.45-70 hunting

Ugly Sauce said:
I read the fine print on the box that states: "this ammo may not feed well in all rifles". Or something like that.
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The “fine print” on the box points out the interaction between a flat mag follower and a pointed bullet, and suggests 1) the last round may cant in the mag and 2) the flat nosed follower can deform the tip if loaded for prolonged periods.

But it’s not so surprising that Hornady FTX’s feed in Marlins, they were built with that action in mind. The reputation some less mindful reloaders have given the FTX’s is derived from loading the long nosed FTX’s in full length brass, which is too long for feeding, and the tips hang up in the mag tube as the carrier elevates. But using properly trimmed cases, or factory ammo, it’s pretty hard to mess up feeding with the FTX’s.
 
All that is true no doubt, but my Marlin would not feed more than one or two at a time. Or sometimes three or four in row, or not. !! It was a train wreck. On the other hand, the rifle has never, ever miss-fed with the 405 grain cast bullet, copy of the original bullet, the Speer 400 grain JSP, or that 350 grain Hornady round-nose JSP, which I don't think they still make.

It also jammed badly with some cast bullet loads, which he, and the man behind the counter called "bear loads". But I don't know what those were. I remember the the bullet protruded further out of the case than what looked normal to me.

So in my rifle, it was not hard at all for those "Lever De-Evolutions" to mess up. And wow, what a you-know-what to un-jam them, and get them out of the action when they did jam. They didn't just miss-feed, the froze the thing up. Jam city.

However, I got the rifle back, not a bad thing considering It's a JM, and crazy accurate, and feeds 100% for me.
marblkgrp.jpg
 
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I have four Marlin .45-70 rifles. One JM (CB), one Rem-Marlin (SBL) and two Ruger-Marlins (SBL and GBL). The JM Marlin does not feed anything reliably. I need to give it some attention someday but it is my least favored Marlin lever gun. The Rem-Marlin feeds everything well except ultra wide metplates found on some oversize bear loads. If I burnish off the edge on the metplate on a piece of steel then it swallows them no issue. The two Rugers eat anything. All, except the JM, feed the FTX bullet and the Hornady LR ammo just fine and are very accurate with it. I also like the new Federal Hammer Down in a 300 grain especially for shooting out to and beyond 200 yards.

Screen-Shot-2022-11-01-at-11-03-53-AM.png

The new Ruger-Marlins are beautiful.

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As to recoil, this is much exaggerated IMO. Except for the 520 grain Garret stuff and the +P BB bear loads, the .45-70 is not that bad. The LR 325 is somewhat snappy but for that I get the ability to reach out to 300 yards. For woods hunting of pigs and deer at around 100 yards plus or minus a 405 MBC #1 Large Buffalo (coated) bullet with 32 to 34 grains of H4198 is my new go to load. Also, the HMS Bear Load which is a 420 grain is relatively gentle compared to Garret and BB stuff and the HMS and Black Hills Cowboy loads at 405 grains and around 1200 fps are good hunting loads replicated by the load I mentioned above. And Trail Boss at 13.0 grains and a MBC 405 bullet is like shooting a big .22 rifle :). And nothing makes a feller feel as warm and fuzzy as does .45-70 +P Bear Loads if something big and mean is about.

IMG-2147.jpg

If I were to ever again use the rifle for bear protection I think I would load a Garret 520 in the tube and the rest Garret, BB or HMS 420 +P Bear Loads. I would not purposely submerge my rifle but .45-70 rifle rounds are much more waterproof than shotgun shells and at least the SBL rifles are stainless steel and drenching rains are no problem. A rubber sleeve on the muzzle is not unheard of.
 
3Crows said:
I have four Marlin .45-70 rifles. One JM (CB), one Rem-Marlin (SBL) and two Ruger-Marlins (SBL and GBL). The JM Marlin does not feed anything reliably. I need to give it some attention someday but it is my least favored Marlin lever gun. The Rem-Marlin feeds everything well except ultra wide metplates found on some oversize bear loads. If I burnish off the edge on the metplate on a piece of steel then it swallows them no issue. The two Rugers eat anything. All, except the JM, feed the FTX bullet and the Hornady LR ammo just fine and are very accurate with it. I also like the new Federal Hammer Down in a 300 grain especially for shooting out to and beyond 200 yards.

