686 internal lock problem

Armchair Warrior said:

I keep hearing that the S&W internal lock is a problem. I have several S&W revolvers but only my 638 has a lock and I rarely use that gun so have had no problem with it. I want a 686 but do not want to spend months looking in the used gun area of gun stores or pawn shops to find an older one. Is it really such a problem that I should go to great lengths to get an old one? If so, what is the most efficient way to find one.
For me looking around in gun stores is much like going to the dog pound. It is difficult to leave without bringing home a new one even if it was not what I went there looking for. So it could be costly if I have to go many places looking for what I want.

Click to expand...

Local gun shops should be full of used revolvers. On last trip I looked at: 2.5" S&W66, .41
'Mountain Gun', 3" 460 X-frame, Colt Police 2" .38, Ruger 101 .32H&R, short barreled .454 Ruger "Bear Gun",.......tonnage of good revolvers. Good time to live for S&W MIM and lock haters.

You can see lock failure videos on YouTube, FWIW. To be fair, there's not a ton of them.

I've been casually shopping for a 627 "UDR" (or bloodwork) revolver, and I can tell you that the gun broker prices on the earlier no-lock versions are night and day from the modern lock reissue, and it's not a case of used being cheaper than new...

PabloJ said:

Local gun shops should be full of used revolvers. On last trip I looked at: 2.5" S&W66, .41
'Mountain Gun', 3" 460 X-frame, Colt Police 2" .38, Ruger 101 .32H&R, short barreled .454 Ruger "Bear Gun",.......tonnage of good revolvers. Good time to live for S&W MIM and lock haters.

Click to expand...

Those haters will have to get over the hole in the X-Frame. Used or not, there are no X-Frames without it. Same goes for some of the other newer models and PC options that came out after it's inception.

Like fine wine, older is better - and worth more - when it comes to S&W revolvers.

I wouldn't accept as a gift any revolver made by the current company calling itself S&W. In fact, I wouldn't purchase any handgun made by them since 2000. Cheaply made and ugly guns. Lousy gritty triggers and clocked barrels. Modern production S&W revolvers should come with a return shipping tag......and a Beta tester T-shirt too.

I've got a safe full of the fine revolvers they made in the past and no need for lesser guns.

I have a 617-one of the first with MIM parts. It is still tight and accurate after thousands of rounds. When Safe-T-Hammer locks appeared, people began complaining that they were ugly. I defended them as earlier Smith revolvers had a through pin in the same location. Then the reports of spontaneous lock-ups started to appear and Smith suborned a gun writer to convey the message that they "had never seen anything like that." While local gun shops had not seen any lock problems, several of my friends did have the locks self engage. On was the 629 made of a light alloy, A magnum load would bounce the hammer back and flip the internal lock mechanism into partial engagement. The NASSF media spokes person bought one of these for bear country and the same thing happened to him.
It is possible that S&W fixed the problem but no reports are forthcoming. It would be tedious to report having corrected a problem that they went to so much trouble to deny in the first place.

I the past year I have picked up excellent examples of pre-lock S&W K and L frames - 2 66's, a 19, a 686, and a 15 -- The MOST I paid for any of them was $520 -- that was for a 66-1 with the box and paperwork and the whole shot. Around here I can't touch a new model S&W for anywhere near that.

If I want it bad enough and it is priced right I will buy them with the lock, first thing I do is remove the lock. If it is a choice between a lock gun and a prelock and condition is equal that is a easy decision always buy the prelock.

The interesting thing about pre-lock smiths is that the current generation that likes them is shuffling off the mortal coil at an accelerating rate leaving a good supply of them for the smaller number of people in the current generation who prefer them to the die-cast plastic pistols they see on television. The problem is that they are relics and the gunsmiths able to keep them in repair are few and far between.

rcmodel said:

Much ado about nothing.

I guess there were a few reported cases of locks locking themselves on the very light hard kicking alloy J-Frames a few years ago.

Do you really think S&W would continue with the same design all these years if they were getting flooded with repair returns and lawsuits??

IMO: If it isn't broke, don't fix it.

rc

Click to expand...

Why is it exactly, that all LEA/LEO's worldwide, disable the internal lock on their S&W revolvers? I own several Australian revolvers(M66's)and all of the internal locks have been disabled!

I bought a 686 when they first put the locks on them. First cylinder full of 38 specials at the range, and it locked up tight with the hammer back on a live round. Had to jam the web of my hand between the hammer and frame and carry in to the gunsmith that worked at the range store I had just purchased it from. It was the lock parts that had locked it up. I still have the gun as a range gun and the lock is removed. I would NEVER use it for self defense or carry. That was over 10 years ago and I have never, and will never, purchase another with a lock on it. They are ugly, insulting, and dangerous in my experience.

Yea!
I bought a lemon Dodge truck like that about then too.
(The two times before that it was to lemon Chevys in a row and I switched to Dodge.)

Ship happens, but it didn't stop me from buying another Dodge truck.

They just keep getting better every time I buy another new one!

rc

a built in lock which requires a tool to disengage is a bad idea on a self defense gun.

for plinking and the like i dont see a problem with it.

thats just me though.

Oh, no! Not again.

My primary problem with THE LOCK is that it's ugly and located in a very visible location.

The lock will incorrectly engage in certainly light framed guns when shooting heavy bullets. I don't do this, so it's not a problem for me. If you don't have an unabtainium frame, then merely test your ammo to verify it works until you are satisfied.

If it really annoys you because it looks like a zit on the side of your gun, then remove it and install THE PLUG (available from a guy on the S&W Forum). No, it's NOT a safety. It is a STORAGE DEVICE. You're not going to use it anyway ("Excuse me Mr. Felon while I unlock my gun!"), so there is no point to having it unless you are in a stupid state that requires it by law.

The only thing I don't like about the locks is purely cosmetic. Heck, I've even used it a few times. However, if I was looking for a certain S&W and had the choice between lock and no lock, I would pick the latter.

Give Murphy a chance and he'll make you believe that anything is possible. Because it is.

Theres a vid of one of Performance Center guns randomly locking up while shooting...

BUT the lock is removable and there was a place making plugs to fill the hole depending on model and finish.

tomrkba said:

o, it's NOT a safety. It is a STORAGE DEVICE. You're not going to use it anyway ("Excuse me Mr. Felon while I unlock my gun!"), so there is no point to having it unless you are in a stupid state that requires it by law.

Click to expand...

That is an interesting point.

Long time shooters and Smith owners will always bash the internal lock. I have never had an issue with mine. That being said, I'd certainly prefer if they were a thing of the past, but I think the problem is overstated by many. Take it with a grain of salt.

Just remove the flag and the locking function is gone. You'll have to get used to the hole.

www.armslist.com

People are liquidating revolvers like gangbusters so they can buy AR-15's and $100 17 round Glock magazines.

Having no first hand information and never being able to duplicate the lock "problem", I finally concluded that it was pure nutcase invention and not anything to worry about.

Click to expand...

I must be one of the many "nutcases" out there. I'm aware of at least three instances. One locked up on a range while the person was shooting it a few tables away from me. The hammer was down and the trigger couldn't be pulled. Fiddling with the key didn't solve the problem. The second was brought into police HQ while I was on station duty. This one was locked solid with the hammer back on a live round. The third one I never saw but it belonged to another officer's son. The son, also an officer, bought the gun as a backup to his duty gun. I'm told that he sold it after the problem persisted even after he had it serviced at the factory.

In addition, it is ugly and it represents a sell-out to the dark side so I will never have one.