3" bbl Heritage .22WMR?

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ZVP

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I am thinking about buying one for a self defense gun.
My reasoning: On a fixed retirement buget, now all I have to carry is a Berreta Model 21 .22LR, and a Cobra.38 Derrringer. One limited power, the other only 2 shots.
The Heritage is on sale for $200, fires 6 .22WMR , transfer bar, small size birdshead grip and 3" bbl. US made and appears well made. For the money seems to be a good deal!
Being on a budget I considered a used .38 revolver but they usually run $125-50 more than I have. There are some .32 and .38S&W revolvers out there but the cartriges have less power than the .22WMR. Yes I understand the S/A Heritage is slow to reload (hope I don't even to shoot once!) The Heritage is large enough to aim and shoot accurate enough at combat distances ( est:21 ft).
What do you guys think? Would the Heritage make a decent little revolver for the need and limits that I have? I would love to have a S&W Chief's special but dream on...
Thanks,
ZVP
 
I would perhaps look at one of the recent Taurus imported police guns. The model 82 in 38Spl can be had for $200 or a bit less. Mechanicaly they are very servicable and who cares if the exterior is scratched and worn.

That said, I would not turn my nose up at a 22 Mag for SD if that is what fits your wants.
 
Good point I'll look around for one of thoseTarus revolvers.
I only have about 7 days to buy the Heritage at that price so I guess I'll have to start fishing for the used Tarus's
Thanks.
ZVP
 
I would hate to know that my life depended on the cheapest single action revolver ever made, chambered in a less than ideal rimfire cartridge. That's about as gently as I can put it.
 
I don't want to rain on your parade, ZVP, but firstly, a SA revolver is not a great home defender - and it is even worse as a CCW. Simply the act of cocking the hammer is considered a bellicose act by most. Then there is the problem of walking around your home at night with the hammer cocked - and later, hopefully, decocking it. A DA revolver is more intuitive in an adrenaline-charged scenario. My talks with a BPD range instructor Friday verified what I had always heard. Defending one's self with a firearm generally occurs between 3 and 7 feet - not yards! In fact, at 7 yd, or 21 ft, you are getting into 'bushwhacking' territory.

About your cartridge choice. While a Hornady 'Critical Defense' round in .22 WMR and 45gr JHP will make 1,700 fps - and yield 289 ft-lb at the muzzle - it's only from the muzzle of a 24" barrel. Optimized for a short barrel, it still only eeks out 1,000 fps - and 100 ft-bl of KE - from a ~2" barrel. Even a wimpy 148gr full wadcutter 'target load' will handily best 660 fps from a ~2" .38 snub nose - yielding 150 ft-lb and making a larger hole to begin with than the expanded .22 WMR would ever make. Even the 3.5" barrel of the Heritage RR22RB3BH, the BHG revolver you speak of, is unlikely to best the .38 target load's KE. I noticed it does come new with both the .22 LR & .22 WMR cylinder - but only currently lists for $239.95, meaning that $200 isn't a once in a lifetime deal on it.

Perhaps you could combine a trade of the derringer and your money towards a new S&W 642 - they seem to run $359-$369 locally. Stoked with even 'just' those 148gr full wad cutter, it'll be more effective, fit in your pocket, and DA only. For a bit less - $239-$299 locally - I've found security guard/LEO trade-in S&W Model 10's, the original .38 M&P, and their SS equivalents, the Model 64, both in 4", at several local gun stores - and J&G on the internet, if you have a dealer to transfer it to. The 64 and most modern 10's are '+P rated', like the 642 - they can carry some more powerful ammo, too. Be forewarned, a 4" 10 or 64 is a great house/car gun - a bit big for a CC weapon, however. Another thing they are great for is plinking! Some 125-130gr MC .38 Special bullets and a place to shoot - instant fun.

That 3.5" barrel may get those 45gr .22 WMR's up over 1,100 fps - with the resulting supersonic 'crack'. Certainly, there is a lot of flash, too. Probably enjoy cheaper plinking with the .22 LR cylinder, too. Gotta admit, it's a cute package. But - the Heritage guns are cheap for a reason - don't expect Rossi or Taurus quality, much less S&W. I had a friend, passed on now, who in similar circumstances bought a Heritage .22 - it had a plastic hammer. He wanted a .22 SA plinker - sold it - cashed in a bond - and bought a new Ruger Single Six and a new S&W 5" 63. Sadly, his health went rapidly south - and he only shot the S&W once. I remember his smile - he finally had what he wanted. I miss him - but was fortunate enough to be able to buy that 63 from his estate - the Ruger was, like some of his other firearms, stolen from his home after he passed. Sad story. The moral is simple - find a way to get something 'good'. - while you can still enjoy it. Seriously, any caliber handgun can beat a sharpened stick in protecting your bacon - I just wanted to restate probably the obvious. Good luck! And, yeah, it slurps being retired on a fixed income and watching everything else go up!

