.223 reloading on Dillon 550B

Palladan44 said:
I have a little crow gun works .223 trimmer on the way. No telling if someday I'll bump up my volume, so might as well have a good tool for the start.
So does this thing de-bur, clean the edges after trimming so they're ready to load?
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if it doesn't chamfer and deburr, you should return it without even opening it and just go ahead and spend the extra $37 on the Giraud triway trimmer which trims, chamfers and deburrs the case at the same time. I have one in .223 and one for .308. You can trim, deburr and chamfer somewhere around 500 cases in an hour with it. Trying to chamfer and deburr 500 cases by hand after you just got done trimming them sounds painfully stupid. If I'm loading for a bolt action rifle, I'll use my Forster original lathe style trimmer which also performs all three actions simultaneously but when it comes to semi-autos, the Giraud triway trimmer is worth every penny. Just make sure you get your cases resized consistently before you trim them or your trim lengths will vary (among other problems of course) and it's best to tumble the lube off of them before you jam them up into the trimmer. I assume this is "the case" with the little crow WFT as well.
 
redcon1 said:
if it doesn't chamfer and deburr, you should return it without even opening it and just go ahead and spend the extra $37 on the Giraud triway trimmer which trims, chamfers and deburrs the case at the same time. I have one in .223 and one for .308. You can trim, deburr and chamfer somewhere around 500 cases in an hour with it. Trying to chamfer and deburr 500 cases by hand after you just got done trimming them sounds painfully stupid. If I'm loading for a bolt action rifle, I'll use my Forster original lathe style trimmer which also performs all three actions simultaneously but when it comes to semi-autos, the Giraud triway trimmer is worth every penny. Just make sure you get your cases resized consistently before you trim them or your trim lengths will vary (among other problems of course) and it's best to tumble the lube off of them before you jam them up into the trimmer. I assume this is "the case" with the little crow WFT as well.
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I can't seem to find info indicating whether it does or not, but yes if it doesn't I'm not interested in extra work.
 
Palladan44 said:
I can't seem to find info indicating whether it does or not, but yes if it doesn't I'm not interested in extra work.
Click to expand...
I assume Nature Boy knows what he's talking about and he just said it doesn't in post #26, so. I actually ordered one of those WFTs off of Amazon and it came to me marked as having been Made in China which didn't seem right so I returned it immediately. I just wanted something fast and went with amazon but I returned it without ever using it and just bought another Giraud which took a little longer to come to me. They're kind of a pain to get set up initially and their consistency is totally dependent on your full length resizing consistency. If you start getting inconsistent trim lengths, there's a real good chance your resizing is inconsistent for some reason which can be pretty common when resizing once fired military cases of the 7.62 variety. It was less of an issue with 5.56 for me.

I have zero experience with any progressive reloading machine and load all my ammo on a Forster coax which I just purchased like a year ago so I'm hesitant to invest in a new progressive press right now. I can see how it would be advantageous but for reloading the once fired military rifle brass and especially the once fired Lake City 7.62 that I have a ton of, I'm not convinced that it would be that much faster since most of your time and energy is spent on case preparation and the steps involved don't seem like they would work well on a progressive reloader.

For example, you have to resize the case and then trim it but before you can trim it in the Giraud triway trimmer, you really need to tumble the lube off so there's another step. At some point, you need to remove the primer crimps too so there's another step and as long as you're removing primer crimps at your case prep center, you might as well uniform flash holes and primer pockets and so that's more steps. I always brush out the necks and the cases to make sure there's no media in them too and so there's another step. I do all my powder charging with a RCBS chargemaster and then seat the bullets with the Forster. It isn't fast but, compared to all the aforementioned case prep steps, it's not that bad. So speeding up case preparation is where you make your money IMO.

I have found that the Coax press works pretty well because you can quickly swap out dies which comes in very handy at times. 5.56 might be easier to load on the progressive press than 7.62 but I noticed in post #13 that it was mentioned that a lot of these operations were occurring while the case was still covered in lube and that seems like something I wouldn't like either so I think for now, I'll just be happy with my Coax and the system I developed around it.
 
