1860 Army with big balls

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mec

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Local distributor has been reluctant to re-order .454 balls so, I tried .457 in this Uberti with chambers measuring .451". While it shaved a pretty big ring of lead, seating was not difficult and didn't seem to put much strain on the lever.

The charge was a 22 grain fffg spout with pyrodex p substituted. The shot at 6 o'clock was a substantial hangfire.
1860amry60ft22grvol457.jpg
 
I have always used .457 RB in my cap pistols. The larger ring of lead means that there is a larger " land " or bearing surface for the rifleing to grip.

Oneshooter
Livin in Texas
 
I standardized on .457 balls years ago when I started shooting a Ruger Old Army. Ruger's suggested ball diameter is .457 and I found that any .45 replica I tried, whether Colt or Remington from any of the major replica manufacturers worked just fine with that size ball. It helps alot that shooting cap n' balls requires pure, soft lead. i use .380 balls for 36 caliber. Big balls are better.
 
I used .457 Speer balls in my 1860 Army. It was a Uberti. Hits mighty hard, too. Good shootin!
 
My only worry was would it put too much strain on the seating lever. Doesn't seem to do that at all. The seated balls show some lead kick-up on the sides from swaging into the chambers. All to the good I expect. I was aware the .457s were recommended for rugers and can remember when they said the Walkers used .457 balls- the current ones are fine with .454.

I had arrived at the shooting place with a new flask which claimed to have a 30 grain spout. I was a bit upset that my velocities were a couple hundred fps slower than i was used to with that charge volume. Got home and check it with some fffg and found that it was a 22 grain spout instead. This was instructive as the velocity isn't at all bad and the bullets were hitting to the sights (lower than they had been with a real 30 grain spout.)
 
most of my shooting with this has been with 30 grains fffg or the same measure full of pyrodex. With that load, the army shoots a few inches high at 60 feet and 25 yards- but not as high as most navys. These today that I accidentally loaded with the 22 grain spout full of pyrodex were hitting right on for elevation. An earlier target had me hitting a bit to the left but when I moved the sight over to the right side of the target, dang they all started hitting right on. That's why the group is right of center.

This charge of pyrodex is just a little slower than 30 grains of fffg and I'm going to be using it some more. The paper figures put it about the same energy level as a .38 wadcutter. Also, the extreme spread on these five shot readings was about half that of the higher charge. Don't know if it was a fluke or not but I cant complain about the usable accuracy.
 
Maybe I'll start at 25 grains of pyro P and see where that goes.Have you ever tried deepening the notch on a Navy to bring down point of impact?My wife wants to shoot the 44 Navy but she gets picky about her sight picture...
 
I do deepen the notch on high shooters. It seldom brings them down far enough for point of aim hits though. The new uberti Navys have a taller front bead. they still shoot high but not as much as before.
 
Might. The important factor would be the size of the chamber mouths. One asm we have had started out with chambers of all different sizes but some of them were under .450. It would require quite a bit of force to seat the .457s in something like that and might cause damage to the weight bearing screw of the seating lever.

My lemat has .448-449 chamber mouths and a fairly inefficient loading lever. Seating .454 bullets is difficult and the balls almost seem to buldge outward as force is applied ( optical illusion, I'm sure.)
 
I wonder if my enthusiasm for this Uberti Army and other new Ubertis are creating the false impression that they are trouble-free? They aren't.- Just so much better than replicas have been since the mid 20th century that I might tend to gloss over any problems. For instance:
1. The loading lever detent of this one had a way of coming loose and falling out of the dovetail. I tapped the dovetail tighter and have been shooting it quite a while without that happening any more;
2. The little pegs in the front of the frame- that deal with barrel retension and alignment are just tapped into the holes and sometimes fall out. If I don't do something about this, I will probably end up having to order spares;
3. Leaf springs are still going to break. None of mine have broken since Uberti improved their stuff and made parts more available. This doesn't mean they won't break someday.
 
I checked out the Dragoon with .457s too. I was trying to use the replica flask that throws 36grains fffg at its maximum setting. Accuracy was not worth do-do. The ball would not quite compress the charge with the loading lever brought down all the way. Velocities range from 820s to 945 with Pyrodex P.

The 40 grain equivalent is probably in the mid 900s as 45 of pyrodex p does in the mid 1000s. I got some seating compression with this and the group shrank down to resemble the first 60 foot string I ever fired with it- using .454 balls
dragoon60oh1.jpg


Again, the .457s seated easily, not straining the loading lever and shaving a healthy ring.
 
I use .454 or .457 balls in my Uberti-made replica of the Remington and my Pietta-made replica of the 1860 Colt.
Some years ago I bought a few boxes of .457 balls for my .45-70 Marlin but didn't use as many as I planned, so I started using them for my cap and balls. Works fine. No strain on the rammer and accuracy is good.
I find no difference in accuracy between the .454 and .457 inch balls. However, when I drop down to .451 inch my groups begin to open and I get more flyers. I'll stick with the larger balls.
Incidentally, a .45-70 case will hold THREE .457 balls, with a dry-lubed Wonder Wad above and below the middle ball.
I made some up years ago to prank a friend, who had no experience shooting. With every shot, at 25 yards on a BIG bullseye (hits encourage confidence with new shooters), he saw THREE holes. The puzzled look on his face was priceless!
I also loaded the same three-ball cartridges in my 1895 Marlin, as a house gun. Figured the three .45-caliber balls would settle any account with a two or four-legged beast, yet not endanger the neighbors with too much penetration.
Never had an opportunity to shoot anything with it. Accuracy's fine out to about 50 yards --- all balls in a 9" paper plate. At 25 yards, balls cluster into 3 or 4 inches, sometimes less.
Heck of a day-ruiner! :evil:
 
Big Balls in a .44 Cap n Ball

You want to make sure you're using pure lead balls if they are as big as .457. Once upon a midnight dreary I broke the loading lever on a 58 remington copy using .454 balls that I had evidently cast with something less than pure. A learning moment for sure.
 
"With every shot, at 25 yards on a BIG bullseye (hits encourage confidence with new shooters), he saw THREE holes. The puzzled look on his face was priceless!"

:D Nice trick.

Jim
 
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