This Grinds My Gears and It's bfalcon00 Fault

Those primers' offcenter firing pin marks alone make me further yet concerned about any larger shift to small primer 10mm. I would prefer we leave 45 auto and 10mm to large primer, and Vista et al instead produce and make available to us loaders the large pistol leadfree primer.

45s, 10s, and I looked at the last batch of 308 I bought from Midway....srp

Unfortunately, Vista doesn't care what we think.

Jonny2guns said:

45s, 10s, and I looked at the last batch of 308 I bought from Midway....srp

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I would gladly trade you for 308 lrp brass.

Yeah I think sorting for primer size is here to stay. As annoying as it is. I look forward to the tests though.

AJC1 said:

I would gladly trade you for 308 lrp brass.

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I only have 50 and I have a good amount of lrp, I think I'll put them back for if I really need srp 308.

I noticed the same thing recently while sorting my 10 mm brass on the primers would not go in.

But also consider this, in days of supply chain shortages and switchovers and lower production volume, if they commonize to two sizes effectively for 90% of your ammo you will see more primers and be easier to stock.

I said a while back - and repeated it recently - that the industry has been trying very hard to obsolete large primers and push the use of small primers for everything. From their manufacturing standpoint it just makes sense. I got pilloried for voicing that opinion but now we’re seeing it evolve in real time. Get ready. You’ve got three, maybe four, years to gather all the large primers you need to last the life of your brass before you’re forced to switch by availability.

GeoDudeFlorida said:

I said a while back - and repeated it recently - that the industry has been trying very hard to obsolete large primers and push the use of small primers for everything. From their manufacturing standpoint it just makes sense. I got pilloried for voicing that opinion but now we’re seeing it evolve in real time. Get ready. You’ve got three, maybe four, years to gather all the large primers you need to last the life of your brass before you’re forced to switch by availability.

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Man I hope you are wrong about that. It sure is starting to look like you are on to something though.

Maybe because I like reloading or I have plenty of time and have never been rushed reloading, I cannot see why some complain about inspecting their brass. Perhaps some can't tell the difference in large vs small primer pockets but really all it takes is a little practice and 1.25 seconds. I have both large (lots) large primed 45 ACP brass and maybe around 400 small primed brass. All it takes when first inspection (normal reloading procedure first step) is looking at the case head. I will be using my small primed brass more now that my small primer stash is larger than my large pistol supply. No big deal, and I don't believe any of the "Conspiracy Theories" about manufacturere banding together to remove large pistol primers from all ammo...

Is very annoying, no doubt.

I perfur lpps. Both because of my large fingers & fading eyesight.

Barr said:

I noticed the same thing recently while sorting my 10 mm brass on the primers would not go in.

But also consider this, in days of supply chain shortages and switchovers and lower production volume, if they commonize to two sizes effectively for 90% of your ammo you will see more primers and be easier to stock.

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I'm all for going to small pistol primers for all pistols. But rifles need large rifle primers for igniting ball powder in large cases in cold weather.

Jonny2guns said:

I only have 50 and I have a good amount of lrp, I think I'll put them back for if I really need srp 308.

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That's a good plan. I haven't been able to get any and having the ability to load with what's available is gooder...

Dang, I'm glad 9mms already use small primers. That would be a monstrous pain in the bacon.

This standardization sounds like a good plan to me,
But alas, it’s gonna work about as well as the combination of SAE and Metric has over the last 30+ years.
And yes Dillon 550 is a pain to change from L to S.
I’m glad 38/357 is SPP already

SPP in 10mm brass would be a plus for me because they're more available right now than LPP. However, I've not seen any 10mm SPP brass much less have any.

Mr.Revolverguy said:

I will hand load them trickle every round with the same powder and see if we can tell a difference in velocity

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I suspect that you will find some minor velocity change between the two, Mr.Revolverguy. You testing in your Cimmaron or something else? I look forward to reviewing your results.

It's easier to make powder charges consistent than it is to make primer cup charges consistent. The larger the load of paste in the cup, the less consistent it is likely to be from primer to primer. Measure the mass of small primers in a tray and calculate the standard deviation. It is almost certain to be lower than the SD for a tray of large primers. That directly translates to lower SD for velocity of the loads made with them, provided the primer is sufficient to initiate the load. I agree that large primers can be necessary to initiate compressed loads of ball powder in large cases. The 45 and 10mm are not those cases. They both have very small powder volumes.

Because I find it tedious to sort primers by mass, I prefer the unsorted primers to be a smaller portion of the total propellant load in proportion to the powder portion that I am already committed to measuring the mass of and ensuring consistency. I have experimented with sorting primers by mass. I found that if I matched primers by mass, that is I sorted them into groups with the same mass to 0.01 grains, those groups would produce the lowest SD of velocity. I had to very carefully control the other variables to see the difference sorted primers would make in SD of velocity. It did make a difference, but not one that I would be able to take any advantage of. For example, I could lower a 5-shot SD from 7 fps to 2 fps. First, I realize this is within the margin of error of my chronograph, and second, I know that I cannot shoot that difference. I am convinced that the difference with large primers would be greater.

I have no problem with the small primer cases, gives me options that don't exist with large primer pockets. I've used several small primers interchangeably for years, no problem. My retired 454 casull cases get cut down for low pressure 45 colt use but obviously retain their small pocket- can use spp no problem.
Depends on your loading style, I sort, trim and thoroughly clean my cases regularly. The only case I don't ever want to see a small pocket on is 45-70, some things are not to be tinkered with.

I cannot think of a handgun round that has large primers, and did not originate in North America.

Even 357 Mag started life with Large Primer pockets. I also have in my possession some 38 Spl brass with Large Primer pockets.
Both of those cartridges standardized on SPP sometime in the late 1950s.


It seems all the Eastern Hemisphere handguns cartridges have small pockets.

I have stated before this that, going forward, it would become more difficult to find Large primers; especially Large Pistol.