AK-47

It's simply shocking how much misinformation there is in this thread.

Choice nuggets include:

AK is well made and reliable. Accurate is ain't.

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My converted 7.62x39mm Saiga will shoot 2-2.5 MOA all day on bulk ammo, which is combat accurate and as good as most any AR carbine with bulk ammo.

The SKS is well made, reliable, and more accurate than the AK.

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See above.

Wrong. The sks doesn't have a stamped receiver, never has in any configuration.

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Yes. Stamped versions do exist.

was told to get milled over stamped

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There is no benefit to milled AK receivers over stamped, other than being pretty, and possibly a tiny reduction in recoil (though 7.62x39mm doesn't have a huge amount of recoil to begin with). Stamped is lighter, has no real impact on accuracy, and has been proven in Russian service to have a longer service life.

By truck gun I mean not kept in a warm safe cleaned and lubed as my ARs are

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AKs require lubrication too. They are typically more subject to corrosion than ARs (steel versus aluminum alloy receivers, often wood versus polymer furniture, usually cruder -often paint- finishes on the metal parts).

Dont get a used wasr.

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A used WASR with straight sights and a properly cut mag well is a dang fine rifle. This is pretty easy to inspect when buying used.

For the record, I personally like AKs a lot, but it's important to understand their benefits and limitations.

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was told to get milled over stamped

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There is no benefit to milled AK receivers over stamped, other than being pretty, and possibly a tiny reduction in recoil (though 7.62x39mm doesn't have a huge amount of recoil to begin with). Stamped is lighter, has no real impact on accuracy, and has been proven in Russian service to have a longer service life.

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I'd think the milled receiver would also dissipate a little more heat away from the chamber/barrel under heavy constant fire. I'd also say the effect would be extremely minimal.

This is just my speculation.

well, if a stamped AK is inadequate then that must mean HK91s/G3s constructed through very similar processes are also inaccurate, weak crap too

+ 1 WASR 10. Cheap, ugly, and (for me at least) 10 years of perfect reliability with absolutely no cleaning or love. Milled AK receivers are really for the guys wanting extra range or rigidity---stamped AK's are no less reliable. The only thing my WASR balks at is expensive polymer mags----it likes old commie block steel.

Ammo can be had for about $250 a case of 1000, or at least it was last week. Look around online.

Dont get a used wasr.
A used WASR with straight sights and a properly cut mag well is a dang fine rifle. This is pretty easy to inspect when buying used.

For the record, I personally like AKs a lot, but it's important to understand their benefits and limitations.

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I only suggest not getting a used wasr for the same reason you suggest getting one. If your new to AKS, and you just want one, you probably dont know the difference between some of the things you mentioned. Mag wobble and canted sights are not necessarily obvious to folks who've never handled the platform.... And yes.. the used market is FULL of jacked up wasrs... So.. Yes, if you know what your looking at. Go used... But if you dont. Dont.

The AK is fine for the typical ranges found in most gunbattles. I have been shooting the SKS for about 25 years and I find it a bit more accurate at longer ranges. Either will work fine for you as a truck gun, but so will a lot of other things, like lever-action rifles, old WW2 bolt guns and pistol caliber carbines.

the only thing that makes an SKS marginally better at longer ranges is its longer barrel giving a bit more velocity to the same cartridges

as far as AKs go if there arent some design changes to keep them modern and updated to keep costs low or at least make them worth the elevated prices theyre beginning to appear at, the AK may fade into obscurity.. its pretty much on life support right now

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The AK in any form is more popular today than 10 years ago.

its a simple fact, these old military surplus kits floating around wont last forever, prices on them are already going up, the cheapest AKs are now more expensive than the cheapest ARs and the prices are only climbing, US made AKs are average at best.. most of the kits that are being sold now were made decades ago and the influx of those parts kits are a major target for the anti-gun groups and the 7N6 ban was a HUGE blow to almost the entire AK-74 market

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There are some good USA built rifles. As the kits dry up there will be more US built rifles.
As far as 7N6 ammo goes it's just a matter of time and someone will fill the gap. 7N6 isn't all that great anyway. It's corrosive and not that accurate. It was just cheap.

I only suggest not getting a used wasr for the same reason you suggest getting one. If your new to AKS, and you just want one, you probably dont know the difference between some of the things you mentioned. Mag wobble and canted sights are not necessarily obvious to folks who've never handled the platform.... And yes.. the used market is FULL of jacked up wasrs... So.. Yes, if you know what your looking at. Go used... But if you dont. Dont.

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Canted sights are typically a cosmetic issue only. Top-shelf Arsenals and Izhmash-made Saigas can both have canted front sight blocks (and rear sight blocks/trunnions). The Russian/Comblock attitude was that if the rifle could be properly zeroed, it was fine. Not in line with our typical Western way of thinking, but a fact nonetheless.

Unless the sights are severely canted to the point that the rifle cannot be zeroed, there is not a functional issue. Such severe canting is typically easy to spot with a cursory visual inspection.

Likewise, a poorly-cut magwell is easy to inspect. If a steel surplus mag locks up properly, the magwell is fine. Some wobble is acceptable.

As with all things used (be it cars or guns or anything else), it is imperative for the buyer to inform himself or herself prior to purchasing.

considering the prices of AKs, the relatively low cost of 5.56, if i were to buy an AK for a truck, id get one of these

http://www.centerfiresystems.com/hg3237-n.aspx

Fishbed77 said:

Canted sights are typically a cosmetic issue only. Top-shelf Arsenals and Izhmash-made Saigas can both have canted front sight blocks (and rear sight blocks/trunnions). The Russian/Comblock attitude was that if the rifle could be properly zeroed, it was fine. Not in line with our typical Western way of thinking, but a fact nonetheless.

