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stanley_white
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I am sorry for not providing the detail at the beginning.
For me, it would be something I would plink with, keep in the sock drawer at night, and possibly CCW.
-Stan
Input Requested: The Old Man Gun
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I am sorry for not providing the detail at the beginning.
For me, it would be something I would plink with, keep in the sock drawer at night, and possibly CCW.
-Stan
OP
OP
stanley_white
Member
I read on another forum a posting by a gentlemen who had two bad shoulders and a hand that was crushed at some point who favored a modern version of the Schofield in .45LC.
-Stan
For carry, I presently prefer a DA revolver and would likely continue to do so in my old age. For personal protection, I would not concern myself with reloads at all. I would still need to reload in practice, but it just wouldn't be a factor in carry. I could use the Hogue thumbpiece for S&W revolvers to make reloads at the range easier. I could also use a lighter trigger return spring to substantially lighten the DA pull. It would slow the trigger reset, but if I didn't have the hand strength for a heavier DA pull, I wouldn't have what it takes to control recoil for .20 splits either. I could also use an extended and reprofiled firing pin with Federal primers and reduce the mainspring weight some.
An important consideration would be the sights. I use a "geezer" sight (red dot) now, and would only want it to get bigger as I age.
An important consideration would be the sights. I use a "geezer" sight (red dot) now, and would only want it to get bigger as I age.
Being in this position (70s with arthritis in hands, wrists, elbows, and only one shoulder after the other one was rebuilt) I would say this about single action revolvers:
1. First requirement is that you can perform the manual of arms (check for loaded condition, load and clear). A much as I love single actions (see my avatar) lowering the hammer on a live round if you don't have to shoot is a non-trivial exercise. Your old, tired hands better be able to do that safely.
2. Everyone wants to have lots and lots of cartridges for the gun fight that never ends but some of you folks watch too many action/adventure movies. The close encounter of the unpleasant kind will likely be over in 5-6 shots, and probably be less. The glacier speed at which SAs are reloaded isn't the big problem most make it out to be. If you can solve the problem with a 5-shot J-frame or LCR, 6 shots of 357, 44, or 45 in a Ruger Vaquero is almost over-kill (lol).
If you don't currently have a single action you are familiar and comfortable with, the SA is a bad choice. But if you have one that you know well and you're willing to spend most of your shooting time getting to know it even better, a single action can be an old guy's trusted best friend.
Dave
1. First requirement is that you can perform the manual of arms (check for loaded condition, load and clear). A much as I love single actions (see my avatar) lowering the hammer on a live round if you don't have to shoot is a non-trivial exercise. Your old, tired hands better be able to do that safely.
2. Everyone wants to have lots and lots of cartridges for the gun fight that never ends but some of you folks watch too many action/adventure movies. The close encounter of the unpleasant kind will likely be over in 5-6 shots, and probably be less. The glacier speed at which SAs are reloaded isn't the big problem most make it out to be. If you can solve the problem with a 5-shot J-frame or LCR, 6 shots of 357, 44, or 45 in a Ruger Vaquero is almost over-kill (lol).
If you don't currently have a single action you are familiar and comfortable with, the SA is a bad choice. But if you have one that you know well and you're willing to spend most of your shooting time getting to know it even better, a single action can be an old guy's trusted best friend.
Dave
JeeperCreeper
Member
I normally don't like to post about my work, but I'm an occupational therapist. Basically, when it comes to aging and hands, the profession is considered the experts. Now, I say this as not to an appeal to authority, but to at least show my perspective. I also say this as an acute care and rehab general practitioner... not a certified hand specialist.
I'll also add that this is my layman's version that I'm texting out on a cell phone, so I'm going to try and keep it simple. It's amazing how complicated some medical people makes things........
Ok, with that outta the way, "old man hands" is not universal. Everyone ages differently. Common sense, I know. But one thing I find most people focus on is "strength". Honestly, most elderly have decent hand "strength" (grasp and finger flexion). The issue is generally coordination, dexterity, fine motor, whatever terms you wanna use. The fancy word is "ataxic movements". I jokingly call it "drunk hands" to a few patients.
Another issue is the Range of Motion (ROM) of the fingers. Arthritis is the big culprit here, but there are a ton of other reasons why as well. Normally, with most of my patients, thumb, index, and middle fingers (think handwriting or using a spoon in a "tripod" grasp) are the most useful as time goes on, maintaining more ROM than the ring and pinky. It's kinda how the hand just naturally works.
If you're bored, our quick test is called "serial opposition". I'm sure you all have done it before, but touch each finger to your thumb in succession. Pointer to pinky, and then pinky to pointer. Now do it fast. Probably notice your tripod digits are easiest to "oppose".
