Riding a bike in Oregon

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joshk-k

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Hey all,

I live in the most bike-friendly city in the country. I live 1.25 miles from work and have an eight minute bike commute. I do essentially my whole life, social and business on a bicycle. My truck was totalled at the end of June (rear-ended on my way to pick up a gun I bought in the trading post here), and I have chosen to not buy a replacement. I do not have a concealed weapons permit, and don't have any foreseeable plans to get one (although there's nothing stopping me).

My question is this:

Without a permit, can I legally carry a handgun in a backpack? If it's unloaded/locked/in a case/etc., does that matter? Could I go to a store, buy a pistol, put it in a backpack and ride home? Would they count this as being "on my person?"

The obvious answer is to go get a CWP and then it's a moot point. But I'm just curious.

Thanks,
Josh
 
I live in Oregon too and I doubt you could get a definitive answer form any single source. Most police would say it's verbotten and some criminal defense attorneys would say "maybe" while the real answer would probably have to come form a court decision after you've been charged.

To me though, the real question is "why bother to carry it in your backpack." If you really needed it you'd be screwed. In most of the state it's alright to carry openly without a permit and even in those cities where open carry is curtailed it's okay providing you have a CCW.

Heck, even super-liberal Portland allows open carry under certain conditions. If you have a CCW you can carry a loaded firearm openly. Without the CCW it's still okay to carry an unloaded firearm openly. In either case though, I'd be surprised if you didn't attract a whole lot of blue uniforms very quickly.
 
I also live in Oregon, and I asked this same question a while back, and never really got the answer I was looking for.

It seems to me like you should legally be allowed to carry a gun in either a backpack, bike pannier, etc. without it being considered "concealed", since bicycles are considered vehicles, and that would be the equivalent of having it stored in your trunk. I never have asked a cop yet, and I doubt that any two cops would give you the same answer, or the right answer either for that matter.

If I have the time, I'll call the cops myself tomorrow and ask them, but everytime I've ever asked them anything, they never give me a straight answer, either because of incompetence on their part, or because they just prefer to discourage anyone exercising their second amendment right.

I have yet to get my CCW either, and there's lots of times and places that I'd like to have a gun with me while bike touring/backpacking around OR, and would prefer to have it out of sight or in a bike pannier.
 
I'm in Washington, so have little experience with Oregon. However, as the OP was asking if it would be ok to carry a cased & unloaded pistol in his backpack, I can't think of any reason why you shouldn't. If it was loaded I would think it would only then be considered a concealed weapon.
 
My 2 cents

With the current phrasing of the laws, in my opinion, no, you cannot legally carry a pistol in a backpack without a concealed carry permit.

Bonaz - Loaded or unloaded is immaterial. A concealed weapon is a concealed weapon, whether or not it is loaded.

Coosbaycreep - It doesn't matter what we SHOULD be able to do. And backpacks, panniers, baskets, racks, etc are not equivalent to the trunk of a vehicle, as they are accessible without having to stop the bike, get off, go back and unlock the trunk. They're more comparable to the glove box or center console.

Josh - As you stated, you already know the obvious answer. Get the permit.

And, oldfart is right. You pack openly in Portland and you are very likely to get a lot of police attention very quickly. None of which will be good for you.
 
Regardless of whether it's legal or not, most cops will have you on the ground in handcuffs after they throw your brand new gun on the concrete. ESPECIALLY in Portland. Portland is the LEAST gun friendly place in the entire state, and the cops seem to be proud of that.
 
Oldfart said:

"To me though, the real question is "why bother to carry it in your backpack." If you really needed it you'd be screwed."

My question is really not about a scenario in which I'd need to draw. It's more about the mundane times when transporting a gun is necessary: bringing it home from the store, going to the range, returning from having some work done on it by a gunsmith, etc.

For that matter, since I'm asking: could I ride my bike with a cased longgun on my back?

Obviously, that would bring super police down, but what's the legality?

Thanks for the answers so far.

