Rohrbaugh R-9s DELIVERED!
- Thread starter Blackhawk
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Jeff OTMG
Member
Grouping: A buddy of mine that works at the local range fired a 1" group offhand at 5 yards with it yesterday. I have the target and will post the pictures with the article.
Point shooting: Any SD gun has to be a good pointer, IMO. You can't count on the luxury of being able to take aimed shots due to the exigencies of stress, body position, adrenaline, and cognitive dissonance. A gun that has a chance of being a good pointer has to have a good trigger and fit your hand so that you grip it the same way every time and under extreme conditions. A gun you have to "adjust" your grip on just won't do, and one way to test that is to grip it loosely, aim, then look away and tighten up your grip as much as you can and see how much your aim has drifted. A drifting aim when you increase your grip pressure indicates that the grip doesn't really fit your hand. If the tight grip hurts or your aim's drifted more than a tiny bit, the gun's not going to be very good for point shooting.
I've already mentioned how comfortable the R9 is to grip. The level of comfort is initially high, and no matter how tight you squeeze, it remains high. No pain or even discomfort.
(I practice point shooting and eschewed aimed shots with handguns for decades only getting serious about them in the last few years so YMMV. A GREAT point shooter you may be familiar with is Bob Munden.) IMO, the R9 is a natural pointer. My aim only shifts an inch or so on the squeeze test.
Okay, the next obvious validation of the R9 as a pointer is testing it. For that, I mounted my LaserBlaster (a laser toy that fits into the barrel and "fires" a momentary red dot at whatever the muzzle's pointed at when the trigger's pulled). From 7 yards, I was able to easily hit COM every time, a doorknob about 1/3 of the time, and a face size area about 3/4 of the time. None of these were aimed shots, and every one was picking up the gun from a table while looking at the target, then firing as soon as possible without even glancing at the sights.
This gun, ladies and gentlemen, friends and foes, and curious felons and wannabes, is a natural pointer!
BTW, Eric told me they were shooting golf balls consistently with one of the early prototypes. No sights at all. Easy for me to believe!
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edited a couple of typos....
I've already mentioned how comfortable the R9 is to grip. The level of comfort is initially high, and no matter how tight you squeeze, it remains high. No pain or even discomfort.
(I practice point shooting and eschewed aimed shots with handguns for decades only getting serious about them in the last few years so YMMV. A GREAT point shooter you may be familiar with is Bob Munden.) IMO, the R9 is a natural pointer. My aim only shifts an inch or so on the squeeze test.
Okay, the next obvious validation of the R9 as a pointer is testing it. For that, I mounted my LaserBlaster (a laser toy that fits into the barrel and "fires" a momentary red dot at whatever the muzzle's pointed at when the trigger's pulled). From 7 yards, I was able to easily hit COM every time, a doorknob about 1/3 of the time, and a face size area about 3/4 of the time. None of these were aimed shots, and every one was picking up the gun from a table while looking at the target, then firing as soon as possible without even glancing at the sights.
This gun, ladies and gentlemen, friends and foes, and curious felons and wannabes, is a natural pointer!
BTW, Eric told me they were shooting golf balls consistently with one of the early prototypes. No sights at all. Easy for me to believe!
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edited a couple of typos....
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Missouri Mule
Member
Sounds like a pistol I wwould carry alot "WHEN" I get my New MO CCW.....
When they get affordable. ~$1000 HOLY COW!
I don't have that kind of change laying around.... reckon I could sell two or three of my soon to be legal truck guns! WOW!
When they get affordable. ~$1000 HOLY COW!
I don't have that kind of change laying around.... reckon I could sell two or three of my soon to be legal truck guns! WOW!
You *think* it's a natural pointer, based on a laser bore sight.
But you actually have no idea whether it will actually fire to that POA because you've never personally fired a live round thru it.
Sounds like you *want* to believe all you've been told, after all you spent a lot of money to risk being dissapointed.
The pistol has the potential to be an excellent BUG or CCW, but cheerleading doesn't impress me. I'll have to wait until someone actually fires a substantial amount of rounds thru one before I'm impressed.
