grampajack
AR Junkie
- Joined
- Mar 31, 2016
- Messages
- 1,714
I've gotten very interested in blow forward pistols recently, and I was wondering if anyone can explain exactly how the Schwarzlose feeds. Unfortunately, I do not have one to study.
The same way any other pistol feeds, except the ramp is moving, not the cartridge . . . .I've gotten very interested in blow forward pistols recently, and I was wondering if anyone can explain exactly how the Schwarzlose feeds. Unfortunately, I do not have one to study.
Are you sure about that? Look closely at the breechface, marked with "S" and where the round is positioned in the two drawings.The same way any other pistol feeds, except the ramp is moving, not the cartridge . . .
Patent drawing notwithstanding, have you looked at the barrel/breech area of a Schwarzlose?The slide-barrel assembly, while moving forward, partially strips a round from the magazine (forward direction), clearing the magazine feed lips and preparing it to feed into the chamber.
Are you sure about that? Look closely at the breechface, marked with "S" and where the round is positioned in the two drawings.
View attachment 765351
The slide-barrel assembly, while moving forward, partially strips a round from the magazine (forward direction), clearing the magazine feed lips and preparing it to feed into the chamber.
Are you sure about that? Look closely at the breechface, marked with "S" and where the round is positioned in the two drawings.
View attachment 765351
All firearms have the same recoil characteristics up until the bullet leaves the barrel. A split second after the bullet leaves the barrel, semi autos theoretically shorten the duration of the recoil impulse by unlocking the bolt/slide. To be honest, I'm not sure how much recoil reduction this means in real life. I've never shot a semi auto and said Wow, that feels so much softer than a single shot. I've fired my ARs in single shot mode before, and I can't say there was really any perceptible difference. I've also shot a lot of different shells through break over, pump, and semi auto shotguns, and at the end of the day it pretty much boils down to the shells themselves. Low brass feels good in everything, and high brass feels terrible in everything. To me, the biggest determination in recoil is the weight of the gun and whether it has a muzzle brake, not what kind of action it has.Any way you look at it all the energy opposing the acceleration of the bullet is turned into recoil (heat too but that's univerdal). Some handguns have a much shorter cycle time for that which is felt as a harsh snap, the locked breech handguns slow it down and segment it so it feels like less. This system, it seems to me, converts some energy into accelerating the slide forward too, but it's the same cycle period as a blowback. I'm interested in any first hand opinions on this. It may be that the slide hitting it's stop and then coming back adds a second snap to it, back sharply, forward sharply, and back again.
I've heard the pain was due to the shape of the grip. Built a little more ergonomically, it might not be that bad.The videos show that blowforward action is painful to shoot in .32 ACP. Makes me wonder how it got past the research&development stage and actually hit the market (to fail). But we did get the word masochism from Europe, too.
The only advantage I see is you get an extra inch or so barrel length and maybe a slight gain in muzzle velocity over a conventional pistol of the same overall length.
I'm not sure if I understand. Bullet weight shouldn't matter, regardless of action, as the bullet leaves the barrel before anything unlocks. This is something all guns have in common, is that the breach stays closed until after the bullet is completely out of the barrel.I rethought my statement about energy being the same, if the mass going forward is far heavier than what the shooter is hanging onto then yes, the same cartridge will give different results. Imagine a 1 lb. bullet and a handle weighing 80 grains, most of the rearward impulse would be at bullet velocities. Ouch!
The energy is the same, but the extent of it going whichever direction changes. This gun with the slide moving forward very fast and the area of handle against the palm would likely result in a harsh recoil, and again, the recoil would be back, then forward as the slide stops moving forward, and then back again when the slide goes into battery.
Can't really say I have either, But to do this properly you must have an autoloader that can turn off the gas system. I have fired M-14s and M-1As with the gas system turned off, and then on. Can't really say the former had any more recoil than the latter.I've never shot a semi auto and said Wow, that feels so much softer than a single shot.
It's really simple. First of all, you have to understand that the barrel doesn't move until long after the bullet has left the barrel (relatively speaking), so the pressure has dropped considerably before anything starts moving, which is how all semi autos keep from blowing up. I'm just taking a wild guess here, but I would imagine that the pressure in the barrel is probably less than a thousand psi when the thing actually opens. Who know, may be a lot more, but the point is that by the time the works start moving there's not much high pressure gas exiting the muzzle to push it rearwards at that point.Can't really say I have either, But to do this properly you must have an autoloader that can turn off the gas system. I have fired M-14s and M-1As with the gas system turned off, and then on. Can't really say the former had any more recoil than the latter.
What I can't understand is how this pistol works AT ALL! What moves the barrel forward? Is it the friction between the bullet and the barrel pulling the latter forward? Magic elves? The power of the Force? I gotta think the bullet has to leave the barrel before much of anything can happen. Then you are left with the high pressure gasses exiting the bore, in a forward direction, which would push rearward on the gun. What moves the slide??
Something does, as the gun exists and it works. I gotta do some research.
If there's any movement at all, it's very slight. Like a few millimeters at most. I've never seen any gun that even started to unlock before the bullet was out of the barrel.Actually....if anything acts like a piston it would be the bullet itself. Granted there must be some amount of force to engrave the rifling and friction as the bullet is pushed down the barrel....both of which will impart some forward thrust to the barrel. While the powder is burning and the bullet is within the barrel that pressure pushing the bullet also by friction will be pushing the barrel forward. The blowback type action normally does start to have slide movement while the bullet is still in the barrel...but not enough to allow the case to withdraw past the thick web where it's strong enough to withstand being blown out. Without this movement imparting inertia the slide would likely not be able to complete the action cycle.
What I can't understand is how this pistol works AT ALL! What moves the barrel forward? Is it the friction between the bullet and the barrel pulling the latter forward? Magic elves? The power of the Force? .
What I'm not getting is how the cartridge is held in place once it clears the feed lips. Let's say you held the gun upside down while shooting it. Would it just fall out?The slide-barrel assembly, while moving forward, partially strips a round from the magazine (forward direction), clearing the magazine feed lips and preparing it to feed into the chamber.
Are you sure about that? Look closely at the breechface, marked with "S" and where the round is positioned in the two drawings.
View attachment 765351
You couldn't even shoot it holding it sideways. I guess no shooting under vehicles either.The cartridge just sits on top of the magazine - no upside down shooting, sorry!