My first AR. Fixed sights or no?

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So, I'm going to spitball that you're in the $500-600 range budget-wise? I'm just guessing that based off of the two models you listed.

If that's the case, my personal recommendation would be to go outside of the two you've narrowed it down to. What I would do would do, to get what you seem to desire, is buy a seperate PSA lower and upper. I know it's not technically a "complete" AR but literally all you have to do is pop 2 pins to assemble it. I'm a moron when it comes to mechanical stuff, and I managed it. ;)

Looking at PSA, seems their selection of uppers is pretty thin at the moment, but they do have their inexpensive classic lower in stock. So, perhaps that lower and this upper I linked below from MidwayUSA? Add a set of Magpul flip up sights and you're in business. I'd prefer a PSA upper if they come in stock, but I've heard decent things about AR Stoner.

https://palmettostatearmory.com/complete-psa-ar-15-lower-classic-edition.html

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1022408548?pid=851270
 
I've gotta ask. What is it about the M&P that you didn't like? If you're on a tight budget, you're probably trying to settle for something. Are you considering the DPMS just because of the lack of a front sight?

I just looked up the DPMS Oracle and what stuck me was what wasn't said on the spec sheet. No mention of M4 feed ramps. No mention of the barrel being chrome lined or whether it has any sort of lining or treatment. It did say that the barrel has a 1:9 twist rate. I wouldn't buy this rifle.

I think the Ruger with the front sight tower is the better deal. At least it's a 1:8 twist and the spec sheet at least sounds like someone knew what they were doing. But what's with the funky front sight tower. And pinned on the top?

Personally, I'd take another look at the M&P. It's actually a pretty good rifle and I'm seeing them sell at my local range for $650 out the door. A front sight tower on an HD weapon is always a good idea, but I'll admit that my current one doesn't have a tower on it, but flip ups. Get a basic M&P and put a good dot on top of it. Primary Arms is selling Romeo4M's for $199 right now. If you don't like the handguards, check out places like ar15handguard.com for a cheap set of drop ins. Shoot, even the stuff from UTG isn't bad these days. If I'm not mistaken, Smith has an M&P optics ready MOE model. That would be good to go. You wouldn't need to replace anything on that until you decided to free float.

Don't choose one rifle over another just because it doesn't have a front sight on it, especially not that DPMS. Just remember, when you buy a gun that has stuff you don't like, you're still paying for the stuff that you don't like and will pay for the stuff that you replace it with later. Find a good basic gun that you can add stuff to rather than having to replace it.

If you really don't want the front sight tower, look at an optics ready model. It will likely have a gas block rail for adding a front sight.
 
12Bravo20 said:
Yes there is a difference in height of the sight base and a difference in the length of the sight post between an F marked and standard front sight base. The F Marked FSB was designed originally for the M4 Carbine and the M16A4.
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These days, it's hard to find a barrel assembly with a front sight base that isn't "F" marked. This a problem if you're assembling a retro A1 or A2 with a non-removable carry handle. The "F" tower is taller, to account for the extra height of a removable carry handle (or a BUIS on a flat-top receiver).
 
Well I took into account everyone's suggestions and went back to my LGS. They had just gotten in a Ruger MPR with the American flag Cerakote finish on it. I had it side by side with the Ruger I was going to buy, and the regular 556 was losing its appeal. The MPR had everything I wanted, free floating hand rail, Magpul furniture, 2 stage trigger, and it was only $145 more. After some negotiating with my wife, I got approval to spend some extra money. I know it doesn't have fixed sights, but I am going to put some flip up sights on it. Maybe I made a mistake, but it felt like a much higher quality rifle than the regular ar556.

Thanks again for everyones suggestions. I have a 2x4.5 scope I can put in it for now until I get some quality iron sights
 
Jbird45 said:
Will the sight get in the way of a scope or red dot if I decide to put one on?
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Others have said it won't interfere with the use of a red dot scope, but all I can say is it does interfere with *my* use of a red dot. Seeing both the red dot aiming point and the stock front site when aiming the gun produced a confusing sight picture for me that slowed me down and drove me mad. I ended up having to have the original front sight removed and replaced with a flip up sight. YMMV.
 
Jbird45 said:
and I have narrowed it down to the DPMS Oracle or the Ruger AR-556. These are within my budget, and I'm not really interested in the m&p after shooting one that a friend has. I have shot the Oracle, but not the Ruger.
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What did you not like about the M&P? I have an M&P and my brother has a Ruger AR556, and honestly if you prevented me from seeing the gun and had me shoot both I'd never know the difference. Same with my buddy's FN 15 Carbine, the feel and performance is about the same with all the factory M4gery's.
 
I have ONE AR in my safe with a fixed front sight base. I only have 3 with iron sights at all, and more often, I look at them as an unfortunate waste of rail space and money. Having beat the hell out of several of my AR’s over ~20yrs for action shooting sports, defensive carbine courses, and run & gun predator hunting, I’m quite comfortable with the durability of optics and mounts. My only “back up sight” I use are scope riding or 45deg red dots.
 
