$150 knife really better than $50 one?

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Lets also try to keep in mind that a 50.00 knife costs the maker all of 12.00 to get to public sales. The jobber will take his cut, the distributor will take his cut and the retailer will take his cut, making the knife 50.00 to you.

$12.00 is not going to buy good steel, or other materials, let alone the manufacturing process. You'll get what you pay for here I'm afraid.

Take that 5.00 M-tek, what materials will they use at their price point to make it. Not something to be considered IMO.

Krept, good thought process there sir. By the best you can afford to begin with, even if it hurts a little longer on the credit card or bank account.

Doesn't have to be the best, just good enough for any worst case scenario you may find yourself interjected into one day.


Brownie
 
I carry three blades on me daily. One's a $10 mini-Buck for the usual crap that dulls a blade (letter opening, string and box cutting, etc). The second is a Leatherman PST for all the odd things I do (minor field surgery, mechanical repair, etc) the third is a Spyderco Lil' Temperance. I got the Leatherman free, and the Spyderco was nearly $100. And it was worth it. It replaced a now retired Spyderco Delica ($30 at the time) which served me well for seven years, traveled around the world with me, and did all chores for me (box cutting, cleaning fish and game, cutting rope, and as a last ditch defensive weapon once.) The new Spyderco is better steel, stronger lock, more purpose built as a hard-use and defensive knife, and you know what? With my history of using knives hard, it was well worth the money. The Mini-Buck is for the little crap, the Leatherman is my utility tool. The Spyderco is my seat-belt-cutting car-roof-removing buffalo-skinning and holy-crap-i'm-pistol-less defensive weapon in an extreme emergency. I don't use it much, but it's nice to know it's always on me. I'd probably be happy with a Kershaw or other $40-50 knife, as I was with my Delica. But the extra $ was worth it to me.
 
''Sublime & Ridiculous''!!

Another pic of my Buck Mayo TNT (very reduced and compressed lo-res pic) .. below which is a real cheapo (it was a 'giveaway' in fact) .... Chinese ... 420 Stainless, probably cost around $2-5 .... and yet ... this lives in my pocket loose ... and is my ''rough stuff'' knife. I have to say ... it is remarkable, only needing freshening now and again. So I do know cheap [can be halfways OK, even tho it is small.

The Buck .. I still wonder why I spent so much, compared with another gun purchase ... and yet it is certainly at the top end ... and would be my ''seat belt'' cutter in an emergency, as well as SD knife .... it is pocket clipped in my right pocket at all times. Plus, I guess, it is a pleasure to own! Gotta assuage my guilt somehow! :D


buck-chink_s.jpg
 
Brownie,

Certainly, there are lots of low and mid-priced knives out there with bent or broken tips from prying or 'Bruce Lee' reditions. But do you know why? It's because of operator error, plain and simple. Knives are made for slicing.

If you get into one of those 'Navy SEAL operations' and trash your knife, it's hardly because the knife was pooprly made, it's because your plan brought the wrong tool.

Myself and a few of my friends worked in Madison at the old Decker Harley-Davidson. I still have the same ratchets, wrenches, breaker bars and drives that I bought then. None of them are trashed. The reason is simply that professional mechanics do not use a ratchet for a hammer or a fitted screwdriver to pry open paint cans.

We are not operators behind enemy lines. We are students, white collar workers and suburbanites. We always have time to go get the proper tool.

And BTW, there are bargains out there for people on a fixed budget. I bought a Buck mini-Alpha Hunter for a good price, certainly less than a Microtech or a custom. It is made out of ATS-34 steel and heat treated by Paul Bos.

As reasonable a price as that knife goes for, you cannot tell me that a knife so constructed is a poor choice, or will fail. In fact, I'll bet that this Buck will outlast most of the stuff the mall ninjas carry 'just in case.'
 
Lets also try to keep in mind that a 50.00 knife costs the maker all of 12.00 to get to public sales...

That has less to do with the quality of materials involved than it does with such factors as economy of scale. Big cutlery manufacturers buy steel tons at a time. They can also take advantage of mechanization in ways that the little guy can't.
I've owned bunches of knives, including some very, very expensive ones. There's a difference between a $50 knife and a $500 knife. At that price, there'd better be. IME, what you are paying that premium for is exquisite fit and finish (as opposed to adequate), exotic/choice of handle materials (instead of what the manufacturer decided to use), choice of steels (instead of what the manufacturer chose to use), pride of ownership (instead of having exactly the same knife a 1000's of other people), and other more-or-less intangible factors.
Frankly, I'm not buying into the "I might have to hack my way out of the heart of an asteroid" hype either. Since man first learned to work with metal, countless generations of people depended for their very survival on edged tools and weapons that by today's standards wouldn't be as good metalurgically as some of the junk cutlery from Pakistan. Buy what you want. Buy what you can afford. It's your money, after all, and your choice whose sales pitch you want to believe.
 