View attachment 1128130

The new Ruger-Marlins are beautiful.

View attachment 1128131

As to recoil, this is much exaggerated IMO. Except for the 520 grain Garret stuff and the +P BB bear loads, the .45-70 is not that bad. The LR 325 is somewhat snappy but for that I get the ability to reach out to 300 yards. For woods hunting of pigs and deer at around 100 yards plus or minus a 405 MBC #1 Large Buffalo (coated) bullet with 32 to 34 grains of H4198 is my new go to load. Also, the HMS Bear Load which is a 420 grain is relatively gentle compared to Garret and BB stuff and the HMS and Black Hills Cowboy loads at 405 grains and around 1200 fps are good hunting loads replicated by the load I mentioned above. And Trail Boss at 13.0 grains and a MBC 405 bullet is like shooting a big .22 rifle :). And nothing makes a feller feel as warm and fuzzy as does .45-70 +P Bear Loads if something big and mean is about.

View attachment 1128132

If I were to ever again use the rifle for bear protection I think I would load a Garret 520 in the tube and the rest Garret, BB or HMS 420 +P Bear Loads. I would not purposely submerge my rifle but .45-70 rifle rounds are much more waterproof than shotgun shells and at least the SBL rifles are stainless steel and drenching rains are no problem. A rubber sleeve on the muzzle is not unheard of.
Click to expand...

The cartridges on the butt of the rifle in the last pic is what the cartridges my friend bought looked like. I didn't even know what brand they were at the time, but he kept bragging about the "Bear Loads" he had bought, because the man behind the counter told him you NEVER want to hunt with re-loads, and the "bear loads" were what he needed. (after I had set him up with some reloading stuff so he could duplicate the load I always used in it, which was crazy accurate...and told him I'd help him do that anytime) Those also jammed badly, which was so puzzling to me as again, the rifle NEVER jammed in the 18 years I had it, shot it frequently, and hunted with it often.

But now she's safe and sound back home with me, never to part again, with a nice hand-rubbed multi-coat oil finish, the forend trimmed down, and a nice period butt plate. (it used to have a red rubber recoil pad on it) She's a beauty.

Dang it 3Crows...nice rifles.
 
Ugly Sauce said:
"Bear Loads" he had bought, because the man behind the counter told him you NEVER want to hunt with re-loads, and the "bear loads" were what he needed. Those also jammed badly, which was so puzzling to me as again, the rifle NEVER jammed in the 18 years I had it, shot it frequently, and hunted with it often.


Dang it 3Crows...nice rifles.
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The "Bear Loads" from HMS (420gr) have a very wide metplate. The widest metplate that will reliably feed in a Marlin is I think .35 or maybe even .375 inches and OAL 2.550 (without mods). The HMS Bear Loads I have bought are slightly over 2.550 max length and the metplates measure around .40. This if I recall, no calipers or Bear Loads convenient to me at the moment. On the other hand the BB 420s feed okay. Subtle differences I guess. In any case I adjusted my Rem-Marlin by polishing the ledge between the top of the receiver and the inlet to the chamber and it will feed them. The Rug-Marlins seem fine with about anything called .45-70 ;).
 
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That's a good thing, a rifle should not be "overly sensitive" to ammo. On the other hand, mine functions perfectly with more "traditional" ammo, as I guess because it was made before all these new-kids-on-the-block souped-up offerings that came about more recently. I was never aware of any potential feeding problems, other than OAL, as I always used (and use) hand loaded ammo, and always chose round-nose bullets. (mostly RN, the Speer JSP has a small metplat, as does the 405 grain lead, Trapdoor Springfield bullet.)

I'll say again, all things considered, I got my JM back, which I was nuts to sell, but I wanted a good original Trapdoor rifle for a shooter, and that's how I afforded that. Now I got both! Bonus! :)
 
3Crows said:
It is pretty clear some folks are terribly confused as to proper hunting caliber and cartridge selection. So, here, let me help y'all out, this chart covers every needed possibility ;) :

View attachment 1128243

The .45-70 Government is always the right answer :).
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That's awesome!

