dww
Member
two would work together based on the 357 experience.
Something like 15 grains under a 180 FMJTC.
Anyone using this powder in a Glock 20?
dww
Something like 15 grains under a 180 FMJTC.
Anyone using this powder in a Glock 20?
dww
10mm and LIL' Gun? Seems to me that these
- Thread starter dww
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stans
Member
Lil' Gun burns about as slow as H-110 and W-296 and I don't know of anyone using H-110 or W-296 in the 10mm, so I don't really know if Lil' Gun would do all that well in the 10mm. I think 10mm peaks out with powders like AA#7, although you can use AA#9 under a 200 grain bullet and gain a few more feet per second, but the difference in not that much, at least that has been my limited experience with the 10.
Clark
Member
LIL'GUN or H110 would be very good in a Relover that takes 10mm seated out to 1.3".
Not worth the trouble in a mag fed 10mm.
Better to use 800X, Power Pistol, LONGSHOT, etc.
Not worth the trouble in a mag fed 10mm.
Better to use 800X, Power Pistol, LONGSHOT, etc.
Cortland
Member
800X is awesome in 10mm, especially under 220 grainers. Too bad its flakes are huge and meters terribly.
Grump
Member
Don't some reloading manuals list H110 and/or WW296 in 10mm loads?
stans
Member
Yep, Winchester listed W-296 in their manual, but its performance does not apprear to be very good. They listed 12.6 grains for 180 and 190 grain bullets and 11.6 grains for 200 grain bullets, all jacketed. I put 12.0 grains in a 10mm case and it appeared to take up about 95% of the space available for powder. Winchester's loads with W-296 gave the lowest velocities of all the loads they tested with the exception of WST and W-296 was the lowest pressure of all the rounds tested. I think W-296/H-110 is just too slow for the 10mm case and you just can't get enough powder into the case to generate the pressure that will drive this caliber to its potential.
W-296/H-110 also work best with magnum primers. For Winchester, this is not a problem since they only make one type of large pistol primer and it is hot enough to ignite any pistol powder. W-296/H-110 also work best with a heavy roll crimp to greatly increase bullet pull, this is something that you cannot do with a pistol cartridge that headspaces on the case mouth.
W-296/H-110 also work best with magnum primers. For Winchester, this is not a problem since they only make one type of large pistol primer and it is hot enough to ignite any pistol powder. W-296/H-110 also work best with a heavy roll crimp to greatly increase bullet pull, this is something that you cannot do with a pistol cartridge that headspaces on the case mouth.
Bringsteen
Member
Hodgdon Lil'Gun Works in the 10mm!
THESE DATA ARE NOT FROM A RELOADING GUIDE. YOU ASSUME ALL RESPONSIBILITY CONCERNING YOUR USE OF THESE DATA.
After much theorizing, I decided to load Hodgdon Lil’Gun in the 10mm. My starting loads were based on a number of factors:
--maximum working pressure for the 10mm (which, at 37,500, is lower in practice than some people realize);
--Hodgdon’s various Lil’Gun loads for the .327 Federal, .38 Super, and .357 Magnum;
--total grain capacities of the 10mm and the above calibers; and,
--my experience with the 10mm’s slowest recommended powder, Accurate #9.
These factors do not add up to an ability to perfectly predict the outcome. But I am happy to note that not only was I able to complete the testing safely, but I came up with some rather promising results.
Components:
--Hornady 180 grain XTP bullets;
--New Starline brass;
--CCI 350 Magnum Pistol Primers.
Everything I read about Lil’Gun indicated that it requires a magnum primer and a heavy crimp. In preparing these loads, I seated and lightly crimped the bullets with a conventional seating/crimping die, then immediately put a heavy-duty crimp on them with a Lee Crimp die. I did the initial crimp before the heavy-duty crimp because some of the charges were slightly compressed. Incidentally, while Hodgdon has warned in the past that Lil’Gun should not be compressed, in the 2009 Hodgdon reloading manual Hodgdon published a compressed Lil’Gun load for the .38 Super. I loaded all cartridges to just under 1.26".
