10mm once fired brass pricing

[packpike]

I don't understand why 10mm once fired brass is so expensive compared to say .45's. Here's my logic, but it's not lining up with asking prices, so please correct my error. 10mm & .45 new brass from starline are both $.16 each. I can buy .45 once fired for around $.05-.06 each. So my assumption was that 10mm once fired brass would have similar pricing, but I'm seeing asking prices of $.14-.15 each. I understand that there's a lot less 10mm floating out there than 45, but the handling costs for someone in that business are no different. In other words, I don't see that sorting out some 10mm from a range pickup, cleaning it, storing and shipping it would be any more costly than 45's. The brass recycling value should be similar too, so what am I missing?

 

[dragon813gt]

You don't want to accept the fact that there is a lot less of it. Not many people shoot 10mm. Supply is low so cost is higher. I pick up brass from three different ranges regularly. Two private and one public. I may have picked up a box worth in the past five years. It comes down to how many are on the market.

 

[packpike]

...Supply is low so cost is higher...

That's where I don't follow. I do understand economics and understand that the cost of loaded ammo is more expensive because of smaller runs, less efficiency, etc. But for once fired brass, when weight is taken into account, the processing cost is the same. For 10mm it's got to be almost the same as .45's. I can understand them commanding a premium, say $.08 each, just because they're less available on this secondary market, but at $.14 why would anyone buy once fired?

Edit to say that maybe when you say 'cost' is higher, you meant price.

 

[Reefinmike]

simply put supply and demand. not much 10mm brass laying out there at the range that is otherwise littered with 9, 40, 45 and 223.

Same goes for 357 magnum. I had only a thousand pieces of 357 that took me over 3 years of searching at the public range to find. In this time, I found 5,000 38spl, 5,000 45 and stopped picking up 9mm and 223 at the 5k mark. Once I started shooting and loading a lot more w296 357 loads, I went looking for some more once fired. Everyone wants 14-15 cents a piece for mixed headstamp "once fired" brass. Why would I pay that when I can get a thousand pieces of starline shipped to my door for $135? consistent case length and wall thickness is another bonus of buying new. Sometimes you just have to buy the new stuff. I ordered 500pc of 500s&w last week. pretty stuff

 

[packpike]

I agree. I'm ordering 1K from Starline, so I obviously don't see a problem with the prices. The executive summary is that range pickers are looking to triple their margin because 10mm once fired brass is not common. And to be clear, I don't have an issue with a range picker asking whatever he wants for his brass. I was just curious to see if I was missing anything else in the equation that was driving the cost (not price) up and it sounds like I wasn't. Thanks.

 

[Rule3]

Simple economics, supply and demand

Limited supply and limited demand.

In contrast say 9mm, very high supply and pretty high demand So the supply negates the demand part,

Heck I don't even pick up 40 SW any more I gather so much of it I have enough for a lifetime.

Just like rare guns, some very special hard to find gun is gonna cost more than a run of the mill Glock or other polymer gun.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Unfortunately that's the way supply and demand works. When there are 10 people looking for 45 Auto brass and 25 sellers they have to lower their price to get you to buy their brass. When those same 10 buys are looking for 10mm brass and there are only 2 sellers they can push up the price to see what the buyers are willing to pay. If you were selling you would do the same.

In this case I think you went in the right direction buying new brass.

 

[LiveLife]

Have you considered using 40S&W brass loaded to 10mm length using 40S&W load data? Many just shoot 40S&W in their 10mm pistols.

There's also 10mm to 40S&W conversion barrel option.

BTW, el indio just posted 80 once-fired 10mm brass in the PIF thread - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=10181939#post10181939

 

[kerreckt]

It makes perfect sense to me. There is a whole lot more .45acp than 10mm. I can buy a 5 gallon pail full of .45acp once fired for about $100. I have never seen a 5 gallon pail of 10mm. Store bought 10mm cost more than 45acp and fewer people shoot it. Of course, the brass will sell for a premium.

