Bersa Thunder 380 recoil

I don't have one, but it looks like the same blowback design of the PPK/S.

My wife has a PPK/S and it's a fairly snappy shooting gun, as you put it. It definitely hammers the webbing of my hand when I shoot it. I don't have a problem with it, as I don't shoot it much. But if I were to put some serious range time in with it, I'd leave the range feeling it.

This is likely because it's a fixed barrel design to the frame and straight blowback function.

So yes... this is a normal feel for this type of design.

How does it feel in the grip? And does it shoot well?

The PK380 uses a tilting barrel locked breach aka Browning style to feed the next cartridge. Typically any firearm that uses a tilting or rotating barrel shoots softer than a straight blowback design in the same cartridge. The Walther also weighs 2oz more which dampens recoil slightly. There are some very nice rubber wraparound grips for the Bersa made by a few companies. Helps fill out the hand and cushion the recoil better than the plastic side plates.
https://www.hogislandgunparts.com/Bersa-Factory-Thunder-380-Firestorm-380-Wrap-Aroun-p/ba-305-31.htm

I have the .380 Thunder and find it a very smooth and accurate(to 15yrds) shooter. So far I have about 200 rounds with it of 95 grain Norma FMJ. Felt recoil is noticeably. less than my mid & compact 9's.

trigga said:

Not as snappy as a Ruger LCP but you get the point.

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How you wrote that is not uncommon.

Recoil is so subjective in the various hands of the beholder.....

I used to own a blowback Beretta 84F. It was a nice gun but I sold it after 200 factory rounds because the left safety lever hit the inside of my right thumb pretty bad while shooting.
I also used to own a locked breech Colt Government 380 stainless and it was a very soft shooter even if it is smaller and lighter than the Beretta 84F.
The locked breech makes all the difference.

When I purchased my Springfield 911 .380 I had the advantage of making a informed decision. My friends had the bersa , the sig, and the Kimber Micro and a PICA or PICO and to me all were very snappy. Not so with the Springfield.

I just got my Beretta 85BB, which supposedly weighs around 23oz unloaded. It has very light recoil to me. I can do very quick follow up shots, as it barely moves the sights off the target.

One thing about this gun is the really strong recoil spring. I don't mind the force needed to rack the slide, but most people would probably not like it. The Beretta 85 is actually harder to rack the slide compared to the 92 9mm, due to being blow back design. I suggest to replace the recoil spring with a really stout one and see if that tames it. I still remember shooting my buddy's 380 Keltec and it was really snappy and painful. The 85 is nothing like that.

As others above have said, maybe make the grip wider. That also makes a big difference.

I bought one in 2008. Love that gun, and never could make it malfunction. I never noticed it being especially snappy, not as much as the PPK/S I had years earlier.

It is a blowback gun, so it will be kind of stiff, but I found it manageable.

trigga said:

... Is the bersa suppose to be snappy?

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Short answer - yes.

Felt recoil is subjective, but all blowback designs have more recoil than you’d expect. Even metal frame handguns. The energy absorbed by the weight of the handgun is generally less that the energy absorbed by JMB’s locked breech design, other things being equal.

I never took notice to how the recoil feels in my thunder. It's nice to shoot though.

danez71 said:

How you wrote that is not uncommon.

Recoil is so subjective in the various hands of the beholder.....

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∆∆∆
This! I have a Fire Storm .380 (a sister to the Bersa Thunder) and a LCP. Love shooting both. Don't really feel any difference in recoil.

The Thunder is pretty snappy. Pretty decent gun for the price, but I wouldn’t say that it’sa joy to shoot.

I have a bersa thunder cc and find it quite mild to shoot.

Are we going to continue this thread with "It's snappy to me.....well it's not to me"?

I have one, that's all I'll say.

In another direction....I was taught the correct way to "rack" a slide is to hold the slide in the off hand close to your body, then to push the frame forward and release the slide to go into battery. Your hand will grip more of the slide than just the serrations. Of course, this assumes the muzzle pointing across your body is also pointing in a safe direction.

I've held some Bersas, but never shot one. They looked pretty similar to the various PP/K derivatives I've owned. I still have four of them, three in 380acp and one in 32acp.

The 380's are fine for some people, and not very good for others.

