Same lot code, different cans

I would combine them. I sometimes end up with several open bottles of the same powder and I'll combine them. Is there some small differences between batches of powder ? Most likely, but I don't work up a new load for every bottle.

reloaded_in_pa said:

I would combine them. I sometimes end up with several open bottles of the same powder and I'll combine them. Is there some small differences between batches of powder ? Most likely, but I don't work up a new load for every bottle.

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Gasp! You will surely come to an untimely, sudden and painful demise as a result of such unwise behavior.

45Bink said:

Last Fall my FIL gave me an unopened 1# metal can of IMR 4227. I subsequently opened it and used a little. A couple weeks ago, while visiting him, he gave me another partial can. The lot codes match, I'm sure they were stored together, they both pass the smell test.

Can I combine them to save space?

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Metal can of powder ? Sounds like older stuff

Combine them.
I have noticed that you can fit nearly 2lb in some 1lb containers.

45Bink said:

Last Fall my FIL gave me an unopened 1# metal can of IMR 4227. I subsequently opened it and used a little. A couple weeks ago, while visiting him, he gave me another partial can. The lot codes match, I'm sure they were stored together, they both pass the smell test.

Can I combine them to save space?

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Before you combine them, verify with pops-in-law that he didn't buy 8#'ers and use them to refill empty cans for easier handling. A lot of folks do that and it used to be recommended by loaders who did benchrest load development at the range. My FiL is that way: he bought a few of the small 3lb cans of W296 decades ago and keeps refilling them and a 1lb pop-bottle can from newer 8lb plastic jugs. It makes them easier to store, he says. The cans are easier to work with, he says. They look better and metal is better for powder anyway, he says. I don't say nuthin'.

Couldn't hurt to check before combining but even if they are different lots, just go through normal load development processes with the combined powders and keep sniffing the can.

In those circumstances, I would just consolidate the powder - likely in the better condition can. And I would gently shake them up after doing so to mix both cans.
In the same lot number, they should be of the same batch and the same 'exact' burn rate. Gently stirring them together is not a must, but it settles my OCD a bit.

As long as the powder looks the same, I have no issues mixing powder of the same type even of it’s from different lots. Once it’s mixed, it becomes a new lot and will even out the low and high between the two former lots.

I have some h110 and 296 from various lots. Some of it doesn’t look the same, and in that instance I don’t mix it, though, it would load the same.

I pour powder from a keg into a smaller can, but I label it with the lot number.

45Bink said:

Good thought on the refills idea, but nope, they were just purchased at the same time individually. I'll mix these two, but not the others of other lots that he gave me. Sure liked that 4227 in my 45 Colt!

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Even better. IMR 4227 has been one of my goto powders for a long time.

I do not want to steal the thread but does everyone work up a new load when they buy new powder?

I’ve never heard of that before.

I’ve bought 2-3 lbs of hunting rifle powder, it lasts a looong time after load development. Then bought more when I got short. I never worked up a new load. Of course I shoot the load to make sure the gun/scope are still shooting well.

45Bink said:

Can I combine them to save space?

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Only if the weight is the same when dropped at the same volume. Outgassing can reduce the weight if powder is left open or the age is different.

I had 2 cans of IMR 4895. The same vintage. 1 went bad, the other didnt. I dont mix the same lot number. More so if i dont know at what temperature it was stored at.

kalielkslayer said:

does everyone work up a new load when they buy new powder?

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Yes, if a maximum loading only. My testing show the new container is always heavier by volume then the old powder. Checked 3 different types. Outgassing.

A test online showed a 10% difference between fastest & slowest lots of H4831 powder. https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/citations/ADA572333

Hodgdon will sell a powder made in 2 different countries. Same container, except marked from a different country.

Example, Canada & Australia. IMR 4198.

45Bink said:

Can I combine them to save space?

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Yes.

243winxb said:

Yes, if a maximum loading only. My testing show the new container is always heavier by volume then the old powder. Checked 3 different types. Outgassing.

A test online showed a 10% difference between fastest & slowest lots of H4831 powder. https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/citations/ADA572333

Hodgdon will sell a powder made in 2 different countries. Same container, except marked from a different country.

Example, Canada & Australia. IMR 4198.