As a baseline, I fired two strings of high-power Accurate #9 loads on the same day as the Lil'Gun loads. All strings were fired in the same pistol, my Colt Delta Elite Gold Cup. I used a 24 pound Wolf recoil spring, coupled with the original recoil spring plug, which incorporates a smaller, secondary spring. My Delta Elite does not have a fully-supported chamber.
Accurate #9, 15 grains
_ 1)_1331.0_ -32.6 f
_ 2)_1366.0_ 2.4
_ 3)_1370.0_ 6.4
_ 4)_1373.0_ 9.4
_ 5)_1365.0_ 1.4
_ 6)_1354.0_ -9.6
_ 7)_1360.0_ -3.6
_ 8)_1368.0_ 4.4
_ 9)_1370.0_ 6.4
_ 10)_1379.0_ 15.4
__ High:_1379.0
__ Low:_1331.0
__ E.S.:_ 48.0
__ Ave.:_1363.6
__ S.D.:_ 13.3
__ 95%:_ ±10.0
Accurate #9, 15.5 grains
_ 1)_1393.0_ -7.9
_ 2)_1417.0_ 16.1
_ 3)_1398.0_ -2.9
_ 4)_1395.0_ -5.9
_ 5)_1405.0_ 4.1
_ 6)_1410.0_ 9.1
_ 7)_1399.0_ -1.9
_ 8)_1413.0_ 12.1
_ 9)_1396.0_ -4.9
_ 10)_1383.0_ -17.9
__ High:_1417.0
__ Low:_1383.0
__ E.S.:_ 34.0
__ Ave.:_1400.9
__ S.D.:_ 10.3
__ 95%:_ ±7.8
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 15 grains
_ 1)_1219.0_ -19.8
_ 2)_1217.0_ -21.8
_ 3)_1260.0_ 21.2
_ 4)_1256.0_ 17.2
_ 5)_1265.0_ 26.2
_ 6)_1247.0_ 8.2
_ 7)_1242.0_ 3.2
_ 8)_1224.0_ -14.8
_ 9)_1233.0_ -5.8
_ 10)_1225.0_ -13.8
__ High:_1265.0
__ Low:_1217.0
__ E.S.:_ 48.0
__ Ave.:_1238.8
__ S.D.:_ 17.7
__ 95%:_ ±13.4
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 15.5 grains
_ 1)_1250.0_ -5.3
_ 2)_1254.0_ -1.3
_ 3)_1267.0_ 11.7
_ 4)_1227.0_ -28.3
_ 5)_1286.0_ 30.7
_ 6)_1272.0_ 16.7
_ 7)_1266.0_ 10.7
_ 8)_1216.0_ -39.3
_ 9)_1238.0_ -17.3
_ 10)_1277.0_ 21.7
__ High:_1286.0
__ Low:_1216.0
__ E.S.:_ 70.0
__ Ave.:_1255.3
__ S.D.:_ 22.7
__ 95%:_ ±17.1
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 16 grains
_ 1)_1282.0_ -4.5
_ 2)_1314.0_ 27.5
_ 3)_1282.0_ -4.5
_ 4)_1285.0_ -1.5
_ 5)_1304.0_ 17.5
_ 6)_1298.0_ 11.5
_ 7)_1253.0_ -33.5
_ 8)_1268.0_ -18.5
_ 9)_1279.0_ -7.5
_ 10)_1300.0_ 13.5
__ High:_1314.0
__ Low:_1253.0
__ E.S.:_ 61.0
__ Ave.:_1286.5
__ S.D.:_ 18.1
__ 95%:_ ±13.7
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 16.5 grains
_ 1)_1246.0_ -47.7
_ 2)_1323.0_ 29.3
_ 3)_1286.0_ -7.7
_ 4)_1310.0_ 16.3
_ 5)_1320.0_ 26.3
_ 6)_1297.0_ 3.3
_ 7)_1286.0_ -7.7
_ 8)_1282.0_ -11.7
_ 9)_1273.0_ -20.7
_ 10)_1314.0_ 20.3
__ High:_1323.0
__ Low:_1246.0
__ E.S.:_ 77.0
__ Ave.:_1293.7
__ S.D.:_ 24.0
__ 95%:_ ±18.1
These results are quite promising. The fired brass and primers looked very healthy. As noted earlier, I fired these in a pistol without a fully-supported chamber. While I often see “Glocksmiles” (even though it is a Colt) when shooting high-power 800-X loads, there were none to be found from the Lil’Gun loads. An average of 1293 is nothing to write home about, particularly considering the 1400 fps average in the 15.5 grain Accurate #9 load. But the fact is that Lil’Gun works in the 10mm! I don’t have time right now, but I am interested in moving up .5 grain to 1 grain.