Tourist:

I agree it would be operator error if one broke a knife. BTW--Knives are not just for slicing, they have a point for stabbing as well.

That doesn't negate the fact that I'll be able to abuse that SnG a lot more before it fails [ if I have to one day ] than the 50.00 knife.

They both may be the wrong tool for the job, but I may not have a choice to carry a pipe wrench with me just in case everyday. Which one will perform longer and suffer less abuse if both are used in the same manner? The more expensive, better fit and materials knife I'm sure. Hence, the choice to cut the odds in my favor just a tad should I need the assistance one day.

Golgo: You don't have to buy into the hype at all. As stated earlier, I also carry an E2E surefire everyday in lieu of one of the cheaper lights. Is it hype to expect the people in NYC could have used that light when the power went out throughout the city and people were stuck in elevators and stairwells with no lighting to see their way down to the ground level? Hardly.

How about that guy who had to amutate his arm half way to the elbow with his very dull multi-tool after surviving stuck under the rock for a few days. He was interviewed afterwards and one of the first things he said he wished he had done was carry a more stout, sharp knife. Didn't think he needed it as well until he did one day.

There are those who will prepare for the worst and there are those who will insist it will never happen to them or the odds are that they'll never run into that situation where the difference between a cheap tool and a well made expensive tool is a moot point.

If it never happens to you, you beat the odds. If it does happen to you and you are one of the people who refused to believe they needed better equipment as it would not happen to you, you are in worst shape than you could have been.

It's not hype, it's a fact of life that people fnd themselves in situations all the time where a "field expediant" tool had to be used in a manner that it was not intended for.

I trust my butt to the best I can afford and find to carry. Anything less is, well, less than it could have been which may just translate to living or dying in a worst case scenario.

I may still die or suffer from not having the right tool, but then you can't carrry a mechanics tool chest around with you everyday on your back. Sometimes you have to make due with what you have, and if you have something less than you could have had it makes life tougher to get out the tight spot you find yourself in.

The Marines have a saying that goes like this: Improvise and survive. If I'm to believe that, and I do, then I'll carry the best I can get my hands on. Improvising with a knife when you need a crowbar is a two edged sword [ sorta speak ].

Though it's not the right tool usually when you improvise, the better made, more solid performer will do more longer than a similiar tool of lesser quality.

Cut the odds in your favor whenever you can, thats the name of the game here. Not whether it's the right tool for the job at hand or not.

Tourist carries a 400.00 Strider for a reason we haven't heard yet from him. There's a reason he carries that knife, bought that knife, spent the money in lieu of the 50.00 folding knife.

I don't carry a Jennings or Lorcin 25 acp to save my butt if and when I may need a gun even though it will probably never happen to most people anymore than I carry a 50.00 retail folder for the same reason. BTW--I've had to use a handgun to get out of several jams based on my prfoession. I suppose one could say I was unlucky in even having to work that type of scenario a few times as most carry a lifetime and never need it to defend themselves or their families.

Again, playing the odds, I had what I needed. Actually I should have had an assault rifle but I made due with a field expedient handgun of superior quality that went bang when I really needed it.

I don't trust my life to a Lorcin or Jennings should I need a handgun and I certainly do not trust my life to a 50.00 folder should I need it either.

No difference between the two in theory at all to my way of thinking.

Brownie
 
I just want to add that I agree 100% with Brownie's first post and those are precisely my sentiments on the topic.

We have no way of knowing what life will throw our way.

As such, its nice knowing that my Glock can get really filthy and still fire.

It is very nice knowing that my Strider can very easily break glass to help me get (knock on wood) myself or someone else out of a wrecked car, and it can sure as heck slice their seatbelt.

It could also cut through a steering wheel and many other parts of a car.

Obviously, if I were anticipating a particular task, I'd bring the appropriate tool. In daily life, however, it isn't really practical to carry a full tool kit on your person wherever you go.

As such, I like knowing that my knife can take abuse and keep coming back for more.