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I saw that recently with Accurate No.2: the old pound bottle from around 2015/16 had a VMD of 0.0838 and the new pound bottle from 2020 has a VMD of 0.0962. Their weight-per-volume will therefore be different. The question I have yet to answer (lacking time to work it up) is if the same weight charge will give the same velocity using a known bullet in a known firearm. The test is an old standby load of 3.2gr. of No.2 under a 160gr. Lyman 358311 (Linotype) from a 1928 Colt Official Police 6".

I would go ahead and combine cans of the same lot number.

My pistol ammo loading is rather coarse, but I am buying powder in 8 lb kegs. That means that when it finally runs low, back mixing the residue into the next 8 lbs is a small change if any.

When shooting F class, I was lucky, I did not get lot to lot swings with Varget, even though I had read of it.

I have a little H322 left from each producer in Scotland and Australia. They are clearly different and I will not combine them.

On the other hand, in my BPCR period, I had separate powders for .38-55 and .40-65; different lots of Swiss 1 1/2 Fg.

243winxb said:

Only if the weight is the same when dropped at the same volume. Outgassing can reduce the weight if powder is left open or the age is different.

I had 2 cans of IMR 4895. The same vintage. 1 went bad, the other didnt. I dont mix the same lot number. More so if i dont know at what temperature it was stored at.

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My wife reminded me of this when I mentioned a few topics being talked about lately. Made me laugh... then made me think.

The Rule of "Probably Safe"
There once was famous baker who decided to share his talent with the world by offering baking lessons to promising amateurs. Several times a year, he would place ads in local papers and interview students by their submissions at a public tasting featuring equally famous food critics as judges. A very nervous fellow showed up with an exquisite smelling bread offering, featuring Marmite (a savoury food spread based on yeast extract) and poppy seeds, which all present loved. When he was chosen to be a future student, the baker asked, "What was the secret ingredient in your bread? I detected a flavor I'm not familiar with and, given I have an expert's palate, I need to know." The fellow him'd and haw'd then blurted out, "I'm not really sure, mind you but, it could be... ummm, the cat." "The CAT?" exclaimed the baker. "You didn't COOK...?!" "Oh, no-no!," said the fellow, "no, you see when I was punching down the dough after it's second rise, I added the poppy seeds and Marmite... then I got a call and had to leave for a few minutes. When I got back, the cat was on the counter, sniffing the dough. I'm not sure - in fact I'm pretty sure - she didn't walk across the dough or touch it... but after the bread went into the oven I did notice she had just used the box... But, I'm sure if there was any cat poo in there, it's probably very little and purrfectly safe!"

Would YOU (talking to the group, not @243winxb ) like to try that bread? When you add things together, think about the Rule of "Probably Safe"

LOVE Marmite!
Wife detests it.
Never let the cat near your dough.
I'd probably try the bread, though.

Marmite is nasty. A NZ friend had some that was supposed to be good as far as marmite goes. No.

Personally I think this lot number stuff is overblown. If it is so important wouldn't the powder companies have to reissue their loading data every time? I still use load data from the '70s. Could there be a slight variation, I guess so. Is it really that important, don't think so. Are there actual verified accounts of this being a problem and causing damage or injury? Do the powder companies warn against it?

barnfrog said:

LOVE Marmite!
Wife detests it.
Never let the cat near your dough.
I'd probably try the bread, though.

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LOL!!!

Yeah, I tried Marmite as a kid. My granny put it on toast with butter and a sprinkle of sugar as a treat. It's good stuff, for sure. The story is an old one and I've seen a few variations. Moral is, you don't pollute something good and wholesome with something undesirable. In this instance, if you have a powder that's starting to show signs of age or degradation, you don't want to mix it in with some that's not showing any signs of a problem. It's not going to stop degrading and will take the good with it when it goes completely bad.

jag22 said:

Personally I think this lot number stuff is overblown. If it is so important wouldn't the powder companies have to reissue their loading data every time? I still use load data from the '70s. Could there be a slight variation, I guess so. Is it really that important, don't think so. Are there actual verified accounts of this being a problem and causing damage or injury? Do the powder companies warn against it?

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How close to the ragged edge do you load? Have you tried R22? It likes to be loaded hot and has some very noticeable lot to lot variances. Like blowing primers with what was a good load. Or inaccurate because it's on the low pressure side.
Your mileage may vary.