I hope that this information is valuable.
THESE DATA ARE NOT FROM A RELOADING GUIDE. YOU ASSUME ALL RESPONSIBILITY CONCERNING YOUR USE OF THESE DATA.
After much theorizing, I decided to load Hodgdon Lil’Gun in the 10mm. My starting loads were based on a number of factors:
--maximum working pressure for the 10mm (which, at 37,500, is lower in practice than some people realize);
--Hodgdon’s various Lil’Gun loads for the .327 Federal, .38 Super, and .357 Magnum;
--total grain capacities of the 10mm and the above calibers; and,
--my experience with the 10mm’s slowest recommended powder, Accurate #9.
These factors do not add up to an ability to perfectly predict the outcome. But I am happy to note that not only was I able to complete the testing safely, but I came up with some rather promising results.
Components:
--Hornady 180 grain XTP bullets;
--New Starline brass;
--CCI 350 Magnum Pistol Primers.
Everything I read about Lil’Gun indicated that it requires a magnum primer and a heavy crimp. In preparing these loads, I seated and lightly crimped the bullets with a conventional seating/crimping die, then immediately put a heavy-duty crimp on them with a Lee Crimp die. I did the initial crimp before the heavy-duty crimp because some of the charges were slightly compressed. Incidentally, while Hodgdon has warned in the past that Lil’Gun should not be compressed, in the 2009 Hodgdon reloading manual Hodgdon published a compressed Lil’Gun load for the .38 Super. I loaded all cartridges to just under 1.26".
As a baseline, I fired two strings of high-power Accurate #9 loads on the same day as the Lil'Gun loads. All strings were fired in the same pistol, my Colt Delta Elite Gold Cup. I used a 24 pound Wolf recoil spring, coupled with the original recoil spring plug, which incorporates a smaller, secondary spring. My Delta Elite does not have a fully-supported chamber.
Accurate #9, 15 grains
_ 1)_1331.0_ -32.6 f
_ 2)_1366.0_ 2.4
_ 3)_1370.0_ 6.4
_ 4)_1373.0_ 9.4
_ 5)_1365.0_ 1.4
_ 6)_1354.0_ -9.6
_ 7)_1360.0_ -3.6
_ 8)_1368.0_ 4.4
_ 9)_1370.0_ 6.4
_ 10)_1379.0_ 15.4
__ High:_1379.0
__ Low:_1331.0
__ E.S.:_ 48.0
__ Ave.:_1363.6
__ S.D.:_ 13.3
__ 95%:_ ±10.0
Accurate #9, 15.5 grains
_ 1)_1393.0_ -7.9
_ 2)_1417.0_ 16.1
_ 3)_1398.0_ -2.9
_ 4)_1395.0_ -5.9
_ 5)_1405.0_ 4.1
_ 6)_1410.0_ 9.1
_ 7)_1399.0_ -1.9
_ 8)_1413.0_ 12.1
_ 9)_1396.0_ -4.9
_ 10)_1383.0_ -17.9
__ High:_1417.0
__ Low:_1383.0
__ E.S.:_ 34.0
__ Ave.:_1400.9
__ S.D.:_ 10.3
__ 95%:_ ±7.8
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 15 grains
_ 1)_1219.0_ -19.8
_ 2)_1217.0_ -21.8
_ 3)_1260.0_ 21.2
_ 4)_1256.0_ 17.2
_ 5)_1265.0_ 26.2
_ 6)_1247.0_ 8.2
_ 7)_1242.0_ 3.2
_ 8)_1224.0_ -14.8
_ 9)_1233.0_ -5.8
_ 10)_1225.0_ -13.8
__ High:_1265.0
__ Low:_1217.0
__ E.S.:_ 48.0
__ Ave.:_1238.8
__ S.D.:_ 17.7
__ 95%:_ ±13.4
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 15.5 grains
_ 1)_1250.0_ -5.3
_ 2)_1254.0_ -1.3
_ 3)_1267.0_ 11.7