:)
 
That's fantastic for you. I'm glad you are happy with your purchase. When they are available for $150 I'm sure everyone and their brother will be carrying them. Until then, it's still not applicable to the original poster's questions, is it? I'm sure you feel it's appropriate to pay as much for your knife as you did for your sidearm, however, many many many would disagree with you. Many people would prefer a knife that is comfortable and lightweight instead of overbuilt to the extreme and oversized. And just like the $2000 full sized 1911, the big folder that gets left on the dresser because it's uncomfortable to carry is of no use whatsoever when you really need it.

Whatever your reasons are, if you are happy with your purchase, so be it. Your needs obviously differ from the rest of the knife buying public, so you don't need to make excuses for it.
 
The poster asked if more expensive knives are worth the extra money over their less expensive counterparts.

I told him that they most definitely are.
 
And my point is that there is a significant level of diminishing returns after you spend a certain level of money. Something certain people seem to be missing with their "my knife never cuts more than an envelope but I bought it because it can cut through a tank" rationale. Hint Hint. There is no magic in the common steels & materials. If you feel it's worth an extra $250 for maybe 2% of performance difference and an extra few ounces in blade steel, you made the right choice.
 
Apart from the fact that I just had to have it based on looks alone, the fact that I have a high level of respect for the men who make them, and the rock-solid, proven in the real world reputation of their products, I bought that knife as insurance.

As I said, I hope that I never have to use it to cut/pry/stab my way out of a wrecked car or building, but if I do, I have that option available.

If others do not feel that way, fine.

I never said that I am right and others are wrong on this topic. (Though I am. :) )

Again, the poster asked if more expensive knives are worth the extra cost over less expensive knives.

He asked, I gave my opinion.

That's that.
 
How about that guy who had to amutate his arm half way to the elbow with his very dull multi-tool after surviving stuck under the rock for a few days. He was interviewed afterwards and one of the first things he said he wished he had done was carry a more stout, sharp knife. Didn't think he needed it as well until he did one day.

Near my home town, a guy got his leg crushed under a tree. He amputated it with a cheap chinese folder he bought at a flea market, then he drove a bulldozer to his truck, then he drove the (standard shift) truck to a farmer's house and politely asked for help. Both the incident you quote and the one I just described have everything to do with tough people and little or nothing to do with tough knives.

As I've said before, its your money and if it make you feel better to buy one product over another, please spend as you like. This is a capitalist society, after all.
 
What a great thread

Lot's of good advice. I think I have learned some of the more expensive knives are worth it if you have the need. Many opinions on the subject, almost as if I asked if the 9mm or 45 ACP is a better round! ;)
Carry on and thanks,
BT
 
Spark stated:

"There is no magic in the common steels & materials. If you feel it's worth an extra $250 for maybe 2% of performance difference and an extra few ounces in blade steel, you made the right choice."

If you believe what you wrote above that a 400.00 Strider only gives you 2% better performance over a 50.00 CRKT product [ maybe ], you haven't handled a Strider to understand the performance or you perhaps don't know how weak the CRKT line of knives is in reality.

I tested an m16 CRKT on our website at http://www.folders-r-us.org/full_tests.htm

As you'll note if you care to read the review, the CRKT m-16's tip did not survive stabbing it into soft pine after three repetitions. The tip bent on the first tip strength test, then broke it's tip off a few stabs later.

The test of the Chinook 1 on the same site by my contractor [ who broke several knives I gave him within weeks ] is still up and running with nary a nick, let alone a failure of any kind in the lock or blade under some very adverse conditions he runs them through in the course of a day.

The difference? The CRKT can be had for 36.00 on the internet and runs about 50.00 retail. The Chinook runs about 165.00 and can be had for 110.00 or thereabouts from the internet vendors [ I get them cheaper than that as a retailer ].

The CRKT lasted a few minutes under hard use. The Chinook is still running after more abuse than the CRKT could ever take. Which would you consider the better knife in overall performance? Which knife of the two would you want with you in an emergency where all you had would need to be used in a field expediant manner as a survival tool?

2% difference between them? Hardly, more like 2000% difference or more from actual testing of products in different price points in the market. This isn't theory here, but actual results from testing.

I can tell you that a Strider in various models or an Extrema Ratio folder will outperform the Chinook in either flavor [ the original or the Chinook 11 ].

So we see that the performance difference is not your [ 2% maybe ] as you stated and believe. It is well beyond 1000% difference at the very least. You may want to reconsider your opinions about the difference between 50.00 and 150.00-400.00 folders based on real testing and not hypothetical rhetoric which has no basis in fact in the real world.

There's a big difference in the quality of the steels used, their heat treat, workmanship, and overall performance as well, unlike your statement that there's no magic in common steels which seems to be invalid as well from actual testing.