Long term durability and reliability can only be tested by live fire tests, not mechanical engineer observations.
Actually, I think that based on decades of experience in point shooting handguns, depending on an old, but reliable, manual method of determining how an unfired gun will point, and recently supplementing that with a new laser gizmmo I've only had for about 2 years. The manual method has kept me from being disappointed by buying a Glock among others. The Laser gizmo is wonderful for training (and confirmation).
Experience tells me that I have an excellent idea of how this gun points.
What I spent is nominal, and buyer's remorse isn't an affliction I suffer from.
BTW, you're not obligated to read my opinions....
Lightsped
Member
I received my Rohrbaugh info and pricelist today along with a letter that was personally written to me. Very quick response considering I just requested product info a day or two ago.
That kind of service impresses me big time. The letter did state that they had a updated product info/pricelist coming soon. I hope to remain on their mailing list. I am kind of interested in the Carbon Fiber finish.
The Rohrbaugh seems like a very cool gun which I will try acquire before too long.
That kind of service impresses me big time. The letter did state that they had a updated product info/pricelist coming soon. I hope to remain on their mailing list. I am kind of interested in the Carbon Fiber finish.
The Rohrbaugh seems like a very cool gun which I will try acquire before too long.
Mr Jody Hudson
Member
OK! I'm being convinced!
I LOVE my Keltecs; 3 in .380, 3 in 9mm and 1 in .40...
I guess there is merit in having one of these Rohrbaughs...
Although I am very happy with my P11s and my 3ATs!
I suppose that I will end up with one of these fine new Rohrbaugh pistols eventually... perhaps soon if I am able to arrange the logistics.
I had decided previously to get one of these. Now, I'm ready to send the money!
Good thread, good debate, good info and great and convincing pictures and information from Blackhawk.
THANKS!
I LOVE my Keltecs; 3 in .380, 3 in 9mm and 1 in .40...
I guess there is merit in having one of these Rohrbaughs...
Although I am very happy with my P11s and my 3ATs!
I suppose that I will end up with one of these fine new Rohrbaugh pistols eventually... perhaps soon if I am able to arrange the logistics.
I had decided previously to get one of these. Now, I'm ready to send the money!
Good thread, good debate, good info and great and convincing pictures and information from Blackhawk.
THANKS!
Mr Jody Hudson
Member
I am perfectly happy with the heel safety in a pocket gun, in particular, and have been the happy owner of many Walther TPHs over the years.
However, I see that the magazine release of the Rohrbaugh should be more in keeping with the fit of the TPH to make it a good pocket gun. I look forward to that design change or to the prospect of modifying mine... when I get it.
However, I see that the magazine release of the Rohrbaugh should be more in keeping with the fit of the TPH to make it a good pocket gun. I look forward to that design change or to the prospect of modifying mine... when I get it.
Jody,
I found some pictures of a Walther TPH that give a pretty good view of their heel mag release here: http://www.fjvollmer.com/New Folder (34)/walther__tph_22__97.htm
Something like that on an R9 would be ideal! A close approximation could be done during manufacturing without much trouble either. Good call.
I found some pictures of a Walther TPH that give a pretty good view of their heel mag release here: http://www.fjvollmer.com/New Folder (34)/walther__tph_22__97.htm
Something like that on an R9 would be ideal! A close approximation could be done during manufacturing without much trouble either. Good call.
Mr Jody Hudson
Member
I plan to send my deposit tomorrow as per Erics request.
I have been on the list for over a year. I know they are VERY busy!
BlackHawk and anyone else, from your experience is there a minimum that is acceptable to Rohrbaugh? I want to make certain that I'm over the minimum. Eric did not say.
I emailed yesterday to ask if I was still on the list and he responded today! I just don't want to overload him and I've never ordered anything like this before. Those with experience in such matters, please advise.
I can easily imagine that they are getting several hundred emails per day at this point! And, trying to run the business.
I have been on the list for over a year. I know they are VERY busy!
BlackHawk and anyone else, from your experience is there a minimum that is acceptable to Rohrbaugh? I want to make certain that I'm over the minimum. Eric did not say.