_ 4)_1227.0_ -28.3
_ 5)_1286.0_ 30.7
_ 6)_1272.0_ 16.7
_ 7)_1266.0_ 10.7
_ 8)_1216.0_ -39.3
_ 9)_1238.0_ -17.3
_ 10)_1277.0_ 21.7
__ High:_1286.0
__ Low:_1216.0
__ E.S.:_ 70.0
__ Ave.:_1255.3
__ S.D.:_ 22.7
__ 95%:_ ±17.1
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 16 grains
_ 1)_1282.0_ -4.5
_ 2)_1314.0_ 27.5
_ 3)_1282.0_ -4.5
_ 4)_1285.0_ -1.5
_ 5)_1304.0_ 17.5
_ 6)_1298.0_ 11.5
_ 7)_1253.0_ -33.5
_ 8)_1268.0_ -18.5
_ 9)_1279.0_ -7.5
_ 10)_1300.0_ 13.5
__ High:_1314.0
__ Low:_1253.0
__ E.S.:_ 61.0
__ Ave.:_1286.5
__ S.D.:_ 18.1
__ 95%:_ ±13.7
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 16.5 grains
_ 1)_1246.0_ -47.7
_ 2)_1323.0_ 29.3
_ 3)_1286.0_ -7.7
_ 4)_1310.0_ 16.3
_ 5)_1320.0_ 26.3
_ 6)_1297.0_ 3.3
_ 7)_1286.0_ -7.7
_ 8)_1282.0_ -11.7
_ 9)_1273.0_ -20.7
_ 10)_1314.0_ 20.3
__ High:_1323.0
__ Low:_1246.0
__ E.S.:_ 77.0
__ Ave.:_1293.7
__ S.D.:_ 24.0
__ 95%:_ ±18.1
These results are quite promising. The fired brass and primers looked very healthy. As noted earlier, I fired these in a pistol without a fully-supported chamber. While I often see “Glocksmiles” (even though it is a Colt) when shooting high-power 800-X loads, there were none to be found from the Lil’Gun loads. An average of 1293 is nothing to write home about, particularly considering the 1400 fps average in the 15.5 grain Accurate #9 load. But the fact is that Lil’Gun works in the 10mm! I don’t have time right now, but I am interested in moving up .5 grain to 1 grain.
I hope that this information is valuable.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Give Longshot a try in your 10mm, I'm sure you will like the results. HS-6 isn't bad either. I don't personally shoot a 10mm but guy I shoot with does and he uses Longshot and sometimes HS-6.
The new Winchester powder AutoComp was developed for the 9mm, 40 S&W and .45 Auto but I've heard it will work well in the 10mm too. I have no first hand knowledge but I have hear that from some shooters at the range. Actually, if it works well in the 40 S&W I see no reason it won't work in the 10mm.
The new Winchester powder AutoComp was developed for the 9mm, 40 S&W and .45 Auto but I've heard it will work well in the 10mm too. I have no first hand knowledge but I have hear that from some shooters at the range. Actually, if it works well in the 40 S&W I see no reason it won't work in the 10mm.
Bringsteen
Member
Longshot and HS-6 are both good powders for the 10mm, but neither produces the velocities that Accurate #9 does. AutoComp is just too fast to safely reach maximum velocities in the 10mm, although I have heard that it produces great accuracy.
My goal in testing Hodgdon Lil'Gun is to find a powder that will safely exceed the performance of Accurate #9. But the bar is pretty high. As you can see from my results, #9 will push a 180 grain Hornady xtp to an average of 1400 fps. Lil'Gun will have to average 1450 fps to make it worthwhile.