I wasn't a fan of the pistol grip they used or the trigger. I realize these can be easily swapped, so I shouldn't have been quick to denounce it. Its not a bad performer, I just didn't like the feel of this 2 things. Maybe Ruger uses pretty much the same trigger, but the mp has that little bump on the pistol grip that I find annoying. And my buddies DPMS has a better trigger than the MP I shot, but in its defense I never asked my friend if it was a stock DPMS trigger or if he upgraded it
 
Jbird45 said:
I wasn't a fan of the pistol grip they used or the trigger. I realize these can be easily swapped, so I shouldn't have been quick to denounce it. Its not a bad performer, I just didn't like the feel of this 2 things. Maybe Ruger uses pretty much the same trigger, but the mp has that little bump on the pistol grip that I find annoying.
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Just FYI for future reference. The pistol grip on the MP with the "little bump" is a standard M4 grip. If a person doesn't like the little bump they can buy another grip, or easily file the bump off. In the event they **** up the filing in some way, those grips can be replaced for roughly the cost of a cheeseburger. ;)
 
Jbird45 said:
I wasn't a fan of the pistol grip they used or the trigger. I realize these can be easily swapped, so I shouldn't have been quick to denounce it. Its not a bad performer, I just didn't like the feel of this 2 things. Maybe Ruger uses pretty much the same trigger, but the mp has that little bump on the pistol grip that I find annoying. And my buddies DPMS has a better trigger than the MP I shot, but in its defense I never asked my friend if it was a stock DPMS trigger or if he upgraded it
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Be very careful, now that you have bought your first AR. You are on the edge of a very deep dark hole and it’s very easy to get lost if you fall in. ;)
097A76AE-8FFB-47D1-8552-DA7F3BDB5AD9.jpeg
 
bearcreek said:
Just FYI for future reference. The pistol grip on the MP with the "little bump" is a standard M4 grip. If a person doesn't like the little bump they can buy another grip, or easily file the bump off. In the event they **** up the filing in some way, those grips can be replaced for roughly the cost of a cheeseburger. ;)
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And I wasn't trying to imply it was a bad gun, but after shooting my friends I wasn't itching to buy one. That is just simply my preference. Maybe if I shot another one my opinion would change. Or if I upgraded one.

But that being said, I think I am going to be very happy with my new MPR
 
Jbird45 said:
And I wasn't trying to imply it was a bad gun, but after shooting my friends I wasn't itching to buy one. That is just simply my preference. Maybe if I shot another one my opinion would change. Or if I upgraded one.

But that being said, I think I am going to be very happy with my new MPR
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Oh, I would agree that you made the better choice. I was just passing along the info about that grip. Nothing to do with it being on an M&P.
 
bearcreek said:
Oh, I would agree that you made the better choice. I was just passing along the info about that grip. Nothing to do with it being on an M&P.
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Well thank you for clarifying! I really don't know much about AR's. I grew up around hunting rifles but as far as I know I'm the first one in my extended family and in-laws to buy an AR. Looking forward to some range time!
 
GunnyUSMC said:
Be very careful, now that you have bought your first AR. You are on the edge of a very deep dark hole and it’s very easy to get lost if you fall in. ;)
View attachment 921151
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We're meeting up at Gunny's house when the zombies roll into town ... Just BYO ammo.

Jbird45 said:
Will the sight get in the way of a scope or red dot if I decide to put one on?
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This response has been overtaken by events (OP already purchased) but, I do have a budget LPVO (VORTEX Strike Eagle) on an M-4 with a fixed front (FSB) block, and really, it's possible to get to the point where you don't notice the front sight when using the optic (if illuminated).
 
I love the fixed sights, and they can be removed, or cut, but hammering out the pins, and putting it aside is better, gasblocks are cheap, but the triangle sights are not replaceable once cut if you decide you want it back. A screw in gas block can be found for 20$.
 
GunnyUSMC said:
I have ammo too. If you don’t have ammo, bring sand bags.
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For some reason that scene from Gran Torino comes to mind... in this case with zombies... "stack 'em five feet high, use 'em for sandbags." OTOH, it may be better not to handle those. Well, I guess telling them "get off my lawn" is out. :uhoh: No, wrong thread for this one... gotta have a Garand for that.
 
bassjam said:
What did you not like about the M&P? I have an M&P and my brother has a Ruger AR556, and honestly if you prevented me from seeing the gun and had me shoot both I'd never know the difference. Same with my buddy's FN 15 Carbine, the feel and performance is about the same with all the factory M4gery's.
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I have the S&W and the Ruger. Both work fine and my experience parallels yours. The only real difference is the ergonomics of the pistol grip and fore arm, and that really only brings subjective personal taste into it.

Sigh ... yeeeup, these things multiply at night. I am just now figuring this out .....:evil: :what:
 
I’ve been playing around with a standard grip a bit. Chopped the bottom off about even with where the texture starts, removed the bump and blended it with my upper...https://photos.app.goo.gl/TzTVHZh6ANhatyEw9

It’s actually really comfortable. I’m gonna take it out and run some drills with it. If I like it, I’ll likely replace it with a BCM Mod0 grip.
 
Out of curiosity, what turned you away from the M&P? I’m not asking in the defense of the M&P, but I ask simply because the M&P usually receives positive reviews. Thanks.
 
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