I emailed yesterday to ask if I was still on the list and he responded today! I just don't want to overload him and I've never ordered anything like this before. Those with experience in such matters, please advise.
I can easily imagine that they are getting several hundred emails per day at this point! And, trying to run the business.
Jody,
If you don't already have an FFL you deal with, go to http://www.gunsamerica.com/transfer.cgi to find one convenient for you. Your FFL sends some paperwork and credentials to Eric and will receive, log, and transfer the gun to you when it arrives just like the transfer you'd have to do in a store. Needless to say, a large deposit will get more respect than something that's just a PITA to account for on the other end.
I sent my money along with a letter identifying my FFL and a letter to my FFL saying what was going to arrive and from whom along with all of the Rohrbaugh contact information. The transaction went as smooth as a Rohrbaugh trigger, but I'd suggest trying to have everything happen close to the same time.
From the responses I've seen and am sure will be provoked by Jeff's article, I'm sure initial demand is going to be very high for this gun. Everybody who's seen mine wants at least one!
If you don't already have an FFL you deal with, go to http://www.gunsamerica.com/transfer.cgi to find one convenient for you. Your FFL sends some paperwork and credentials to Eric and will receive, log, and transfer the gun to you when it arrives just like the transfer you'd have to do in a store. Needless to say, a large deposit will get more respect than something that's just a PITA to account for on the other end.
I sent my money along with a letter identifying my FFL and a letter to my FFL saying what was going to arrive and from whom along with all of the Rohrbaugh contact information. The transaction went as smooth as a Rohrbaugh trigger, but I'd suggest trying to have everything happen close to the same time.
From the responses I've seen and am sure will be provoked by Jeff's article, I'm sure initial demand is going to be very high for this gun. Everybody who's seen mine wants at least one!
Mr Jody Hudson
Member
Thanks,
Should I send more than half for deposit, in your opinion.
Should I send more than half for deposit, in your opinion.
Having been on both ends of such transactions, I'd just send the whole amount and mark it as "payment for..." in the memo field of your check.
You can work the psychology aspects from your end, but the business aspects from the other end are both psychological and practical.
"Deposits" have to be accounted for separately from "sales," and that's a bookkeeping nuisance. Secondly, something that's "sold, paid for, but not delivered" puts a strange kind of pressure on the manufacturer to get it out the door. In a production business, there's nothing quite as satisfying as products being shipped. Everything about the design, production, delivery AND customers is very personal to these guys. Treat them the way you'd want to be treated if the situations were reversed.
You can work the psychology aspects from your end, but the business aspects from the other end are both psychological and practical.
"Deposits" have to be accounted for separately from "sales," and that's a bookkeeping nuisance. Secondly, something that's "sold, paid for, but not delivered" puts a strange kind of pressure on the manufacturer to get it out the door. In a production business, there's nothing quite as satisfying as products being shipped. Everything about the design, production, delivery AND customers is very personal to these guys. Treat them the way you'd want to be treated if the situations were reversed.
Welcome to THR, turtle!
I don't know for sure if they're planning to submit it for testing, but doesn't CA require both a slide lock and a magazine interlock (so the gun won't fire if the magazine's removed)?
Both of those would require modifications to the gun, and both of them would violate the design criteria that the gun be functionally as simple as possible with no extra doodads or jimcracks that could interfere with the gun working in that split second it needs to in a self-defense situation.
I'm now sold on the heel magazine release (not relevant to your question), but I'd like to see the release trimmed so it doesn't protrude so much or make a gap that can catch seams when the gun is drawn from a pocket. Otherwise, I'm not in favor of any modifications to the design with the possible exception of moving the assembly pin access holes in the slide a bit to make field stripping easier.
The CA market is a big one, and I'm sure they're attracted by it, but silly requirements that preclude a gun like this and others from being sold there should be addressed through the political process by Californians pressuring the Legislature to be sensible. Otherwise, if companies like Rohrbaugh and Kel Tec play the silly game to comply with CA's silly games, the anti-gunners in the Legislature are just going to push for more and even sillier requirements like those in NJ did to require "smart" guns when the first viable smart gun is produced. One such stupid requirment might be that any gun sold in CA must occupy a volume of not less than 231 cubic inches and weigh not less than 5 pounds.
