.223 endangered species?

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686S&W

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On the cover of a shooting rag at the local auto parts store I had seen a preview for an article about the .223 Remington. Something about the cartridge being on the endangered species list.

Kinda curious. With the popularity of the black rifle, the mini 14, and the selection of .223 varmint bolt guns on the market; is this plausible? Should I scrounge the money to go pick up that issue?

What comes first? The drying up of supplies of a given cartridge prompting the gun makers to stop offering chamberings in that particular caliber? Or does the manufacture of that specific caliber influence what the gun makers will chamber a particular firearm in?
 
are you talking about shooting times? There is an article in there about making your own .224" bullets out of empty .22 long rifle cases and lead wire......I won't be investing the $1000 that is needed for equipment needed to do such a thing.
 
That's about as likely as house cats and domestic dogs becoming endangered species.

AFAIK, .223 Remington is the #1 or #2 caliber of centerfire rifle ammunition sold each year, is the #1 caliber of law enforcement carbines, and is still the primary small arms caliber of the U.S. military. I'd say those factors will keep it off the endangered list...
 
It might be on the endangered list for a military cartridges but not in the civilian world. The only thing the could kill it is if a law is passed that bans civilians from using military designated calibers. Some countries do restrict their citizens from using military calibers. I believe Italy is one of them.
 
Maybe he's referring to how hard it is to find the ammo these days, unless you're shelling out over $.50 a round. :banghead:
 
Maybe he's referring to how hard it is to find the ammo these days, unless you're shelling out over $.50 a round.
Click to expand...
Where are you buying your .223 from? Most of the big online sellers have standard FMJ for way less than that. Match ammo, of course, is a different story.

Now, if we're talking .308...
 
Where are you buying your .223 from? Most of the big online sellers have standard FMJ for way less than that. Match ammo, of course, is a different story.
Click to expand...
Can you point me to anyone that has something other than 55gr commercial FMJ for that price?

I don't see any M855 or any kind of mil-spec ammo left or if they do, it's over $500 for 1000 rounds. Sure there's crappy Wolf steel-case stuff but you can't reload that.
 
Definate shortage of 223 stuff, and we are using? giving away? beau
coos of it. Military gets first run of all ammo mgf. with an estimated
after run for all other buyers. Change over for other calibers a guess
timate from previous sales. Any mess up, it has to sub contracted out.
The.223 with Fed. contract has subed out to Israel. No clue on the 308.
Based on the real world of sand, the 223 isn't making it with considerations
using the same platform and up it to 28 caliber. If that happens, the 223
will most likely go back to varmit stage. Demand will not be the same when
the military drops it, but far from extinct as many rifles out there=demand.
Reloading will take part of the bite until things stabilize. However, componet
costs are rising and shortage may also create price increases when panic
buying starts.
 
.35 sounds about right, a little better than I'm doing.

I've got some on order for about .28 but it's been on backorder since June. Ammo in hand is cheaper than ammo that never arrives.

Hey - do you guys who use soft point or hollow point .223 have trouble in 5.56 rifles? My Bushmaster didn't like the cheap Remington box o' hollowpoints & I'm concerned about soft point.
 
Your in Houston? Try Academy's monarch soft point or fmj stuff. $7 per 20.

That and the Seller and Belloit FMJ, my mini eats it up.
 
If the .223 Remington is on the endangered species list, it is because the industry has decided to standardize on the 5.56 NATO cartridge dimension.
 
You can get 1000rnds of brass case 55gr fmj Remington remanufactured ammo for $279.99 with 4 ammo boxes from Cabelas but recently it went on backorder.
 
I didn't think .223 was all that expensive at the moment. I mean, I KNOW that all ammo has gone up. Even 7.62x39 is a lot more than I paid for the last case.

But come on... at least it isn't .308. :fire:

I'm sitting on a case of SA 7.62 NATO that I dare not shoot up. Its not for shooting, it's for looking at....


-- John
 
It's not endangered in the sense that it is going extinct... only that it is harder to get a hold of then usually...

But .223 is here to stay for a long time and is in VERY high demand.
 
Only thing more agrivating than some Gun Rag Articles is folks that express opinions of them that have not read the articles.

The author stated his set up was about a $600 investment for anyone already owning an older O type press. What you don't have a rock chucker in a corner someplace? Well all you dillon one pull one cartridge guys aught to have one anyway incase you ever want to form brass for some old blaster from more redily available brass.

THe author then goes on to say that not counting your time or raw materials that it would take at least 6000 rounds produced to "pay" for the machine. He also suggested that a group of buddies might go in together as a group to purchase and use the machinery. Take four guys each ponying up $150 and suddenly 6000 rounds doesn't sound like that much. I know that some guys in the local University shooting club went in on a Dillon that was set up for 9 Sillymeter Para and a .223 conversion set and the five of them rather quickly recouped their investment in savings and let other club members crank out ammo for them selves.

The author went on to express his concerns about th elimitations of the system. Granted he could produce a wide array of bullet weights, point styles and lengths, but all would still have the relatvely thin jacket offered by the .22LR case raterh than factory jackets. The manufacturer advised for example keeping velocities below 3200 fps IIRC. The bullets are prone to blow up on game and such and so are best used for target shooting or varminting.

Also mentioned were the current prices of copper being about 300% what it was five years ago and even lead being more expensive.

The author also suggested what to look for in spent .22 LR cases that might cause flaws or accuracy problems with the finished bullet. Not something I recall from previous articles on the topic.

If the trend of Red China eating up the worlds metals continues s Corbin bullet maker may begin to look VERY attractive.

At one point Corbin also offered a 6mm/.243 bullet maker that used .22 Magnum cases. That might allow one to justify the added cost of buying .22 Magnum RF in the first place.

I noted that the model shown used commercial lead wire, at one point I seem to recall someone making gang molds that produced sticks of lead the right diameter for the system. It would add more steps to production and more time, but might lower the out of pocket cost of the lead used if one could produce fairly soft lead sticks.

Ihave noticed that in some gun rags that writters seem to be unafraid to point out difficulties or concerns these days and talk about the limitations of a system rather than just sounding like add copy for the advertisor products.

I read them because they do provide some information even when they are ad copy type articles.

Bit over two decades back I did work for what was then the worst gunrags on the market. Yes soe advertisers would threaten to not send you any more of their stuff if you said anything bad. Some however, were interested in your feed back on their products evenwhen the feed back was not complmentary.

I believe there is likely less of the pressuring to say good things about products today than then.

I wish someone would offer a swage set that produced something like the 150 grain .30 Shutzenplinker form Alberts or the old US army Gallery round's bullet. Coat them with one of the tumble dry lubes and run em on pustol powedr or high volume poweders in what ever .30 you like maybe make a .311 version as well. That aught to make the mosin nagant crowd happy.

-Bob Hollingsworth
 
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