The M1 Garand Rifle - Why Is It, "Heavy"?

If youre assaulting someone or something with your M1, its an assault rifle. If youre going into battle with your AR, its your battle rifle. Jeez, how hard can this be?

I sure hope that all of you who want to argue about silly things, like semantics, are getting enough realistic trigger time in, so that whatever it is you choose, and want to call it, will do what you need when you need it. And no benches or rests allowed for practice.

NIGHTLORD40K said:

I would love to answer that question, but Im too busy trying to tell my Chinese smartphone to order me a $27 soy latte from Starbucks and have a Doordash driver wearing 3 masks deliver it to the basement where Im hiding from The Virus until my benevolent overlords tell me its safe to go outside. Thank goodness I have the Internet to keep me informed and entertained with funny cat memes and hip-hop artists grinding on each other at awards shows. I would read a book, but I burned them because the man on the moving picture box told me they were bad.

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If the Thread “For he should have know better files” , The ST&T forum, is any indication a goodly number think minding ones own business is the better part of valor. Some would even apply that to the country as
a whole.

The Garand was fine during WWII. It’s 2021. The Garand is an artifact and a range toy as well as a historical treasure. It is no longer a viable option as a combat rifle. It is defunct...obsolete and has been bested by every service rifle that has replaced it. Let that old war horse enjoy it’s retirement.

Everything is easy with practice. With the M1 youre just doing it 3 times to 1. Whats better, stop and reload after every 8? Or shoot for 28? And with a reload that's quicker with practice.

Tortuga said:

How is only having 8 shots "ideal" in a combat situation?

I know this isn't a SHTF forum so I won't digress, but I don't find that "advice" all that sensible.

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I didn’t say military combat. And it wasn’t my advice, just something someone else said for those who happen to have an M1. I wouldn’t feel undergunned with a Garand, I guess you would, end of discussion.

Garandimal said:

That is an assault rifle.

The M1 - is a battle rifle.




GR

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We've done that experiment already. The product improved Garand (M14) was outclassed by the competition, the AK47/AKM. It was so obsolescent on real battlefields that the US Army adopted a crash program to field a rifle that wasn't ready, the M16.

There isn't any army that has gone from assault rifles back to battle rifles for general use*. There are armies that still use battle rifles but I suspect that's much more about cost than utility.

The part that I'm thinking is getting missed is that rifles haven't been the killing weapon since the Russo-Japanese War. Artillery, machine guns, and high explosive propelled fragments are what kill soldiers. Most soldiers are there to serve as crew (or backup crew) for the support MG, carry ammo for the MG, protect the support MG from close assaults, and spot for the support MG. If they can kill or suppress the enemy with their rifles that's great, but rifle fire isn't what's been killing the most soldiers for the last ~120 years.

BSW

*Assault rifle = select fire intermediate (8MM Kurz, 556 NATO, 5.8 whatever the Chicom army adopted) cartridge
Battle rifle = military rifle firing full power (8mm Mauser, .30-06, 7.62x54R) cartridges

Ill bet you wouldn't be saying that if that scary deer was hunting you back!

Garandimal said:

1. MilSurp ammo pre-packaged in En-bloc clips.
2. Clips ~ $2/ea. by the 25/box. ($50/200 rds.)
3. Holbrook Device.

To prevent automatic ejection and possible loss of clip, rear arm of operating rod catch is ground off so that it does not engage clip latch.

A small spring and plunger are then fitted to operating rod catch to keep its front end pushed downward out of contact with operating rod. A .154" diameter hole 9/32" deep is drilled into top left part of operating rod catch 1-9/32" from front end.

Use a No. 23 drill, and spot anneal before drilling. Make plunger from drill rod or similar material. Its stem is 3/8" long and .087" diameter. Hole for stem is made with No. 43 drill. Plunger head is 1/8" long, .152" diameter, and has a rounded end. Spring is 3/10" long, .145" diameter, .022" wire diameter, and has 5 coils. Clip is ejected by pressing clip latch on left of receiver

Modified operating rod catch with plunger and spring (right) compared with issue operating rod catch.
Plunger in modified catch bears against bottom of receiver.

View attachment 986218
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GR

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Modify the cheapest part first. It's much easier to modify a clip so it doesn't eject than drilling on the rifle and swapping parts.

To answer the original question, the Garand is heavy because every part is made of forged steel and awesome sauce.

We could substitute 1911 and Glock 17 and have this exact same discussion. Yet the 1911 lives on.

Garandimal said:

In the jungles of SEA.

In the mountains and plains of SCA?

Not so much.

...to be superseded by... wait for it...

... the M14.

Assault rifle.

Battle rifle.




GR

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Name a counter example of a military changing its general issue rifle from an assault rifle back to a battle rifle.

Regarding SEA, the small caliber high velocity concept impressed the Sov so much that they switched from the AKM to the AK-74...

BSW

If you think the AK's are "inaccurate", you obviously have never shot one.

Garandimal said:

In the jungles of SEA.

In the mountains and plains of SCA?

Not so much.

...to be superseded by... wait for it...

... the M14.

Assault rifle.

Battle rifle.




GR

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And then it was superseded again by the AR-15/10’s offspring. It’s a relic. Nothing wrong it, but it is not the pinnacle of the combat rifle.

As a response to the deer photo you posted, many animals have been felled by the patch and ball musket. I wouldn’t step in front of a flintlock either. Doesn’t make flintlock rifles the ideal combat rifle.

Garandimal said:

Never shot one well...






GR

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Whos fault is that?

The AK's shoot just fine, if you can shoot.

Garandimal said:

Flintlock rifles...?

Fascinating.

Millions of soldiers used the M1 rifle successfully out to 500 yards, against armed threats, in two wars.

They called that "combat," too.

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GR

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What’s your point? Combat was combat back when the weapons used were pointy sticks. Does that make the spear, sword or longbow appropriate for modern combat? You like the Garand. We get it. They are cool. They are important pieces of history. They will still kill people and animals. They are not a great choice for combat/self-defense/hunting rifles. Weapons are evolving. Some day the AR-15 will be surpassed. When it is, there will be hangers-on praising the AR as the pinnacle of combat rifles. They will be wrong too.