My goal in testing Hodgdon Lil'Gun is to find a powder that will safely exceed the performance of Accurate #9. But the bar is pretty high. As you can see from my results, #9 will push a 180 grain Hornady xtp to an average of 1400 fps. Lil'Gun will have to average 1450 fps to make it worthwhile.
freakshow10mm
member
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2008
- Messages
- 1,951
IMO 50fps isn't worth it.
Bringsteen
Member
You're possibly right Freak, but in a bowling pin shoot, 50 fps can be relevant. It could also be relevant while hunting to help flatten out the trajectory. However, my principal interest is in finding the powder that will safely yield the highest velocities in the 10mm. If at the end of my testing #9 and 800-X remain the leaders, then so be it. But I feel the need to test other possibilities.
ReloaderFred
Member
In my testing, IMR 800X has provided the highest velocities with heavier bullets. The only drawback is it meters like cornflakes.
I talked to the Hodgdon rep at the last two SHOT Shows about this, and he told me 800X was also his favorite powder for wringing out the best in the 10mm, but he also hated the way it metered. He said there had been some discussion about trying to find a powder that would mimic 800X, but meter well, but they hadn't really pursued it.
Hope this helps.
Fred
I talked to the Hodgdon rep at the last two SHOT Shows about this, and he told me 800X was also his favorite powder for wringing out the best in the 10mm, but he also hated the way it metered. He said there had been some discussion about trying to find a powder that would mimic 800X, but meter well, but they hadn't really pursued it.
Hope this helps.
Fred
Bringsteen
Member
I have had the same experience with 800-X, but I have found that pressures can spike with 800-X to a degree that I haven't found with Accurate #9. A powder just a hair slower than #9 with a little more energy per grain would probably be ideal. Hodgdon Lil'Gun is more than a hair slower than #9, but hopefully it will put up really good velocities. Then we won't have to deal with the poor meterability of 800-X.
GJgo
Member
How in the world are you getting 15.5gr of AA#9 into Starline cases?? At 1.260"??? I load AA#9 into mixed 10mm brass, and the Starline has the smallest case capacity of all. I load to 1.275" with the same 180gr XTP bullets, and since AA9 doesn't compress, the most that will go in my Starline cases at that COAL is 14.4gr for a speed of around 1260 FPS in my Kimber!
ArchAngelCD
Member.
I think Longshot will deliver more velocity than 800-X and it meters a lot better too. Of all the Hodgdon/Winchester/IMR powders recommended for use with a 180gr bullet in a 10mm Auto Longshot is reported to deliver the highest velocities.
freakshow10mm
member
- Joined
- Apr 20, 2008
- Messages
- 1,951
Longshot is a reformulated HS7, and that's about it's performance limits too. LS is a great 10mm powder but pushing a 180gr past the 9.5gr max while chrono mapping didn't leave me with a smile. I wasn't impressed. It does have a very smooth almost linear pressure curve to it though.
If you want some fun with Longshot, chrono map with 135gr Nosler JHP starting with max load for 40 S&W and work up.
If you want some fun with Longshot, chrono map with 135gr Nosler JHP starting with max load for 40 S&W and work up.
Bringsteen
Member
Accurate #9 does compress, just not very much. Because I was doing load development for a powder new to the 10mm (Hodgdon Lil'Gun), I weighed my starting charges on two different scales. I assure you that I was getting 15.5 grains of Accurate #9 into those Starline cases.
GJgo
Member
That's crazy. Nice velocities, though! If I go to 14.5gr with Starline cases at 1.275, the nose of my bullet will start to deform when seated, so any compression that happens is done. (I can get 14.5 into all other case brands, though.)
I'm using Hornady dies, have to measure the case OD after sizing for comparison.
I'm using Hornady dies, have to measure the case OD after sizing for comparison.
Bringsteen
Member
You raise an interesting point about the deformed nose. I wish I had written about this earlier. The nose of my bullets didn't deform, but they did taper, such that the hollow point was a bit smaller and the tip of the bullet was a bit flatter. This, coupled with the ever-so-slight compression of #9, is probably what accounts for my ability to put all 15.5 grains in the case.
My Lil'Gun loads aren't quite that compact yet, so I have a ways to go.