I find SA revolvers to be a theoretical issue for a generic aging hand. It requires too much coordination for a complex manual of arms, and relies heavily on the whole hand for reloading and shooting.
I think a medium framed 38 special DA/SA with a nice trigger is a good idea. For an aging hand, I think loading speed loaders is harder than loading a cylinder.
I think Smith hit it out of the park with the EZ series. Issues can also be the manual of arms depending on the person.
Depending on hand size, I also think a heavy but loose "thumping" gun like a Ruger P90 that I used to own would be good. As a comparison, if we have a patient with a tremor, the first thing we do is give them weighted silverware for eating. It works quite well to steady the shakes.
So I guess I would say "it depends", and honestly, it might take trial and error.
Oddly enough, a classic "old man" brand in Smith& Wesson seems to have the best options for both DA/SA Revolvers and Autos as a starting point. So I'd look at their catalogue first and see which ones are "easiest for you".
And if S&W wants a practitioner to assist in any testing and reads this for any reason, I'm you're man.
I'll also add that this is my layman's version that I'm texting out on a cell phone, so I'm going to try and keep it simple. It's amazing how complicated some medical people makes things........
Ok, with that outta the way, "old man hands" is not universal. Everyone ages differently. Common sense, I know. But one thing I find most people focus on is "strength". Honestly, most elderly have decent hand "strength" (grasp and finger flexion). The issue is generally coordination, dexterity, fine motor, whatever terms you wanna use. The fancy word is "ataxic movements". I jokingly call it "drunk hands" to a few patients.
Another issue is the Range of Motion (ROM) of the fingers. Arthritis is the big culprit here, but there are a ton of other reasons why as well. Normally, with most of my patients, thumb, index, and middle fingers (think handwriting or using a spoon in a "tripod" grasp) are the most useful as time goes on, maintaining more ROM than the ring and pinky. It's kinda how the hand just naturally works.
If you're bored, our quick test is called "serial opposition". I'm sure you all have done it before, but touch each finger to your thumb in succession. Pointer to pinky, and then pinky to pointer. Now do it fast. Probably notice your tripod digits are easiest to "oppose".
I find SA revolvers to be a theoretical issue for a generic aging hand. It requires too much coordination for a complex manual of arms, and relies heavily on the whole hand for reloading and shooting.
I think a medium framed 38 special DA/SA with a nice trigger is a good idea. For an aging hand, I think loading speed loaders is harder than loading a cylinder.
I think Smith hit it out of the park with the EZ series. Issues can also be the manual of arms depending on the person.
Depending on hand size, I also think a heavy but loose "thumping" gun like a Ruger P90 that I used to own would be good. As a comparison, if we have a patient with a tremor, the first thing we do is give them weighted silverware for eating. It works quite well to steady the shakes.
So I guess I would say "it depends", and honestly, it might take trial and error.
Oddly enough, a classic "old man" brand in Smith& Wesson seems to have the best options for both DA/SA Revolvers and Autos as a starting point. So I'd look at their catalogue first and see which ones are "easiest for you".
And if S&W wants a practitioner to assist in any testing and reads this for any reason, I'm you're man.
Dudemeister
Member
YEah... that!
edwardware
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That, and magazine loading, is the whole point of the EZ models in the M&P line.
I advocated for the single action for a fun range gun, but I won't do so for carry. Especially for someone who might have trembling hands even without stress, a single action revolver trigger is just too much of a liability. It might even not be such a good idea on the EZ. I've only tried one at the counter and it didn't seem as short and light as a single action revolver trigger so I'd reserve judgment on that. Again, I'd prefer for my future old age the long pull of a double action for carry. I favor revolvers and while their triggers are normally also quite heavy, they can be lightened in exchange for some speed. For semiautomatic pistols, I'd look into Kahr or a double-action only hammer fired pistol
WheelGunMan
Member
She likes the idea of just squeezing the trigger and making it go BANG.. and if it doesn't.. just squeeze it again rather than the tap, rack and assess exercise. That's a good thing for someone who isn't willing to dilligently train.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
Yeah, I have true double action pistols with double strike capability, which of course replicates a DA revolver in that regard. What's becoming more difficult with my hands is the squeeze. Some days, the pain just shoots out of nowhere (all this just started in 2020).
Hence my personal reason for now wanting a 1911 based action with a safety lever locked single action trigger. Which goes against my previous and long standing preferences in purchasing a defensive firearm.
But, back to single action revolvers . . . buy a new Ruger and it does not come with a light hair trigger. It takes some 'smithing to remove the factory installed lawyer creep and pull weight. So, it could be argued that a new stock Ruger SA trigger is suitable for SA self defense.