If you are recoil sensitive, and/or if the grip doesn't fit your hand (too small or wrong shape or whatever), and/or if the heavy recoil spring is hard for you to rack, this is not the pistol for you.

I am not recoil sensitive, the grips are an okay fit for my hands, and racking the slide is no problem for me.

I can shoot the PP-sized 380acp pistols just fine. I don't think a couple hundred rounds would bother me any.

IIRC, the PPK-sized 380 was more challenging and I didn't enjoy shooting much more than half a box of ammo through it at a time. (I haven't shot it for a while.)

The ones I'm familiar with tend to have stiff DA triggers and small fixed sights.

The small sights bother me more than the recoil.


This is a Hungarian PPK "clone" with a steel frame in 380acp. I have to concentrate to shoot it properly with my Xl hands.

The Sig is probably my prettiest "PP-inspired" 380 pistol. Its grip is better shaped than the others, but its frame is aluminum, so that's kind of a wash for "shootability".

The Russian commercial Makarov has better accurately than the others because of the (larger) adjustable sights added for export. Other than that it's pretty much a slightly chunky PP in 380.

The Hungarian PP "clone" in 32acp is very pleasant to shoot. Even though the frame is aluminum, the recoil is much gentler than the 380's. My MiL has badly damaged wrists and she can shoot it just fine.

My Fix for the Bersa 380 Recoil: Wolff Walther PP Recoil Springs

I made a fix for this very problem with Bersa Thunder. It was literally causing wounds on the web of my thumb - it's recoil-spring is WAY to weak at approximately 12 lbs (measured). But the Walther PP springs are same length and coil count, and that sparked an idea...

...I made a video review where I dedicate 60% of the video to how researched, tested, and implemented a mod to reduce the felt recoil with Wolff Walther PP springs (the 18 lb one worked perfectly), and did so with zero reliability problems. I reduced the recoil by at least 40% in my estimate, and made my threaded PLUS model a viable supressor host (again, using a 50% stronger recoil spring, I had ZERO reliability problem - so the spring in Thunder 380 is underpowered solely for easy-racking IMO):



Note: When i Say "Bersa 84" I clearly mean "Beretta 84" in the video. Also mine is the new "TPR" named version, mine being specifically the TPR380 PLUS X - its the same gun with new styling on the slide reminiscent of the TPR9.

HERE IS MY FULL THREAD ON BERSAPISTOLFORUM.COM ON HOW I RESESRCHED, MODDED, AND TESTED THE C0NTENT IN THE VIDEO:

Link: https://www.bersapistolforum.com/threads/threaded-tpr-thunder-380-plus-recoil-spring-upgrades.6826/

My Daughter like her .380 BERSA. She's a little thing but had no problem scoring 100% on her concealed carry qualification.

Congratulations to her, It's good doesn't hurt her hands. I am glad she either had small enough hands, or a low/poor grip, so that the beaver tail doesn't rip up the web of her hand with every shot. That ia a good thing.

However, I would still recommend the recoil-fix, shown above, if you find the gun snappy and the gun is ripping your hand; honestly even if the snappy recoil isn't bothering or injuring you, it's still an excellent idea if you simply want to improve the gun's handling and improve the rate at which you can make a follow up shot!

MORE SO - if you plan on a running a can, I think stronger springs are a necessity - see GBGuns slow motion video on the slides's scary-fast speed when a can's mounted (at the bottom of this post*)

So yes, even if someone makes a snarky remark about how little girls don't have problems with the gun, the modification is still a good idea that improves the firearm, and especially to those of thay the us the gun has injured.

Here's just one example of countless forums-posts and numerous YouTube videos about the Bersa 380 Plus tearing the hell out of peoples hands from excessive recoil pushing on the beaver tail edges:


Here's his whole video on the hand-pain problem; his fix is filing down the beavertail - I prefer my fix above that doesn't damage the finsh, and also gives less recoil with no loss of reliability. Anyways this is his:


Regarding your daughters shooting, that you brought up. I guess It's possible her Bersa has different springs More likely though: she either just doesn't choke up high and strong on the grip, as is the modern practice for accurate shooting, so that the beaver tail isn't pushing on her hand's web. Alternatively, maybe she's gripping it just fine, but her having small hands prevents the problem of the large webbing, that for adult male hands, is causing them to be rubbed raw by the recoil impinging on the beaver-tail.