I just tested lil gun(I use it in my 458 socom) against 800x and unique in my 10mm. It is not very good. Not nearly as efficient as the 800x. I liked the unique over the lilgun. 800x is better than longshot. Only those who have not tried 800x in heavy loads talk it down. Once you load it and record the velocities you get some of the powders you used to use seem antiquated. I use an old rcbs measure and do not have any problems with metering. It works awesome in 40sw, and 45 super. I will not post my velocities cause I get tired of being told that according to "lawsuit avoiding" tables in a book that my guns are going to blow up.
brasskeeper
Member
I have always used Bluedot in my 10mm Delta
Bringsteen
Member
New Data--Serious Velocities
The new data are interesting and a little confusing. Once again, I used 180 grain Hornady XTP's, new brass, handloaded each charge, and put a heavy crimp on the cases. As you can see, the 17 grain charges were slightly faster than the 17.5 grain charges.
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 17.0 grains
_ 1)_1409.0_ 13.3
_ 2)_1402.0_ 6.3
_ 3)_1434.0_ 38.3
_ 4)_1371.0_ -24.7
_ 5)_1408.0_ 12.3
_ 6)_1397.0_ 1.3
_ 7)_1419.0_ 23.3
_ 8)_1373.0_ -22.7
_ 9)_1378.0_ -17.7
_ 10)_1366.0_ -29.7
__ High:_1434.0
__ Low:_1366.0
__ E.S.:_ 68.0
__ Ave.:_1395.7
__ S.D.:_ 22.9
__ 95%:_ ±17.3
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 17.5 grains
_ 1)_1351.0_ -37.8
_ 2)_1399.0_ 10.2
_ 3)_1428.0_ 39.2
_ 4)_1414.0_ 25.2
_ 5)_1392.0_ 3.2
_ 6)_1337.0_ -51.8
_ 7)_1383.0_ -5.8
_ 8)_1381.0_ -7.8
_ 9)_1414.0_ 25.2
_ 10)_1390.0_ 0.2
__ High:_1428.0
__ Low:_1337.0
__ E.S.:_ 91.0
__ Ave.:_1388.8
__ S.D.:_ 29.8
__ 95%:_ ±24.3
What is frustrating is that the highest average velocity (1395.7) is actually lower than the highest average velocity using Accurate #9 (1400.9). But the maximum velocity with the Lil'Gun loads was higher (1434) than the #9 loads (1417). I will probably experiment with using a slightly lighter crimp and dropping down by a few tenths of a grain. It may be that compressing Lil'Gun in the 10mm doesn't do any good. Compression loads work for some powder/cartridge combinations, and not for others. I will also try to load them just a little bit longer, but the need for reliability dictates that I only stretch them by a few thousands of an inch, so it may not make any difference.
The new data are interesting and a little confusing. Once again, I used 180 grain Hornady XTP's, new brass, handloaded each charge, and put a heavy crimp on the cases. As you can see, the 17 grain charges were slightly faster than the 17.5 grain charges.
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 17.0 grains
_ 1)_1409.0_ 13.3
_ 2)_1402.0_ 6.3
_ 3)_1434.0_ 38.3
_ 4)_1371.0_ -24.7
_ 5)_1408.0_ 12.3
_ 6)_1397.0_ 1.3
_ 7)_1419.0_ 23.3
_ 8)_1373.0_ -22.7
_ 9)_1378.0_ -17.7
_ 10)_1366.0_ -29.7
__ High:_1434.0
__ Low:_1366.0
__ E.S.:_ 68.0
__ Ave.:_1395.7
__ S.D.:_ 22.9
__ 95%:_ ±17.3
Hodgdon Lil’Gun, 17.5 grains
_ 1)_1351.0_ -37.8
_ 2)_1399.0_ 10.2
_ 3)_1428.0_ 39.2
_ 4)_1414.0_ 25.2
_ 5)_1392.0_ 3.2
_ 6)_1337.0_ -51.8
_ 7)_1383.0_ -5.8
_ 8)_1381.0_ -7.8
_ 9)_1414.0_ 25.2
_ 10)_1390.0_ 0.2
__ High:_1428.0
__ Low:_1337.0
__ E.S.:_ 91.0
__ Ave.:_1388.8
__ S.D.:_ 29.8
__ 95%:_ ±24.3
What is frustrating is that the highest average velocity (1395.7) is actually lower than the highest average velocity using Accurate #9 (1400.9). But the maximum velocity with the Lil'Gun loads was higher (1434) than the #9 loads (1417). I will probably experiment with using a slightly lighter crimp and dropping down by a few tenths of a grain. It may be that compressing Lil'Gun in the 10mm doesn't do any good. Compression loads work for some powder/cartridge combinations, and not for others. I will also try to load them just a little bit longer, but the need for reliability dictates that I only stretch them by a few thousands of an inch, so it may not make any difference.