Awwwww man.
Me being an ebay guy, I went for the cheapest one I could find. It's still new....
But. ** RETURNS NOT ACCEPTED***
DAMN.
I'm going to have to chamfer and debur now, any tools/ bits recommended for those steps?

Between having to resize, deprime, then clean/ream primer pockets, then trim, then chamfer then, debur........ I'm not especially excited about this endeavor.
 
Chuck R. said:
Here's how I load .223 on my 550, I do about 2-3K a year for match ammo in basically in 2 stages and I use 2 separate tool heads. This is mostly range pick-up brass from matches
that I process this time of year, post hunting season, chitty weather and dark early:

Stage 1:

1. De-prime on an old RCBS RockChucker
2. Wet tumble using SS pins
3. Dry in a "re-purposed" dehydrator
4. Check primer pockets; cull loose pockets, set aside crimped and swage them later
5. Anneal on my BC1000
6. Lube with Hornady 1 shot on a cookie tray, let sit for about 15 minutes
7. Size on the 550 using a tool head with just a FL sizing die on it
8. Run brass through a vibratory cleaner to take the lube off
9. Run through a Giraud tri-way trimmer on a drill press (just running them all through is faster than measuring)

Stage 2 usually 500 rd lots
1. Prime and load on the 550 with just a seating die
2. When boxing I set aside the PMC brass loads for the "long" stage. The rest go as mixed brass for the normal stages.

The precision/hunting loads go through the same basic steps, but are kept in 100 rd "lots", done on a single stage press, it a FL Bushing dies set for that rifle's chamber.
Click to expand...

This is basically the process I follow for loading rifle cartridges on a progressive.

I still load most of my rifle cartridges on a single stage, I do load 204 Ruger on my RCBS Pro2000. 204 Ruger is not far from 223 Remington and I could use my Dillon BL550 instead of the Pro2000.

204 Ruger is my main prairie dog round and when I go on a PD shoot, I shoot lots of ammunition.

Like Chuck R, I size, deprime and clean at one time. I use a WFT trimmer because I cannot justify the cost of. a Giraud trimmer. (Girauds are nice gear though.) I do “measure” my cases and only trim cases that are too long. I’ve made go-no-go gauges for case length that make measuring quick. Then, I only trim a few cases, about 25% at a session. Calipers can be set to the trim length and locked in place. They become a go-no-go gauge then.

index.php


Here is one of my “go-no-go” gauges.

After cleaning, I store the cases for a future loading session.

When loading, I prime off the press. I find the progressive presses priming systems less than reliable and I’m not willing to waste the time to tweak them into being reliable. Once primed, I charge the case on the press and seat the bullet.

I like the RCBS Gold Cup seater dies if available for the cartridge that is being loaded. It has a window in the side of the die for inserting the bullet and then the die holds the bullet in position for seating.

Finally, I do not crimp my ammunition destined for AR rifles.
 
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Palladan44 said:
I'm going to have to chamfer and debur now, any tools/ bits recommended for those steps?
Click to expand...
pretty sure my RCBS case prep center came with some chamfer/deburr attachments but I've never used them. On the rare occasions that I have to perform these steps, I just use the old fashioned hand held tool that has been around forever. I use the case prep center for everything else (crimp removal, flash hole uniforming, primer pocket uniforming and brushing the cases out). Anything that speeds up case prep is something you're really going to want for loading a bunch of military cases IMO and that RCBS case prep center has served me well for thousands and thousands of cases. I'm sure there are plenty of other good brands that would work just as well or maybe even better but that's what I bought.
 
Palladan44 said:
I've got a 3-Die Lee set on the way from ebay. I've got a caliber conversion kit on the way from Dillon..... I'm just debating on where to go as far as a trimming setup.
Then powder and bullets after that.
Click to expand...

The Franklin Arsenal case trim center is very reasonable, and deburs and chafers.