Josh
 
Makes me long for the...

good old days. Friends and I would ride out of town on our bikes to pheasant hunt in nearby rural areas (this was in MN). Guess a couple teenagers with cased shotguns on their bikes might get a different reaction nowadays.
 
The simplest answer is go get a CHL. Then you don't have to worry about it at all. Unless you want to be a test case. And really you don't want that.
 
Josh -

I don't think any of us were trying to jerk your chain or simply be butts because we could. If you can get a permit, get one. It will save you all sorts of headaches with your current chosen method of transportation, on those occasions when you need to transport a handgun.
 
Every now and then I see these kinds of "what if" posts and wonder what is the point? If you can carry with a CHL, then why wouldn't you get one, and avoid all the mental gymnastics about loaded or unloaded, in a backpack or pannier, in a pistol rug or a case of some sort.

I don't mean to sound callous or impolite, but I just wonder if open carry is legal, why you wouldn't do that. If it is not, or is likely to expose you to unwanted scrutiny, then why wouldn't you just get a CHL and be done with it. What am I missing here?
 
As a Portland criminal defense lawyer, I can tell you, don't risk it. Just get the CHL and be done with it. A cop (who is a former District Attorney) who I know here has a CHL because he feels that it provides greater legal protection for when he is carrying off-duty than his police badge. That tells you a lot about the importance of having a CHL.

While keeping in mind that my advice is GET A CHL, some of your hypothetical circumstances would appear to provide you with an "affirmative defense" (this means that you would have to prove the defense at trial in order to prevail, assuming all other facts are proven by the state):

14A.60.010 Possession of a Loaded Firearm in a Public Place

A. It is unlawful for any person to knowingly possess or carry a firearm, in or upon a public place, including while in a vehicle in a public place, recklessly having failed to remove all the ammunition from the firearm.

B. It is unlawful for any person to knowingly possess or carry a firearm and that firearm’s clip or magazine, in or upon a public place, including while in a vehicle in a public place, recklessly having failed to remove all the ammunition from the clip or magazine.

C. The following are exceptions and constitute affirmative defenses to a violation of this Section:

***

11. Persons travelling to and from an established target range, whether public or private, for the purpose of practicing shooting targets at the target ranges.

12. Licensed hunters or fishermen while engaged in hunting or fishing, or while going to or returning from a hunting or fishing expedition.

***

D. It is unlawful for any person who possesses a firearm, clip or magazine in or upon a public place, or while in a vehicle in a public place, to refuse to permit a police officer to inspect that firearm after the police officer has identified him or herself as a police officer. This Section does not apply to law enforcement officers or members of the military in the performance of official duties, nor persons licensed to carry a concealed handgun or persons authorized to possess a loaded firearm, clip or magazine while in or on a public building or court facility.
Click to expand...
 
Just to hammer home the fact that Portland's government is rampantly anti-gun, just check out the definition of firearm set forth in the city code:

I. Firearm: a pistol, revolver, gun, rifle, or other mechanism, including a miniature weapon, which projects a missile or shot by force of gunpowder or any other explosive, by spring or by compressed air.
Click to expand...

Yes, that's right, a super soaker is technically a firearm under the Portland City Code (it fires using compressed air), as is the Cat-A-Pult (it uses a spring).

Crazy me, I thought that a firearm required fire, i.e., gunpowder. I have had clients charged under this ordinance WITH A CRIME for having a loaded BB pistol in a backpack, etc. Don't risk it; it'll take months to litigate and you could lose.
 
I just called the sheriff chick that handles CHL permits where I live (douglas county) and asked her about hauling a gun in a bike pannier, and she confirmed the same thing that others have already said: if it's on a bike, it's a concealed weapon.
 
Why would anyone ask a legal question to anyone other than one (or two) who has studied the law in that jurisdiction? Makes no sense. Consult at least two attorneys who specialise in this area and if they agree you should feel confident. If not, continue your research on up the chain.
 
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