Hello,
I'm very interested in your Lil'Gun experiments with 10mm as I have access to quite a bit of it at very reasonable prices. (Half or less of what Blue Dot runs me)
While if it works out as optimal that's even better, but I'm interested in using it for lighter to medium loads for my kids and I to plink with in the my Delta Elite.
Cases would be star-line. Bullets most likely Barnes 170g (bought several boxes on closeout). CCI LP Mag primers.
Any reason you can think of not to start a hair below your minimum loads for the 180g? Given star-line case volume issue, and the overall challenge getting enough powder in I should not be at risk of empty case spikes some reduced loads have.
What I'd really like to find is something just stout enough to cycle so my boys will enjoy shooting it more. (They like a few rounds of my blue dot loads, but that's enough)
I also have lot's of 231 I'm not using, but the difference between too wimpy and scary hot is just too slim. I'd never meter it, where I'm hoping I could crank out plinking ammo by metering with Lil'Gun safely.
Any input welcome, I was going to start the process you went down, but you saved me a big step!
I know most are looking to wring the maximum out, but lately I'm spending more time with reduced loads and cheaper components. The rifle that get's shot the most lately is a Manlicher 7x57 '95 Mauser using 16g of 2400 & 175g round nosed bullets. I can hit golf balls with it repeatedly at 25 yards offhand, and at 100 it's still shooting better than I can. So I'm looking for similar cheap & fun loads for the 10mm.
Thanks,
Alan
I'm very interested in your Lil'Gun experiments with 10mm as I have access to quite a bit of it at very reasonable prices. (Half or less of what Blue Dot runs me)
While if it works out as optimal that's even better, but I'm interested in using it for lighter to medium loads for my kids and I to plink with in the my Delta Elite.
Cases would be star-line. Bullets most likely Barnes 170g (bought several boxes on closeout). CCI LP Mag primers.
Any reason you can think of not to start a hair below your minimum loads for the 180g? Given star-line case volume issue, and the overall challenge getting enough powder in I should not be at risk of empty case spikes some reduced loads have.
What I'd really like to find is something just stout enough to cycle so my boys will enjoy shooting it more. (They like a few rounds of my blue dot loads, but that's enough)
I also have lot's of 231 I'm not using, but the difference between too wimpy and scary hot is just too slim. I'd never meter it, where I'm hoping I could crank out plinking ammo by metering with Lil'Gun safely.
Any input welcome, I was going to start the process you went down, but you saved me a big step!
I know most are looking to wring the maximum out, but lately I'm spending more time with reduced loads and cheaper components. The rifle that get's shot the most lately is a Manlicher 7x57 '95 Mauser using 16g of 2400 & 175g round nosed bullets. I can hit golf balls with it repeatedly at 25 yards offhand, and at 100 it's still shooting better than I can. So I'm looking for similar cheap & fun loads for the 10mm.
Thanks,
Alan
Bringsteen
Member
You're kind of in a tough situation. You have cheap access to a magnum powder, but you want to use it for target-strength loads. It may be achievable, but it will likely be less than ideal.
I would start at 14 grains. Use a heavy crimp and magnum primers. The main danger of using a magnum powder to construct target/plinking loads is that the pressures could accidentally be so low that you get a bullet lodged in the barrel.
I would start at 14 grains. Use a heavy crimp and magnum primers. The main danger of using a magnum powder to construct target/plinking loads is that the pressures could accidentally be so low that you get a bullet lodged in the barrel.
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