 

[Rule3]

Have you considered using 40S&W brass loaded to 10mm length using 40S&W load data? Many just shoot 40S&W in their 10mm pistols.

There's also 10mm to 40S&W conversion barrel option.

BTW, el indio just posted 80 once-fired 10mm brass in the PIF thread - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=10181939#post10181939

How do you shoot 40 sw in a barrel chambered for 10mm? It does not headspace correctly and falls in the barrel?

I have a 10mm revolver and with moon clips I can shoot 40 SW.

 

[LiveLife]

How do you shoot 40 sw in a barrel chambered for 10mm? It does not headspace correctly and falls in the barrel?

40S&W round will headspace off extractor in 10mm. Similar to when using a short brass that's been reloaded many times - It no longer headspaces on the case mouth but the extractor.

I planned on getting a 10mm-40S&W conversion barrel when I get a Glock 20SF but keep seeing shooters shooting 40S&W rounds instead.

I know some of us Glock shooters are crazy but not all of us?

Video of shooting 40S&W in 10mm Glock
[YOUTUBE]AwXtEm70Q0M[/YOUTUBE]

 

[ljnowell]

I don't understand why 10mm once fired brass is so expensive compared to say .45's. Here's my logic, but it's not lining up with asking prices, so please correct my error. 10mm & .45 new brass from starline are both $.16 each. I can buy .45 once fired for around $.05-.06 each. So my assumption was that 10mm once fired brass would have similar pricing, but I'm seeing asking prices of $.14-.15 each. I understand that there's a lot less 10mm floating out there than 45, but the handling costs for someone in that business are no different. In other words, I don't see that sorting out some 10mm from a range pickup, cleaning it, storing and shipping it would be any more costly than 45's. The brass recycling value should be similar too, so what am I missing?

It certainly takes me longer to sort 10mm from 40s&w. There are maybe 100 10mm for every 3-4 40S&W brass I purchase from ranges. If I could only sell them for .05 each then I would simply leave them mixed into the 40 since I already include extras already. To sort those out I get to go through 15k or more 40S&W at a time and hand sort them. Same with 357 Sig. So, yeah, I charge more for them and will continue too.

Same as LPP and SPP 45 brass. If you don't care how they are mixed I sell them cheaper. But if you want one or the other they cost more. It takes my time. My time is money.

 

[OilyPablo]

Starline is great brass. Buy 1000 or 2000, buy some commercial brass ammo for awhile and shoot that as well. You will have enough brass to keep you cycling just fine. I've never had to buy spent brass for all the 10mm shooting I do.

I get what you are saying, but free markets can be brutally efficient or just frustratingly insane in bursts, but controlled markets almost always worse.

 

[Rule3]

40S&W round will headspace off extractor in 10mm. Similar to when using a short brass that's been reloaded many times - It no longer headspaces on the case mouth but the extractor.

I planned on getting a 10mm-40S&W conversion barrel when I get a Glock 20SF but keep seeing shooters shooting 40S&W rounds instead.

I know some of us Glock shooters are crazy but not all of us?

]

I dropped a 40 cal round in my 10 MM Glock and it sure did not look right?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

The good news is, while the 10mm was all but dead 5 years go it has made a comeback. There have been more than one company who have chamberd a new release in 10mm the past two years. This is very good for the faithful who hung on.

 

[ljnowell]

The good news is, while the 10mm was all but dead 5 years go it has made a comeback. There have been more than one company who have chamberd a new release in 10mm the past two years. This is very good for the faithful who hung on.

I'm glad to see it's hanging in there. It's a great cartridge, had the FBI stuck to it's guns(pun intended) there is no telling where it would be now.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I'm glad to see it's hanging in there. It's a great cartridge, had the FBI stuck to it's guns(pun intended) there is no telling where it would be now.