*Here are screen grabs from the problems the weak spring causes when running a can:



Heres Graham Baates' video on the gun:

RetiredUSNChief said:

This is likely because it's a fixed barrel design to the frame and straight blowback function.

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Yep...I have a .380 Bersa Firestorm that's snappier than my LCP. The blowbackdesign makes it a tack driver for sure.

WheelGunMan said:

Yep...I have a .380 Bersa Firestorm that's snappier than my LCP. The blowbackdesign makes it a tack driver for sure.

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Thats undoubtedly true. However with a simple spring upgrade, it shoots softly without issue, and remains a tac-driver

If a Hi-point blowback 380 can shoot softly (which they do), a blowback Bersa 380 can as well - you just gotta mod it with the stronger springs.

It really does shoot softly & reliably with that fix I posted above; the stronger recoil springs are needed, and more appropriate, in my strong opinion. If they caused ANY reliability issues I would change my tune on that though.

Thats what I don't get, If the 18 lb spring works fine, I am baffled as to why the gun comes stock with a ~12 lb spring.

Pretty sure the mass of the slide is what mostly controls the "unlocking" in blowback systems, but I could be wrong about that. Raising the spring weight so much (to 18 from 12) will increase slide speed as rounds are stripped from the magazine. This would invite greater wear I'd expect, along with increasing required racking force needed. Bersa engineers probably had an engineering-based idea when they specified the springs

Mine is stock and works fine, but I agree it snaps more than a comparable locked breech design. Accurate and reliable, and cheap. Hard to beat for the cash.

unclenunzie said:

Pretty sure the mass of the slide is what mostly controls the "unlocking" in blowback systems, but I could be wrong about that. Raising the spring weight so much (to 18 from 12) will increase slide speed as rounds are stripped from the magazine. This would invite greater wear I'd expect, along with increasing required racking force needed. Bersa engineers probably had an engineering-based idea when they specified the springs

Mine is stock and works fine, but I agree it snaps more than a comparable locked breech design. Accurate and reliable, and cheap. Hard to beat for the cash.

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Nice grip panels by the way, I have mine on order.

But yes it's actually both the mass of the slide and the strength of the recoil spring that determines the opening-rate / slide-speed on a blowback firearm (technically it would be the mass of the "bolt", not the "slide", when talking about blowback carbines/sub-guns - but obviously we're talking about handguns here).

On a blowback firearm you can compensate for low mass with a stronger spring and vice versa. There were early 9mm blowbacks attempted (see forgottenweapons.com) that didn't want to have a massive slide so they used a VERY strong spring. The problem was, though the system worked, you couldn't cycle the gun by hand - they literally had to add a mechanism that allowed you rack the slide by pressing a switch that disengaged the recoil spring - otherwise the spring was to strong to cycle the weapon by hand...

...I forget which gun that was on forgottenweapons, but it definitely was a unique way of using almost exclusively a stronger spring with a small slide to avoid the need for a massive slide like the ones present on Hi-Points.

So ultimately its the combination of the two, slide-mass & spring-strength, that controls the rate at which the slide opens on a Blowback firearm. But if your spring is too weak, you need a more massive slide; and if your slide is too light, you need a stronger spring.

That's why with the Bersa 380s a stronger spring, in my opinion, should be stock with the Bersa guns. As my own tests have shown me, the gun functions perfectly fine with a stronger spring - which greatly reduces the felt recoil by slowing the speed at which slide moves, and the the force it hits with and the end of its travel.

The speed and mass of the slide when it hits the back of it's travel on the frame is what determines the majority of felt recoil. It was not uncommon to add buffer springs at the end of travel on early blowback designs (again see forgottenweapons.com videos on older 20th century blowback guns).

One thing I can tell you about using the stronger 18lb spring, as I mention in the video, is that a female or handicapped individual would have a hard time racking the slide with the hammer up. I think this is the reason their engineers used a weaker spring than the gun's action could tolerate - I feel steongly that they likely traded lowered felt-recoil for the slide being far easier to rack.

Truly, I don't believe many females would be able to rack my Bersa 380 slide with the 18lb spring in it (not unless they cocked the hammer first).

those direct blowback guns are no fun to me over .32acp power. my Beretta and Walther are .32acp for this reason.