have a firearm, I'd consider them less than useless. YMMV
aka108
Member
No doubt a 25 can kill a person with a perfectly placed shot but now 9mm's are just about as compact as the 25 pieces but pack on whale of lot more punch and the ammo is less expensive..
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