Oh without a doubt. The FBI abandon it but did adopt the 40 S&W along with many law enforcement agencies and look where it is.

 

[ReloaderFred]

I have a couple of thousand once fired 10mm brass that I bought when Dan Scharch was getting all the FBI brass. I'm working through it and trying to wear it out in my several 10mm firearms, including my 10mm AR. I won't sell even one piece of it, since the days of cheap brass in that caliber are long gone. If that raises the price to others due to scarcity, then the market will determine the price.

I buy the brass from our range, and in the last 3 five gallon buckets of mixed brass, I found exactly two 10mm cases. The last two times I bought brass, there wasn't any 10mm in it at all. That makes it relatively rare, and rare items demand higher prices......

Hope this helps.

Fred

 

[OilyPablo]

Most 10mm shooters are like a crowd behind the money truck with the doors flung open and the money stacks taking to the breeze.

I may have missed two spent cases in all the 10mm shooting I have done since 2009. Again, I'm glad Starline brass is not deadly expensive, and it's really good. I think they move a fair amount.

 

[Duvel]

Economics aside, I wouldn't buy 'range' brass in 10mm.

It's a reloader's cartridge that regularly gets pushed, and (said with healthy dose of sarcasm) is capable of way more than ever intended.

With the varying degrees of case support that exist out there, and the ease of 'fixing' the results of that lack of support...

I play around a bit with the 10, and ironed out mildly sheared cases gets no more than a medium second load. It works, and is safe in my platform.

Buy new Starline, don't gut your gun, be safe

 

[Rule3]

40S&W round will headspace off extractor in 10mm. Similar to when using a short brass that's been reloaded many times - It no longer headspaces on the case mouth but the extractor.

I planned on getting a 10mm-40S&W conversion barrel when I get a Glock 20SF but keep seeing shooters shooting 40S&W rounds instead.

I know some of us Glock shooters are crazy but not all of us?

]

That just ain't right!

 

[orionengnr]

I was just curious to see if I was missing anything else in the equation that was driving the cost (not price) up and it sounds like I wasn't.

Oh, you clearly are.
If Starline has 10mm brass available now, buy it. IIRC, they only do one "run" per year of certain types of brass...in particular, 10mm, .41 Mag and .45LC (there may be others, but I own and load for these.)

I have visited Starline's site any number of times in the last five years looking for/at these cases, and they are seldom available.

That's why people pay the high prices for once-fired--it is often the only game in town. (Same thing goes for .45LC and .41 Mag.)

 

[packpike]

I ordered yesterday and it shipped today. They seem to have plenty. The rarity right now at least seems to be a bourbon legend.

As for the earlier responses, maybe it's just my years in Supply Chain, but the extra cost still has not been explained. For example, the 'extra sorting cost'. Unless you want to tick off your .40 customers you have to sort out the 10mm anyway. There's no additional cost to do so because it's the cost of sorting and selling .40's. Here again, I have no problem with anyone asking whatever price they want for whatever they're selling, but no one here has given an example of why the 'cost' of 10mm once fired brass is higher (assuming that you're not making trips to the range just for 10mm). The simple answer seems to be that it's less common than the other calibers so the range pickers can ask for extra margin when reselling it. I'll repeat, I have no issue with that and am not criticizing it. But that seems to be the answer.

Here's the link https://www.starlinebrass.com/brass-cases/10MM-Auto-Brass/ and while you're there confirming it please notice that it's the same price as .45ACP brass.

 

[reddog81]

It's less common and therefore more valuable. Obviously it cost the brass pickers no more than 40 S&W.

They charge more because people are willing to pay more. I have thousands of extra 40 S&W cases. Everyone of my 10mm case is loaded and some have been loaded 5 or 6 times.

I've got to go now to see if Starline still has any new 10mm for sale.

 

[packpike]

You guys have made me paranoid so I just ordered another 1K. Oh well, it's a good excuse anyway.