1873 Colt SAA clone...C-O-L-T 4 stage cocking mechanism...what's happening?

[kmrcstintn]

I recently got an Uberti Cattleman clone of 1873 Colt SAA in .45LC; during sessions to get familiar with the operation of the revolver, I slowly cocked the handgun from hammer all the way forward and heard the distinctive 4 clicks (or C-O-L-T) and saw the trigger go forward and back and forward again...

now I gotta know what exactly is happening during each point in the cocking procedure; I also have a 'concern'--if I stop cocking on the third click (or L) in the lineup, the hammer sometimes drops to the half-cock position...is this normal or do I have a safety problem? (gun was purchased NIB and I only put 200 rounds thru it; as far as I know the store had the gun in stock @ 6 months and was probably handled before I got it)

thanks for your time and answers

 

[Jim March]

I don't have all the answers, BUT, I can tell you this: sometime in the last 5ish or a bit more years, Uberti tweaked their hammers such that there's a hammer-block safety system going on, in the hammer.

I don't know much about how it works. If I owned that gun I would definitely download the manual (check Uberti and Cimmaron websites), study how they say it works and figure out if I had that system and how it works.

It's absolutely vital to know how your gun's safety works, period.

I've heard from a number of sources that this Uberti system is nice in that it doesn't screw up the trigger feel the way transfer bars do (a little bit anyhow) but it's not as safe as a transfer bar and allegedly the Uberti system you may have isn't reliable enough for safe six-up carry.

That's what I've heard - never owned an Uberti nor examined that system closely, and I can't even tell you how to figure out if you've got it. But you do need to sort that out.

If you have that system, it may be interacting with the trigger position, so...while you may have as many clicks as a Colt, you may not have a total Colt clone action. Therefore, until you sort out what you have, you can't rely purely on "Colt wisdom".

----

Some background:

The reason the Uberti has a safety at all is the Gun Control Act of 1986. That ill-advised law allowed Federal bureaucrats to determine whether or not a handgun is of "sporting purpose" or not . To do so, "sporting points" are awarded for having adjustable sights over fixed, thumbrest "target" grips, a minimum barrel length, frame metal type I think, and a "safety". To get enough "points", Uberti has always added some sort of "safety" since '68.

The early type involved a base pin that could be re-set back further into the gun, tying it up. Stupidest damnthing anybody ever came up with, but, it met the definition of "safety". The new "hammer thingie" safety was a somewhat saner replacement for that old mess.

Some importers have removed some of the more garbage "GCA68 safeties" stateside from SAA clones. Another reason you need to figure out just what you've got.

Comedy note: there are rumors that in order to be imported to the US, Glocks need an "adjustable sight". *Plastic* adjustable rear sights (!) are fitted in Austria and then proper sights are retrofitted stateside...so somewhere at Glock's US HQ there's a huge pile of junk sights. And on the same note, it's claimed that some small Taurus wheelguns are shipped from Brazil with longer barrels, which are then either chopped or swapped stateside - again, to dodge GCA68.

 

[mavracer]

the first click is the safety notch
the second is half cock or loading position.
the third click you hear is the bolt engaging in the cylinder
the fourth click is full cock.

BTW when you hear the third click and let it down to half cock the bolt will stay engaged and you will not be able to turn the cylinder.

 

[HammerBite]

• First click: Trigger falls into quarter-cock notch.
• Second click: Trigger falls into half-cock notch.
• Third click: Cylinder bolt is released and strikes cylinder.
• Fourth click: Trigger falls into full-cock notch.

There are really five clicks. There is a click as the cylinder bolt falls into a cylinder notch. This click generally happens just a tiny bit before full-cock or coincident with it and can be easily missed.

As you draw the hammer back from the fully forward position the trigger will very quickly spring forward when it falls into the quarter-cock notch. As you continue the hammer stroke the trigger will move back as it rides the hammer profile out of the quarter-cock notch, then will spring forward when it falls into the half-cock notch. The trigger will move back again as it rides the hammer profile out of the half-cock notch, then will spring forward again as it falls into the full-cock notch. The third "springing forward" isn't nearly as pronounced as the first two because the full-cock notch is much shallower than the other two.

 

[Hawk]

My Uberti's hammer would actually (weakly) engage at the "third click" (bolt popping up) - the hammer sits almost but not quite at full cock, the trigger is disengaged and a look of consternation crosses my face.

At least once the hammer let go from that position when I thought it was fully cocked and dropped a spectacularly off-center strike in the primer. Off center enough it didn't go off, I'm delighted to report. The bolt had "clicked" but the cylinder was a smidgin off from engaging the bolt in the recessed whatchamacallit. Good thing SAA clones are pointed downrange when at full cock - no one but my laundry lady would have known it was an unintentional discharge, so to speak.

The moral, I suppose, is make sure the hammer is at full cock rather than 98% of full cock.

Probably just a random burr - It grows increasingly difficult to engage the hammer at that position when trying to do so and one has to hold one's tongue just right. It'll probably be gone in another 100 rounds. It no longer performs the stunt accidentally.

There's some mysterious goings on on the rear of the hammer no doubt associated with whatever safety has been randomly pasted on. The manual doesn't describe what I've got or mine doesn't work. Doesn't matter - the LOAD 5 ONLY part of the manual is plenty clear. I infer from the manual that one either gets the mystery hammer safety or the seemingly defective base pin safety but not both. The description of the hammer safety actually reminds me of FA's description of the 83's block. (Don't beat me up FA folks, just my reading of the thing). I'm reasonably convinced my firearm was packed with someone else's manual.

Being the impressionable sort, I bought a new vaq after reading Mr. March's reviews. Lots less clicks - just bolt drop and full cock, I believe, but it grows on you.

 

[Jim March]

One thing about the Ruger NewVaq's "click pattern" is that it sounds more "modern" and is more likely to be understood as a gun cocking to a goblin than the SAA's "gyrations" .

 

[HammerBite]

Jim March . . .

On the other hand, when the gangbanger hears an SAA cocked he may think three or four guys just got the drop on him!

 

[Hawk]

Ah, Mr. March.
FWIW, the manual on the Uberti spoke of something that projected when at the "first notch". I couldn't see into that dark recess so shined a flashlight into the area to be certain nothing was happening.

Said flashlight being the selfsame 10X that illuminated the range when somebody's tactical holster melter blew the breaker.

...memories are made of this.