I just sent it to on of the guys at work that just bought an WIN 1886 "Deluxe" after searching for one new for a couple years. He's planning on using it for a buffalo Hunt next year.
 
Well, I started this thread wondering about a .45-70. Been following the posts, and then went to a gun show over the weekend and there was that same Ruger/Marlin Guide Gun that got all this going, still for sale. The dealer cut the price and I couldn't stand it, and bought it. I've got to say that this rifle just appeals to me more than most other guns I've ever bought. Hope it shoots.
 
I really wanted it. As I'm sure you know, you should not confuse Want and Need when it come to guns. I'm sure most of us have particular guns that just "feel just right" in your hands. This is one of those for me.
 
First trip to my range today. The only load I could find in town was Remington 405 grain SPCL, which the box label says is loaded to lower pressure so as to be useable in all .45-70s, not just the newer ones. Welcome to the world of $2/round.
I'll admit that I was nervous from all I've read and heard about how awful recoil was going to be. Well, recoil was a piece of cake. Less than my .30-06s. This suggests to me that these "all rifles" loads are quite mild and I may find something different when I make my own loads.
Accuracy was not good today. I was shooting from a bench but not from a solid rest, that'll be next time. The rifle was shooting badly to the right of POA, so I'll drift the front sight. Happily the front sight on this rifle is set up to make that easy.
The rifle continues to have a great "feel" in my hands and I'm looking forward to working out the issues (even at $2/round).
 
I have two left after sixty years of loving the 45-70. A Rossi (kickyobutt) Rio Grande and a NEF Handi (kickitworser) Rifle. 1873 Trapdoor, Ballard,Remington Rolling Block, and a couple of Marlins.
This year, my deer will be taken with a 45-70. Hanging up the357.
 
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wgp said:
First trip to my range today. The only load I could find in town was Remington 405 grain SPCL, which the box label says is loaded to lower pressure so as to be useable in all .45-70s, not just the newer ones. Welcome to the world of $2/round.
I'll admit that I was nervous from all I've read and heard about how awful recoil was going to be. Well, recoil was a piece of cake. Less than my .30-06s. This suggests to me that these "all rifles" loads are quite mild and I may find something different when I make my own loads.
Accuracy was not good today. I was shooting from a bench but not from a solid rest, that'll be next time. The rifle was shooting badly to the right of POA, so I'll drift the front sight. Happily the front sight on this rifle is set up to make that easy.
The rifle continues to have a great "feel" in my hands and I'm looking forward to working out the issues (even at $2/round).
Click to expand...
We NEED PICTURES!!!
You may have an easily fixed issue, if you let the expertise here help you!
 
Have a marlin 1895ss 45/70 micro-groove for decades. Moose fall with it. All under 100yds. Never shoot beyond 100yrds with any rifle I use. Moose I run into 99% of the time are under 100yrds
I've sent it out to have the barrel changed once. 2nd time it needed work, had the muzzle cut back and re crowned.
Its becoming a wall hanger now. Savage 270 axis, rem 700 bdl 30-06 has become the primary firearms
 
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Was never much for posting pictures, perhaps later. Still looking for a load that gives the fabulous accuracy some posts describe. I fear the issue may be old eyes paired with small open sights. Not enthused about putting a low-power scope on this rifle but I may try it. Factory ammo here is very limited, one store has a pile of the Remington 405gr low-power stuff and I'm not shy about using it. My goal for this rifle is deer in the woods where 100 yards would be a long shot. I know that I can load this modern 1895 much hotter but I don't think a deer would walk away from a good hit with a 405 gr bullet. I have experimented with 300 and 325 gr bullets and will continue to do so. At least bullets and 3031 powder are starting to be available here.

Someone raised the question in this thread about what drove me to want this rifle. I have more guns than I can shoot with any regularity, but I have a weakness for something that I pick up and iI like its looks and it feels perfect in hand and coming to the shoulder. My first centerfire rifle, a Rem 700 Classic in .30-06, still rings that bell for me all these years later, and it doesn't hurt that it's as accurate as my Ruger Precision or Bergara. I almost fear the new Marlin 336 arriving in the stores, as I have a Model 94 already.
 
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