Sorry for the rant, but that's one of my hot buttons.
I don't know for sure if they're planning to submit it for testing, but doesn't CA require both a slide lock and a magazine interlock (so the gun won't fire if the magazine's removed)?
Both of those would require modifications to the gun, and both of them would violate the design criteria that the gun be functionally as simple as possible with no extra doodads or jimcracks that could interfere with the gun working in that split second it needs to in a self-defense situation.
I'm now sold on the heel magazine release (not relevant to your question), but I'd like to see the release trimmed so it doesn't protrude so much or make a gap that can catch seams when the gun is drawn from a pocket. Otherwise, I'm not in favor of any modifications to the design with the possible exception of moving the assembly pin access holes in the slide a bit to make field stripping easier.
The CA market is a big one, and I'm sure they're attracted by it, but silly requirements that preclude a gun like this and others from being sold there should be addressed through the political process by Californians pressuring the Legislature to be sensible. Otherwise, if companies like Rohrbaugh and Kel Tec play the silly game to comply with CA's silly games, the anti-gunners in the Legislature are just going to push for more and even sillier requirements like those in NJ did to require "smart" guns when the first viable smart gun is produced. One such stupid requirment might be that any gun sold in CA must occupy a volume of not less than 231 cubic inches and weigh not less than 5 pounds.
Sorry for the rant, but that's one of my hot buttons.
Thanks... Unless something's changed recently (possible), I think the California requirements involve internal safeties (and testing) to make sure the handgun won't fire if it's dropped. The NAA guardian doesn't have a slide lock and it's on the approved list.
It's understandable if a company doesn't want to (or can't afford to) subject themselves to California's special requirements. I suppose that's what the people passing the laws would really like.
It's understandable if a company doesn't want to (or can't afford to) subject themselves to California's special requirements. I suppose that's what the people passing the laws would really like.
If one of those "required" safeties involves a firing pin or hammer block, then the Rohrbaugh won't pass because it doesn't have one. yxguy over on www.KTOG.org set up a rig for a KT P-11 to fall on its muzzle, and found that from way more than the 4' requirement, it would fire, and it's also a true DAO like the Rohrbaugh.
If the requirement is that it not fire from a certain height, such as 4', I'm sure the R9 would pass. If the requirement is that PLUS a mechanical contrivance, then it won't. The only thing that would make sense is for the law to require the gun to pass the drop test.
Maybe they are going to submit it for testing when and if they catch up on their order backlog!
If the requirement is that it not fire from a certain height, such as 4', I'm sure the R9 would pass. If the requirement is that PLUS a mechanical contrivance, then it won't. The only thing that would make sense is for the law to require the gun to pass the drop test.
Maybe they are going to submit it for testing when and if they catch up on their order backlog!
Jeff OTMG
Member
They need a new rule in Ca. Don't drop your pistol. Pass a law, they have so many already one more won't hurt.
Andrew Wyatt
Member
all a gun needs is to pass the drop tests.
Mr Jody Hudson
Member
Thanks Blackhawk,
Your point is so obviously correct. I took $500 deposit to my FFL today and then called him back later and told him to just send full purchase price and that I'd bring the rest that he needs in the morning. I think he may have sent everything today, if not, I'll see him in the morning and get the transaction completed from this end.
Your point is so obviously correct. I took $500 deposit to my FFL today and then called him back later and told him to just send full purchase price and that I'd bring the rest that he needs in the morning. I think he may have sent everything today, if not, I'll see him in the morning and get the transaction completed from this end.
Sven
Senior Member
Mr. R called me and said he has some very good news for California folks interested in getting one of these... developing...
Sven
Senior Member
OK - the update: the Rohrbaughs should be available in California by Spring.
Cha-CHING!
Cha-CHING!
That's great news! I think I'd really like one of these (assuming the reports from the range are positive). Do you think it would be better/faster to try to get one through a local dealer or just order one directly? Suppose they'd take California orders early? I wonder what year the delivery would be if you don't already have an order in.
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