Mine aren’t knats ass accurate, I get .001-.003 variance.
But that may be technique. I don’t think it my trimmer technique, more likely my sizing technique. Maybe brass springs back at different rates despite being the same head stamp brass???
 
Palladan44 said:
I'm just thinking on getting 1000 pcs of 55gr FMJ-BT (M193 projectiles) and whatever powder I find first that "Meets Requirements"
so to speak.....
WW-748
Varget
Or something similar.
I'm just looking to make some general purpose training loads, and if I'm able to make these more accurate than commercial "general purpose" ammunition, then I'll get into refining my techniques.... (I have a hunch that this will happen)

If it does happen, I'm highly interested in getting a load worked up for my Colt- CAR A3 HBAR that can shoot better than 2- 1/4" at 200 yds (the current record w/ factory ammo)....but I'm not going to strive for that out of the gate..... (FYI it has a 20" 1:9 twist HBAR stainless barrel)

At first Im looking to make some general purpose loads for AR platforms (mostly M4s w/ 16" 1/7 twist barrels) that I can do rifle drills with. The farthest I do that is to 100 yds, where I'm looking to hit the FBI "bottle" target somewhere about in the middle of it.....
Match quality probably not needed.
Most of this shooting im looking to hit it at 10-50 yds.
I'll see where this goes! Will be fun.
I appreciate all the tips and suggestions so far! Thank you.
Click to expand...

Look at TAC!

It’s readily available, meters extremely well.

I haven’t used it on 55s yet. But on 62s and 69s, it does extremely well.
 
Update-
Here's what I've got so far:

1)About 1000pcs of mixed brass. By mixed, wholly smokes, do I mean MIXED.
I'm hard pressed to find 2 headstamps that are the same. They're all made of brass, and that's about it...... These are just what I happen to pick up over the years. I've left more brass from my MSRs over the years about ten fold than what I've collected, just cause I've never loaded for it.

2) Lee 3 die set for .223 with FCD
(Are these carbide? Will they last?)
They were very very cheap brand new. 38$ total.

3) caliber conversion Kit for 550 Dillon
About 75$

4) little crow gun works trimmer
(It arrived, and I'm pleased with its quality of construction, despite not chamfering/deburring) About-75$

5) 1 chamfer and 1 deburring drill bit
15$

6) 1000 pcs. of 55 gr. M193 projectiles w/ cannelure. 70$

7) Regrettably went to Cabelas yesterday and got 1000 primers (Remington #7-1/2 benchrest small rifle primers) and 3 lbs of powder. .... 2 lbs of H-335. And 1 lb of CFE 223. The primers were 95$ and each pound of Powder was 40$ :) hehehe.
I'll have you all know that this was my first primer and powder purchase in a long while, and the most I've paid for supplies by nearly double in my lifetime..... I don't support paying this kind of prices for the stuff, it's pretty ridiculous. I highly recommend going on strike to get stock built up and they start lowering prices....... The worker at the store claimed that their profit margins on the stuff are the same as they always have been, and it's the manufacturers/suppliers that are gouging at this time....and I believe it 100%

I'm 488$ into investment in this caliber for this first 1000 rounds. I've calculated that the 3lbs of powder will get me about 1000 rds. Each subsequent 1000 rounds should be at least half of that figure, and hopefully lower than that when they price supplies like they should.....
 
I started loading .223 last year in order to learn how to do it. I have found that a 1# bottle of powder gets me about 250 rounds.

Loading .223 may or may not be cheaper than buying cheap factory ammo right now, but it will give you ammo when you can't buy any, and that alone is worth it.

chris
 
ballman6711 said:
Loading .223 may or may not be cheaper than buying cheap factory ammo right now, but it will give you ammo when you can't buy any, and that alone is worth it.
chris
Click to expand...

