+p ammo and S&W 36

[Neo-Luddite]

My wife got her 36-3 w/3" barrel from her dad. Granted, it's a newer one than your wife's (rated for occaisonal +p use) but we load it with +P's. A couple boxes a year from a steel mod 36 in +p range I wouldn't worry about. Years back I had a 36 airweight w/ aluminum frame. I was a kid and didn't know better--so it was fed a diet of +P. Now, the only aluminum framed gun I have is my 10/22.

My wife has the lady-smith varriant (nice grip and smoothed trigger). It is a joy to shoot and even my nephews could handle it well at age 10. That barrel length has a just right feel, too.

 

[SaxonPig]

Back in the 1960s it was popular to load wadcutters (sometimes backwards) for defensive use. This was before the high performance ammo became readily available. Numerous magazine writers recounted their experiences and it was all bad. These slugs tumble badly and are inaccurate at high velocity and don't penetrate well at lower speeds (real bodies, not clay or gelatin) and almost never show even the least bit of expansion.

I read accounts of such loads failing to stop small pigs (40 pound range) at close range and of people accidentally shot with these target loads who sometimes didn't realize they'd been hit until someone told them. A relative who was a surgical nurse told me of a gunshot victim who took one of these target grade wadcutters to the forehead at contact distance. The slug bounced off the skull leaving powder burns and a deep scalp laceration. A bouncer in a bar was shot through the lip by an irate patron with a 38 wadcutter and the bullet was stopped by his front tooth.

I have no reason to doubt any of these stories and I have shot enough 38 wadcutter ammo into solid and semi-solid targets to know that I would not rely on it to save my life against a determined man trying to harm me. I want more velocity and some expansion from a round I depend on for self-defense.

Would I want to be shot with target ammo? Certainly not. Might this load prove fatal? Could happen, but the odds are against you in using it and I want the odds in my favor, not my opponent's.

I would never tell a man what to carry. Anyone who is comfortable with low-speed target ammo is welcome to pack it as far as I am concerned.

But like I said, make sure your will is signed.

Frankly, I find it hard to understand why anyone would need to have explained to them why a 148 grain bullet at 700 FPS doesn't make a good defensive load.

 

[sm]

Here is my take:

Handguns are not great to start with - still they are a portable and concealable tool in the toolbox.

No absolutes in anything, and this includes anything doing what what they are supposed to.
Be this "supposes to" coming from writing on a box of shells, magazine advertisement, what someone else wrote or says.

I grew up shooting dirt/mud. Yep the Scientific Mud/Dirt Test. Mentors did it to see how a bullet held up.
I thought they were just messing with me, a kid.
I mean many times there was a "target" in front of said dirt/mud.
Still they poked a stick in, and got an idea how far in.
Looked at the various bullets to see what it looked like.
Comparing a factory load to a reloaded one, or a batch of homemade lead bullets, or homemade lead slugs for shotguns (12, 12, 28 and .410).

Odd deal is - how scary close these bullets looked when taken from a critter shot.

Gordon,
Like you, I have seen lots of standard pressure 158 gr LRN, the so called "widow makers" put a Cow down!
Seen the 148 gr wad-cutter do the same thing, and many many times just a small "pocket pistol" like a J frame or Detective Special.

I had Mentors that had been shot with rifles in Conflicts all over the world, and here they walk up and pop a cow with plain old .38spl from a "pocket pistol".

Mentors were Mentoring, because I was asking a lot of questions.
They showed me books, some were nurses, some other Docs and ....

I get bigger and work in Main OR.
-We are going to do a Organ Harvest on someone a .22 short killed.
-We get a guy that sticks a medium frame .357 revolver in his mouth and pulls the trigger on a .357 load - and he lives.
-14 gunshot wounds and this guy is cussing up a storm.
We had no idea what he was shot with, until we retrieved them.
.380, 9mm, .38spl, .357 and .45ACP.
Cops later shared about shell casings and all to assist with all this. He lives.
-00 buckshot and this other guy, is really ticked his clothes are messed up, and he lives.

No wonder Mentors never felt bad when they got to where they could not shoot .357s and went to 38spls. No wonder when hands got worse, they did not worry about carrying standard 158 gr LRN, and when it even worse, 148 gr wad cutters.

They got what THEY could shoot, and get shot placement, quickly and effectively.
They did NOT go out looking for trouble, kept in practice evading and what to do if they could not evade, still...

Walk out with the pocket pistol and pop a cow, the deer hit on the highway, whatever...and kept on going on with life.


Folks want "nasty results" - Get a 40 oz beer bottle.
Talk about a nasty result, he died pretty quick, and quit doing what he was doing and bled out before the EMTs could arrive.
We got him for Organ Harvest.

Person that hit him, stopped a immediate threat, and just used what was handy. That bottle, on the ground tossed aside.
Thank goodness for litterbugs....

 

[SaxonPig]

"Handguns are not great to start with - still they are a portable and concealable tool in the toolbox.

No absolutes in anything, and this includes anything doing what what they are supposed to. Be this "supposes to" coming from writing on a box of shells, magazine advertisement, what someone else wrote or says."

In my opinion you are 100% correct in what I copied. My thinking is that, accepting the reality that any handgun is inferior for serious work, I want to give myself the best chance possible. Therefore, I would eschew (I love that word) the low-speed target ammo and use something offering more performance. Some would demand a bigger caliber. I consider the 38 Special adequate with proper loads.

 

[wnycollector]

problem solved...found a S&W 65-3 .357 for her. A little bit more expensive than the model 36 but now I dont have to worry about damaging the pistol with +p .38. Again thanks for ALL the input!