Unless the sights are severely canted to the point that the rifle cannot be zeroed, there is not a functional issue. Such severe canting is typically easy to spot with a cursory visual inspection.

Likewise, a poorly-cut magwell is easy to inspect. If a steel surplus mag locks up properly, the magwell is fine. Some wobble is acceptable.

As with all things used (be it cars or guns or anything else), it is imperative for the buyer to inform himself or herself prior to purchasing.

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And just like with a car or anything else. If you don't know what to look for just buy a new one.

With AK's selling at hundreds of dollars more than a decade ago, I'd hardly consider the rifle to be "on life support". There are no shortage of AK fans out there, and sales are remaining strong even at the elevated prices.

And just like with a car or anything else. If you don't know what to look for just buy a new one.

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In most cases. I wouldn't buy any new IO rifle over a checked-out used WASR.

Mini-30 is your answer.

And the 7.62x39 is a very accurate round out of the right rifle. I shot a .67" group at 100 yards with my Savage bolt action just yesterday.

CornCod said:

The AK is fine for the typical ranges found in most gunbattles. I have been shooting the SKS for about 25 years and I find it a bit more accurate at longer ranges. Either will work fine for you as a truck gun, but so will a lot of other things, like lever-action rifles, old WW2 bolt guns and pistol caliber carbines.

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I find that statement interesting. I would like to challenge anyone on here under simulated combat conditions to put 8 out of 10 shots on a paper plate from kneeling or standing or even prone position as fast as you can pull the trigger or 20 seconds from close range of 200 yards. That is with an AK with factory ammo of your choice. I would like it if we could have a shoot off sometime. I think my Saiga is pretty good for an AK. I was able to hit 100% at 400 meters in the Army with an AR on pop up torso targets. But I was much younger then.

There are a lot of excellent American made AK 47s.

I will tell you what. A few years ago, I bought an IO Inc AK 47. Now, if you do an quick Internet search on IO Inc AK 47s, you'll find that pretty much everyone hates them.

I love mine.

Accurate, and runs like a top. One of the most fun rifles to shoot that I've ever owned. Never, never, never has hiccuped on me. I run everything through it, hollow points included.

Probably the best American made AK 47 today is the Century Arms C39 V2.

xxjumbojimboxx said:

And just like with a car or anything else. If you don't know what to look for just buy a new one.

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What good will buying a brand new AK do?

Problems like canted front sights or wobbly mag wells don't generally arise from use, the rifles come from the factory that way.

It doesn't take an AK expert to see the problems that arise from use, misuse and abuse. Things like large dents, cracks, major pitting on metal parts or a sewer pipe bore are fairly easy to spot.

You were shooting the 7.63x39 out of a savage? If so what model, I recently bought the 10FCP-SR 20" and I love that rifle, If savage makes one I will buy it in 7.62x39

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Savage briefly made their model 10 Scout rifle in the 7.62x39. It took me a while, but I found one. It came with a late-model Accustock (keyhole recoil lug but no wedge), Accutrigger, "tactical" heavy bolt handle, iron sights and forward scout rail for optics.

Without a scope, it weighed 7.5 lbs. - too much IMO for a true "scout" so I lightened it up by replacing the Accustock with the plastic stock off my Model 11 XP, swapping bolt handles, removing the iron sights, and putting a very lightweight Weaver 4x Scout scope on it. Total weight is 6 lbs. 14 oz. with a sling, and it shoots sub-MOA all day long.

In fact, it's quickly becoming my favorite rifle to shoot and hunt with.

I enjoyed shooting my uncle's SKS's back in the early 90's and have known how useful, inexpensive and fun to shoot that little Russian round is. But I wanted a bolt action.

To my knowledge, there are four bolt-action 7.62x39 rifles that can be found. The Ruger Hawkeye Compact (no longer chambered in 7.62x39), the Savage Scout (out of production), the light and very attractive CZ 527, and the discontinued Remington 799 or Zastavia rifle.

Of the group, the Ruger, CZ and Savage are the only ones I'd own with the Savage being the easiest to use and abuse IMO. Just the way I like it.

I will tell you what. A few years ago, I bought an IO Inc AK 47. Now, if you do an quick Internet search on IO Inc AK 47s, you'll find that pretty much everyone hates them.

I love mine.

Accurate, and runs like a top. One of the most fun rifles to shoot that I've ever owned. Never, never, never has hiccuped on me. I run everything through it, hollow points included.

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You've been lucky. IO is one of the number of US AK manufacturers that use cast trunnions. There is nothing inherent wrong with well-done castings per se, but the AK trunnion is a fairly high-stress part that was not designed to be a casting (which can have undetectable voids). The many nations producing AKs for military use over the years gradually swapped over to castings for many parts of these rifles, but never for front tunnions. There is a reason for this.

Mini-30 is your answer.

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I'm really interested to hear why anyone would buy a mini over a decent AK. And if the stated purpose is to shoot cheap steel case ammo why pick a mini? It makes no sense to me but maybe I'm missing something

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Mini-30 is your answer.
I'm really interested to hear why anyone would buy a mini over a decent AK. And if the stated purpose is to shoot cheap steel case ammo why pick a mini? It makes no sense to me but maybe I'm missing something

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I have to agree with this. I love the Mini 14 and own a few but I can't justify paying $500 - $700 for one. They are just too expensive today for what you get. I don't understand why they cost so much. Around here most dealer don't even stock them anymore because they sit around too long.