Is +P ammo safe for early S&W Model 36?

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lostbird

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I have a Model 36 purchased in the early 1970's before +P ammunition was available. I'm starting to carry it for personal defense now and would like to use +P ammo. I called S&W Customer Service and asked if my Model 36 was safe for +P or would it damage my revolver. The reply was that it is carbon steel, but was never tested with +P, since it was not available. The recommendation(for liability issues I'm sure) was not to use +P. Has anyone used +P in an early Model 36. Did you experience any problems with damage or excessive wear to your 36? Any help are comments would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
 


Rather than a +P, I'd use Federal's 110 grain .38 Special HydraShoks, PD38HS3H. They are personal defense intended and non-plus P.

If you must use +P ammo, consider getting a 442 or a 642 S&W. Both are +P rated j-frames.

​
 
I have a 1964 vintage M36. I shoot ~ 1 box/year (1 cylinder/month) of +P out of it, just to get the "feel" of my carry ammo. Some guys shoot LOTS of +P out of their 36's w/o any problems. Are their revolvers gonna go BOOM...no, but I bet the extra pressure is accelerating the normal wear and tear on their revolvers!
 
Although the gun was not designed for +P use, which is one of the reasons S&W transitioned to the J-magnum frame, the OCCASIONAL use of +P ammunition for practice as well as carrying for self-defense is likely OK./QUOTE]

This is good advice. Add to that the fact that any high pressure load (+P) will act on any gun and will decrease the functional life of that gun.

One other factor to consider is, that just because a round is marked as a +P, it will not necessarily provide the additional velocity in your gun that +P loads are supposed to provide.

You absolutely will get the increased pressure but not necessarily the increased velocity. That's something to consider.:what:
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The paperwork that came with my 1970 S&W 36 states any Model 36 made after 1955 can shoot .38SPL+P, 1955 and older can not. 38+P ammo was produced by Federal for the Treasury Dept. and only sold to them.
 
It won't hurt your gun other then maybe loosening it up a little faster.

Before there was +P, there was the High-Velocity loads, and it was hotter then todays +P.
And S&W fully expected the J-Frames to handle it safely without blowing up.

If you had called them 10 years ago, they would have said no, maybe, but used in moderation it would not hurt your gun.

Modern .38 Special gives 17,000 PSI.
+P gives 18,500.
.357 Mag gives 35,000!

Todays +P is about like standard pressure .38 Spl ammo was loaded 35 years ago.

If you want to carry it, don't worry about it!

rcmodel
 
rcmodel said:
Todays +P is about like standard pressure .38 Spl ammo was loaded 35 years ago.
Click to expand...

In fact if you look up the ballistics of the old .38 Long Colt (which so famously failed to drop drugged-up Filipinos) you will find it's nearly identical to "standard" .38 Special LRN of today! Since .38 "Special" was developed as a response to this, how could they be the same? The modern load is supposed to give 755 fps (which is weak to start off with)but whenever I've shot it out of a snubby it makes jagged holes in the paper which I assume means it's tumbling through the air. :uhoh:

"Standard" .38 spl isn't even good for target practice...plus you get that nice cloud of toxic lead dust flying back in your face.
 
Modern .38 Special gives 17,000 PSI.
+P gives 18,500.
Click to expand...
Those are the numbers I have always considered to be correct. However, many people today report that current plus P is considered to be 20,000 psi. The 135 grain Speer Gold Dot short barrel load which so many people consider at or near the top of current offerings (and a load I like a lot) is reported in their technical manual to adhere to the following pressure limits:
Pressures of cartridges adhere to the following SAAMI guidelines:
Product Maximum Average Pressure
38 Special +P 21,500 psi
Click to expand...
In an email to me from Speer, I was told that the load actually
does not exceed 20,000 MAP (Maximum average pressure), according to the Engineering drawing for this product.
Click to expand...
and that the
21,500 psi is the "Maximum Probable Lot Mean", (meaning 97.72% of individual pressures in a test will be below this level).
Click to expand...
.
I don't know whether 20,000 psi or 21,500 psi is more accurate, but both of them are considerably in excess of 18,500 psi and well beyond 17,000 psi.
 
Another important factor to consider is the different standards used to measure cartridge pressure. I learned a lot reading the debate about whether .308 and 7.62x51 are interchangeable. It's entirely possible that some of these pressure numbers were taken using CUP meaurements, while others were taken using psi. The two are not interchangeable. It makes it difficult to compare.

Still. Be conservative with +P loads in a old steel J-frame. +P loads will never touch my J-frames.
 
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