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Tallball
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"LCRx in 327. Can be shot SA/DA which ever is easier for the user. This is what my mid 70s little mom uses. She doesn't like semi autos for no particular tangible reason. She shoots the 32 HR mag or 32 longs... I'm pretty sure it's the 32HR mags."
Something like that will be my choice one day, too, more than likely. You can have pretty messed up hands and/or wrists and still shoot 32 H&R without pain. A DA revolver would be better for most people, IMHO. It seems like SA might only be a good choice if you were very accustomed to shooting them.
Something like that will be my choice one day, too, more than likely. You can have pretty messed up hands and/or wrists and still shoot 32 H&R without pain. A DA revolver would be better for most people, IMHO. It seems like SA might only be a good choice if you were very accustomed to shooting them.
buck460XVR
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I going with the sayin' us old farts that ride motorcycle often use.
....IMHO, same goes for guns. Unless you have an exceptionally hard to operate firearm or you have some serious debilitating disease or injury, why do you need something different? One doesn't get weak just because they get older, they get weak cause they quit doing the things that gave them the strength to do it in the first place. Keep using and practicing with what you have and quit worrying about getting old.
....IMHO, same goes for guns. Unless you have an exceptionally hard to operate firearm or you have some serious debilitating disease or injury, why do you need something different? One doesn't get weak just because they get older, they get weak cause they quit doing the things that gave them the strength to do it in the first place. Keep using and practicing with what you have and quit worrying about getting old.
danez71
Member
^^^^^^ Actually, she has the 327 LCR; not the LCRx.
If for some reason I can't shoot semi autos and can only do revolvers, that will be my likely choice, too
If for some reason I can't shoot semi autos and can only do revolvers, that will be my likely choice, too
Golfanaticshooter
Member
Agreed, a Smith & Wesson pistol can also be sent to a place like "The Gunsmith, Inc." in Arizona for a trigger job which can be a world changing experience.
Buzznrose
Member
Clint Smith, at 70 years young, has good days and bad days. He adjusts accordingly:
Jim Watson
Member
A twist loader like HKS is simple to load.
A Dade type (Speedbeez) is even simpler, especially with a block.
A Safariland or Jetloader is a pain to load barehanded but no trouble with a tray.
If you have several, you can load them at home at leisure and blaze away at the range.
Moon clips are an easy reload but even the better loading and unloading tools take a bit of work.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
Armybrat
Member
Mine is pretty smooth, and the OP can go with the milder .32 H&R magnum loads.
I’m 75 with arthritic shoulders & some in my hands.
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Old Stumpy
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I would go with a .45 Colt SA. Perhaps a Blackhawk.
In .357 the cylinder in these revolvers weighs a ton.
.45 Colt loads can be Cowboy Action light to .44 magnum heavy in a Blackhawk.
200 grain lead to 300 grain JHP or JSP.
The target sights are easy to adjust and better for old man eyes as well.
In .357 the cylinder in these revolvers weighs a ton.
.45 Colt loads can be Cowboy Action light to .44 magnum heavy in a Blackhawk.
200 grain lead to 300 grain JHP or JSP.
The target sights are easy to adjust and better for old man eyes as well.
Armored farmer
Member
You cant get much more 'old man' than a Sp101 with .38spl loads.
Especially if you're planning to actually carry it.
Especially if you're planning to actually carry it.
doubleh
Member
stevebla
Member
My 85 year old mom is a dead eye with her Ruger SP101 9mm
Sistema1927
Member
I had similar reasoning with the recent purchase of my 3" SP101 in .327. I get a 6th round. If I want "mouse fart" I can load either version of .32 S&W. If I want .38 Special performance I can up the load to .32 H&R. If I want to get close to .357 I can run it with .327 Federal. It can be carried easily, and if I have a bad day with the hands I can shoot it SA. Fortunately, I haven't had any hand issues yet, most of my age problems are with hearing and balance requiring a cane most of the time.
This revolver was pretty nice right out of the box, except for the trigger, which was atrocious. New springs and some work cleaned it up, but I will never confuse it with my S&W revolvers. If S&W made a 3" stainless K-frame in .327 (7 shots, possibly?), I would be all over it.
In my old age, I ain't as good a shot as I once was, I least as I remember it
So in order to make up the ageing process; my old man gun is a 16 shot 45 acp with a comp on the front. Loaded with 185 grs going a little over 1000 fps. Kicks like a 38 spl. cowboy load ! Only downside it the old man part of getting the brass back in to the bag
So in order to make up the ageing process; my old man gun is a 16 shot 45 acp with a comp on the front. Loaded with 185 grs going a little over 1000 fps. Kicks like a 38 spl. cowboy load ! Only downside it the old man part of getting the brass back in to the bag
Armored farmer
Member
I think that's a great choice. My Sp101 was my first ccw, and I still carry if often. Usually with my own mild LSWCHP.
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