I have been loading .223 for over 23 years. Back when I started, I could buy Winchester USA 55gr FMJ for $2.99 a box of 20 at a Spokane discount store. (They also sold powder and primers for $10 per pound or brick). Kind of sad that factory ammo could be purchased for what primers alone cost these days. But the reason I started loading .223 was because my handloads were not a lot cheaper than factory ammo, but were (and still are) much more accurate and effective than factory ammo. And if you compare similar ammo to handloads (Federal Gold Medal Match vs Handloads with RMR 69 gr BTHP, i.e.), handloads run about .35 per round, while factory premium stuff is $1.50 per round. I am always looking for bargains, and picked up 4000 Wolf 55 gr FMJ bullets for less than 6 cents a bullet back in 2020. So if I want to load cheap FMJ ammo, I can, but at the current price of primers, I will save those bullets until I can get some primers cheap enough to justify it.
 
Palladan44 said:
1)About 1000pcs of mixed brass. By mixed, wholly smokes, do I mean MIXED.
I'm hard pressed to find 2 headstamps that are the same. They're all made of brass, and that's about it...... These are just what I happen to pick up over the years. I've left more brass from my MSRs over the years about ten fold than what I've collected, just cause I've never loaded for it.

2) Lee 3 die set for .223 with FCD
(Are these carbide? Will they last?)
They were very very cheap brand new. 38$ total.

3) caliber conversion Kit for 550 Dillon
About 75$

4) little crow gun works trimmer
(It arrived, and I'm pleased with its quality of construction, despite not chamfering/deburring) About-75$

5) 1 chamfer and 1 deburring drill bit
15$

6) 1000 pcs. of 55 gr. M193 projectiles w/ cannelure. 70$
Click to expand...

Unless the trimmer doesn’t make a good clean cut, I’d not worry about the steps in #5.

The Dillon trimmer doesn’t chamfer or deburr although it does cut at a slight angle away from the mouth. It’s still just fine for loading mixed brass 55 gn FMJ stuff. The BT don’t tend to catch on a sharp rim like a flat base bullet can.

It wont hurt though and it’s your time to spend.
 
jmorris said:
Unless the trimmer doesn’t make a good clean cut, I’d not worry about the steps in #5.

The Dillon trimmer doesn’t chamfer or deburr although it does cut at a slight angle away from the mouth. It’s still just fine for loading mixed brass 55 gn FMJ stuff. The BT don’t tend to catch on a sharp rim like a flat base bullet can.

It wont hurt though and it’s your time to spend.
Click to expand...
I'll definitely keep this in mind. The way I see it is at least give idealism a try before going my own way (and I always do go my own way about things eventually) I did trim one or 2 cases already to 1.750" and most of them there was a few thousandths taken off each mouth, and barely looked like they needed chamfering or deburring. I forsee Boat-tailed bullets seating easier than anything I've loaded before, and the crimp stage possibly rolling any microns of "bur" that might be present...
 
Got a .223 case stuck in the die.
Every effort to remove it has failed.
I mean it's REALLY stuck and doesn't move.

Watched several YouTube videos to aid in removal.....well, I can't get it unstuck.
Used plenty of lube, too
 
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The Lee die, you back off the collet and drive the decapping pin/expander back out with the case.

 
It’s better than nothing for pistol but I use Dillon spray for rifle (with progressives) you have to let both “flash” for best results.

Hornady’s unique is even better but you have to manually apply it, like Imperial and other great lubes.
 
I doubt your Lee die set is carbide - not at 38$, most rifle dies aren’t. You can get them, but they’re pricey and you still have to lube the cases.
It’d be interesting to know exactly how you used One Shot case lube - it can work on rifle cases, but it seems there’s an equal number of posters that get cases stuck vs not. I’ve successfully used it on .223 reloading, without any issues. I shake the can really well for a minute, spray the outsides well, walk away for 10 minutes and then load. I realize “spray well” is subjective, the cases aren’t dripping lube, just a light coat. I’m not trying to sell it, it just works for me and I don’t do any post tumble to remove that lube.
 
I sprayed them pretty well, or so I thought.
It's stuck stuck. It won't budge.
I've marred up the case head with a plyers now. The rim bypassed the shell plate trying to get it out. It is the correct shell plate as well. Annoying
 
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