There's a current ruling allowing guns at Michigan polling places. I'm curious about how THR members think about the issue. Speaking for myself, I think it's a terrible idea. Polling places should be hallowed ground with everyone welcomed.
Guns, militias, and polling places
- Thread starter Boattale
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Corpral_Agarn
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Gun free zones don't work
DT Guy
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One has only to look at the violent factions burning down cities to see the fallacy of 'hallowed ground' ANYWHERE today. Polling places are going to be places of risk in my areas, and being prepared to defend oneself at one is only logical and responsible.
You certainly don't expect the POLICE to keep you safe, do you?
Larry
.455_Hunter
Member
Probably not a fan of some yahoo with chest rig AR at a polling place, but am I not sure why lawful concealed carry should be restricted at ANY public or open to the public location.
First of all, are we really sure what that "ruling" says, and how it applies? Can anyone supply a link to the ruling or something that clarifies this?
wiscoaster
Member
Courts can't make law, so a court's "ruling" can't create a "guns allowed" policy in a particular public space. It's either already allowed by Michigan law, or it's not specifically disallowed by Michigan law. Regardless, I notice open carry was allowed on the Michigan state capitol grounds in Lansing, so I suspect that also applies to polling places, which are by extension public government spaces. But if someone can link to the particular Michigan statutes that would be definitive. A court's "ruling" would only apply to how a particular statute could be applied in a given situation. Maybe that's what this is about.
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wiscoaster
Member
To respond to the OP, I suggest as an example the pro-2A protest marches in Virginia in pre-pandemic days. With a crowd of thousands of armed marchers nobody was harmed and there was no violence. As a matter of fact, the people who had been planning violence elected to just stay away. I wonder why.
Corpral_Agarn
Member
not only that, for a crowd of 20k+ they left the streets cleaner than when they arrived.
wiscoaster
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Another response (you got me going, bro!!): they are and how does allowing carry making the polling place not welcome everyone? The other way around might be true because that would be a policy of exclusion, but a policy allowing carry is a policy of inclusion.
I wonder if this is a troll post. So we are supposed to not practice one right, while engaging in another right?
In PA there is a specific exception to "no carry on school grounds" if your polling place is on school grounds. I presume the exception is based on the "other lawful purpose".
In PA there is a specific exception to "no carry on school grounds" if your polling place is on school grounds. I presume the exception is based on the "other lawful purpose".
Not a troll post. I honestly cannot see where having open carry groups hanging around a polling place is not threatening to some. Surely would not make me all that comfortable and I'm an old white guy. And you can see from my signature, I'm certainly no stranger to carrying weapons. That doesn't mean I think they should be allowed everywhere. Courthouse and schools come to mind. I just think polling places should be accorded the same.
Dunross
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I believe this is the legal document describing overturning the ban on open carry in Michigan polling places.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/7276840-Ruling-on-Benson-Gun-Directive.html
Judge overturns ban on open carry of guns at Michigan polling places
https://www.axios.com/michigan-open...ace-7575510b-572c-44fb-8582-57869b5c588f.html
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/7276840-Ruling-on-Benson-Gun-Directive.html
Judge overturns ban on open carry of guns at Michigan polling places
https://www.axios.com/michigan-open...ace-7575510b-572c-44fb-8582-57869b5c588f.html
huntsman
Member
My precinct has the Ohio legal gunbuster sign, so I always leave it in the jeep.
For the first time I’ll be a poll worker so I’m planning on leaving my gun home because I will be there 14hrs without a way to keep an eye on the Jeep.
For the first time I’ll be a poll worker so I’m planning on leaving my gun home because I will be there 14hrs without a way to keep an eye on the Jeep.
Reading that ruling made my hair hurt.
George P
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No guns allowed here in Florida; that said, your CWFL ID is considered legal for a pic ID to vote........... I live in a very blue county, ( has voted blue forever), and yet I see many Trump signs as well as Black Voices for Trump signs. No one messes with ANY signs here, even if they disagree. Maybe it's just a Southern thing where folks were raised to be polite and respectful of others...............
Rockrivr1
Member
As with anything Concealed means Concealed to me. What they don't know doesn't hurt them. As to wannabees showing up fully decked out in gear and firearms, to each their own. If there's no law against it, have at it. I'll keep a mindful eye just in case but it's not going to bother me.
dh1633pm
Contributing Member
Judge ruled that the prohibition was not legal since the executive branch does not have the authority. In order to ban, they would need legislative action. Open carry certainly is illegal in my state. I will travel to the local Church to vote without anything more dangerous than my truck key.
BreechFace
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Thanks for posting the brief. Don't like the states constitutional statute on a given circumstance then go through the correct channels (i.e. the legislative branch) to get it changed.
Pay attention to the key sentences in the brief, which should be all to common in today's governmental over-reach, "...the Court's duty is not to act as an overseer of the Department of State, nor is it to impose its view on the wisdom of openly carrying firearms at polling places or other election locations. Besides the fact that the Court has no interest in either one of those matters, more importantly its constitutional role is properly limited to only declaring what the law is, not what it should be." (emphasis added: underlined portions)
This legislating from the bench needs to stop in this country, and guns have been a big part of this type of "bench and/or executive branch legislation."
Trunk Monkey
member
In Colorado most people vote by mail.
wiscoaster
Member
Overturning the Michigan ban was done by the court because the ban directive exceeded executive power granted by state law:
In other words: it was about abuse of power, not about guns.
And each state has different laws about CCW and polling places. Under Missouri CCW laws, one can not carry within 25 feet of any polling place on an Election Day. But it is kind of moot since most polling places around me are either at a school, church, or government annex building. Yes we can carry into schools and churches but only with permission from the schools or churches.
WestKentucky
Member
I have zero cares in either direction on this one. Is it a guy with a pistol on his hip just hanging around? Is it an “operator” in all his tacticool goodness hanging around minding his own business? Is it somebody making a scene of harassing folks? Two of these are people minding their own business and doing what they choose to do within the law. One of these is “menacing” and should be removed by whatever means necessary.
And realistically for there to be an actual issue then the guy would have to be perceived as pushing an agenda of sorts so that any group would be more or less offended by his presence beyond just an uneasiness about someone doing what they are legally allowed. To be perceived as having or pushing an agenda, there are already statutes about that which essentially ban people from acts or displays of partisanship within a certain distance of the polling place.
And realistically for there to be an actual issue then the guy would have to be perceived as pushing an agenda of sorts so that any group would be more or less offended by his presence beyond just an uneasiness about someone doing what they are legally allowed. To be perceived as having or pushing an agenda, there are already statutes about that which essentially ban people from acts or displays of partisanship within a certain distance of the polling place.
I'll just say that guys in combat gear in civilian places make me uneasy. To me they look like they're spoiling for a fight. And I just don't want that in my world
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