I use an SAK hiker to cut string and boxes, it's carried everyday. I carry a high dollar [ if thats what 150.00 is to you ] defensive folder to be there in the event I need it to save the bacon or get me out of a tight spot where others would fail at the same task.

I may need an expediant field tool for extrication of myself or another. I like knowing the knives I carry are capable of performing what I may need them to do in an emergency under adverse conditions. You can't count on the CRKT knives to be able to handle those types of events without failure in quick order. In fact, if all I had was an m-16 CRKT [ or any of their models ] I would not attempt to use it as it would fail. Knowing that, why would I try to use it in the first place.

My defensive folder will stab through a car door with nary a sweat broken. That I know it can survive the rough use it may need to be used for one day gives me the confidence I require of my chosen equipment.

The man who amputated his arm to escape death from under the rock wished he had had a better knife than the cheapo multi-tool he had with him which made for one hellacious probelm cutting through bone. My chosen EDC's would not even be phased at the event. Big difference wouldn't you say?

He was supposed to be a pro and know the ropes. Here he is carryng a cheapo multi-tool and didn't understand that in an emergency he would need better equipment.

Penny wise and pound foolish. Now lets ask you a question in a hypothetical here.

You need to extricate yourself or a loved one from a burning vehicle. I can hand you the 400.00 "tank" or the 50.00 CRKT to perform the extrication to bring yourself or your loved ones out of the car. Am I now to understand from your previous posts you would take the 50.00 knife? I doubt it very much, and you'll more than likely pick the better, more robust tool right?

So if you would pick the better tool for obvious reasons, why do you have a hard time picking the same tool before an event happens where you need it.

Forethought----It goes a long way in this world we live in. Some people are destined to make mistakes/wrong choices even though they have the advantage of others mistakes before them.

I'll not be one of them when ever I have the choices to make. YMMV, of course.

So, the answer to the posters question is a BIG yes, there is a very big difference in performance and materials used. Thats from real world testing and not posturing a reply based on assumptions and personal opinions.

Golgo: Because he used a cheap china knockoff does not negate the fact a better knife would have made the job easier and stayed sharper longer while doing the cutting, especially through bone. One knife might make a clean cut and the cheapo china knife would not have been ideal for going through bone. In times like that, the faster you get through the hard work, the better.

The guy I mentioned trapped has cited he wished he had a better knife for the task that was at hand that day. Lessons learned from real world experience. I suppose we should listen tothose who have gone before us and made mistakes but still found a way to survive it all.

Brownie
 
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Brownie,

I guess my point boils down to what advice I would give a younger guy on his purchase. And trust me, my errors figure in to that equation.

And you point out one of them; how can a 50 year old man get caught up in hype like a kid? Very easily, I'm afraid. The 'amputation' stories mentioned made national news because they happen so rarely. However, the knife guys use these events to justify their over-the-top purchases.

Here's another angle that must be mentioned. My disposable income as a middle-aged white-collar worker is dramatically greater than a younger man just starting out. I happened across a Buck 110 (the best knife in that era) and the $9.00 I paid for it at Berg-Pearson's in 1968 wiped out my whole wallet.

Fast forward to 2003. I yell into the kitchen, "Hey, honey, I want to buy a Strider. Is there room on the card?" She yells back, "Go for it, I just paid the monthly statement."

Of course we all like nice things. There's a $27K 95-inch Soft-Tail down at Capital that would look great in my garage. Not a chance. The elder in my church, or his son, might contemplate it as successful men who own their own company.

And, BTW, speaking of real-deal experiences and church members, the son of one our deacons just left for military duty a few weeks ago. He didn't have a knife, and probably couldn't afford a good one anyway. Additionally, he knew nothing about knives. I gave him a black/black CRKT M-1 and wished him well.

My guess is that this knife will be unrecognizable upon return. My focus here is getting him back in one piece, and that entails good equipment that he can take care of with other things on his mind. It was the right choice.

Maybe that's the answer. Forget the hype, focus on the real work.
 
As I said at the beginning of the thread, there are diminishing returns. I don't fault anyone for buying a more expensive knife because they value fine fitting, higher quality materials, and better steel. I rarely fault anyone for buying an inexpensive blade, unless it performs poorly and/or is dangerous.

Only the individual user can make the determination as to whether the extra cost is "worth" it, and for that person, his decision is as valid as another's.

I would tend to pay attention to expert opinions before making my own choices, though.

Spark, one of these days- when I'm back in the real world, and not a starving student- I reckon I'll have to pick up a Chinook from you.

I reckon this thread is done. Y'all start another if you feel the need.

John
 
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