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223 loading FPS spread?

R

rparker1866

Member
Joined
Oct 28, 2022
Messages
27
hello
loading 223 with AA2230. tried both CCI small rifle primers and N0-41 primers
16 in barrel. tried 22 gr of AA2230 to 24 grains with the 77 gr boat tail hollow point.
i am getting 150 to 200 FPS Spread. 2818 to 2614.
the 2 grain differance does not make any differance with FPS.
what FPS spread should you be looking for?

thanks
 
I don't understand what your asking. Changing the load will change the velocity unless you hit a node or maxed out. If you hit a node the velocity will flatten for a small band before it starts increasing again. Most all powders will increase velocity as the charge weight goes up. More important is the ES and SD number for accuracy. If your just punching paper velocity does not really matter as long as it's accurate. If shooting long range, the less time the bullet is in flight the better, less impact by wind.
 
Don't know what your case fill is, but with a 77 I would expect 2520. The case fill may be causing irratic ignition.
 
im asking how consistent you FPS should be. or does it matter that there is a 200 FPS spread.
the layman manual says 22 gr to 24.2 grwith that bulett. the manual has FPS from 2500 to 2800 fps. but with a 24in barrel.
not put it on paper yet. im just wondering about FPS spread.
ive got factory ammo comming with that 77gr BTHP to see how consistent that is.
thanks
 
rparker1866 said:
im asking how consistent you FPS should be. or does it matter that there is a 200 FPS spread.
the layman manual says 22 gr to 24.2 grwith that bulett. the manual has FPS from 2500 to 2800 fps. but with a 24in barrel.
not put it on paper yet. im just wondering about FPS spread.
ive got factory ammo comming with that 77gr BTHP to see how consistent that is.
thanks
Click to expand...

You certainly will see a couple hundred FPS spread on over 2 grains of charge difference. Thats completely normal. Pick the best group of the charges tested that was safe in your gun.
For example, if 23gr offered the best group, then use 23gr. ES/SD is a different story and that is something you have to measure with the chronograph.
 
rparker1866 said:
im asking how consistent you FPS should be. or does it matter that there is a 200 FPS spread.
the layman manual says 22 gr to 24.2 grwith that bulett. the manual has FPS from 2500 to 2800 fps. but with a 24in barrel.
not put it on paper yet. im just wondering about FPS spread.
ive got factory ammo comming with that 77gr BTHP to see how consistent that is.
thanks
Click to expand...
30fps isn't great 50fps is bad and over 100 is totally unacceptable. If your not 8lbs deep in that powder change....
 
I believe the OP is asking about extreme spread. I’ve been through this with AA2200 and it was terrible. No matter if it was the starting load or max load, my extreme spread was well over 100fps. I believe I improved the situation by crimping tighter. (not crimping at all in the beginning) I don’t remember details as I found better powders and abandoned the fast burn powders.
 
Hartkopf said:
I don’t remember details as I found better powders and abandoned the fast burn powders.
Click to expand...

Hartkopf said:
ETA; looks like standard primers helped dramatically over magnum primers with the fast powder. (AA2200)
Click to expand...

Imma guess that AA2230 is waaay too fast for those 77grn bullets... OP is going to need something a little slower.

Some powders are quite picky about primers... I found that out with TAC, which absolutely hates Magnum primers, at least in .308.
 
Charlie98 said:
Imma guess that AA2230 is waaay too fast for those 77grn bullets... OP is going to need something a little slower.

Some powders are quite picky about primers... I found that out with TAC, which absolutely hates Magnum primers, at least in .308.
Click to expand...

like what? i couldnt find varget.
 
rparker1866 said:
like what? i couldnt find varget.
Click to expand...
Accurate 2495 has been available in my area, it is a stick powder and may require a trickler.
Are you paying much attention to the COAL? If you are measuring a loaded round with calipers the bullet tips of open tip match bullets can be inconsistent.
I haven't tried AR Comp yet, it is on my list of powders to try for 223 Rem.
 
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joneb said:
Accurate 2495 has been available in my area, it is a stick powder and may require a trickler.
Are you paying much attention to the COAL? If you are measuring a loaded round with calipers the bullet tips of match bullets are inconsistent.
Click to expand...
I think that powder may be a hidden gem as it's one that I believe is extruded, hidden in a family of ball powders. Haven't tried it yet but I'm working through the 63 pounds I have on hand already.
 
Currently loading 69 SMK, 69 RMR and 77 SMK with 24.2 TAC for my 8 twist Wylde Service rifle. I use the CCI 41 primers when I can get them, small rifle mag when I can't.
Meters great through the Dillon. Kinda dirty but groups right up, well....when I do my part anyways. Excellent velocity as well.
I use a lot of 2230 with 60 gr Hornady softpoints in my practice upper. Very passable accuracy.
 
spudgun said:
Currently loading 69 SMK, 69 RMR and 77 SMK with 24.2 TAC for my 8 twist Wylde Service rifle. I use the CCI 41 primers when I can get them, small rifle mag when I can't.
Meters great through the Dillon. Kinda dirty but groups right up, well....when I do my part anyways. Excellent velocity as well.
I use a lot of 2230 with 60 gr Hornady softpoints in my practice upper. Very passable accuracy.
Click to expand...
24.2 is what I'm running with the 69rmr. Plenty fun.
 
rparker1866 said:
what FPS spread should you be looking for?
Click to expand...

I generally am satisfied by loads with true single digit SD’s (standard deviation). That typically will yield ES’s in the mid to upper 20’s to low to mid 30’s. I may tweak a few things if I’m seeing high single digit SD’s, but I won’t try to squeeze blood from a stone to turn a 6 SD into a 4.

Reminding a bit here - one simple litmus test for chronograph data: if your ES is not 4-6x your SD, you know you have not fired enough rounds to have statistical validity for either number. Not enough rounds to have confidence the results are meaningful.

But, not for any load in my life would I tolerate 200fps ES.
 
i wonder if the 16in barell is to short. all the isnt getting burned at a consistant rate
 
rparker1866 said:
i wonder if the 16in barell is to short. all the isnt getting burned at a consistant rate
Click to expand...

Not a thing, especially in 223. That’s simply not how the physics (or thermodynamics, really), of internal ballistics works. Far too many of us get consistent velocities out of short barreled 223’s, even half as long as your 16” barrel, and far too many of us get consistent velocities out of even larger cases in even shorter barrels - we know this hypothesis is already disproven.

The most likely culprits for big velocity spreads are poor primary ignition (which can have a few different root causes, a few spelled out here), inconsistent internal capacity (mixed range brass, for example), wrong powder choice for bullet weight, inconsistent charge weight, poor fill ratio for the powder chosen, and inconsistent neck tension (which can have a few independent root causes also).
 
Last edited:
What are you using for brass? I'm happy to use mixed range pick up stuff for some stuff, but it does vary.... a lot.
 
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