Stainz

PS Last October, I lucked into a 4" S&W 651 in .22 WMR - so I know how loud and flashy a .22 WMR can be!
 
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used KT .32acps go for about that and its a better choice considering....
 
I have to disagree with Stainz on the viability of the single action revolver as a defensive weapon. There is a VERY interesting article on the subject called "Big Iron" by Terry Wieland and is in the June Handloader magazine. In the article he says what I've been saying all along, that proficiency and familiarity is far more important than the particular weapon you choose. So if the single action revolver is what you are most comfortable, familiar and proficient with, then it is a better choice than something you're not as familiar with but might be more socially acceptable. Like a Glock. Personally, I do A LOT of shooting with single actions. I actually use them almost daily. Because a good SA is good for a lot more than just defense. I have absolutely no desire to do as much shooting with something like a Glock, or any other auto for that matter, as I do my sixguns. Nor is a Glock as useful as my sixguns. They are a one trick pony. Whereas SA's are good for hunting, woods loafin', critter defense, long range shooting, plinking, pest control, targets of opportunity, basically anything you would need a handgun to do.

As much as I love 1911's I still only own three and will never do as much shooting with them as my three dozen SA's.

As much as I love older S&W's I still only own eight DA's and will never do as much shooting with them as my three dozen SA's.

So really, for someone like me or a cowboy action shooter, would anything else really be a better choice???


In fact, at 7 yd, or 21 ft, you are getting into 'bushwhacking' territory.
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Hogwash, this is just an excuse people use to not practice further than 7yds. Is there a rule that someone can't shoot at you beyond 7yds? No. In fact, the only situation I ever found myself in that I might have to pull my concealed weapon and defend myself, was against a wannabe biker on the porch of his trailer with a rifle. 30yds away. Not in the boonies but suburban Orlando, FL. Do yourself a favor and ditch the silly notion that you'll never have to defend yourself beyond contact distance. It might save your life.
 
A police trade-in S&W Model 10/64 is a wonderful choice and can be had for about $300 including fees. It can be loaded hot for SD/HD or tamed down for target practice. It can even be concealed if you're willing to accommodate.

Much more powerful than a .22wmr in the same configuration and easier (Maybe even safer) to operate under stress than a SA revolver.

-Jake
 
So, CraigC, you play Cowboy Action. No doubt you are better versed at the use of SA revolvers as opposed to DA revolvers than the average shooter. Still - for the average person - picking up a handgun, bottom feeder or round gun, and just squeezing the trigger is intuitive. I outgrew SA revolvers some time back - and enjoy DA shooting - but that's me. The average person who shoots one of my revolvers tries to do so SA - I encourage them to not do so - but to shoot DA. They are generally amazed at their marksmanship - testimony to the benefits of a decent DA trigger. It is simply second nature for the average person, even, to pick up a handgun and squeeze the trigger. LE range instructors will support me on this, as they will when they tell you the average gun 'fight' occurs at 7 ft or less. Check it out. Your encounter with someone in your trailer park some 30yd away simply tells me that you were about to be 'bushwhacked' yourself - little solace to your survivors, should it have happened.

I will stand by my 'guns', so to speak - DA shooting in self defense is intuitive. For the average person not versed in SA shooting nuances, DA is 'second nature'. Why do you think so many security guard 64's, for example, have had the SA notch on the hammer ground down - or the hammer itself is bobbed? Enough.

Stainz
 
ZVP
3" bbl Heritage .22WMR?
I am thinking about buying one for a self defense gun.
My reasoning: On a fixed retirement buget, now all I have to carry is a Berreta Model 21 .22LR, and a Cobra.38 Derrringer. One limited power, the other only 2 shots.
The Heritage is on sale for $200, fires 6 .22WMR , transfer bar, small size birdshead grip and 3" bbl. US made and appears well made. For the money seems to be a good deal!
Being on a budget I considered a used .38 revolver but they usually run $125-50 more than I have. There are some .32 and .38S&W revolvers out there but the cartriges have less power than the .22WMR. Yes I understand the S/A Heritage is slow to reload (hope I don't even to shoot once!) The Heritage is large enough to aim and shoot accurate enough at combat distances ( est:21 ft).
What do you guys think? Would the Heritage make a decent little revolver for the need and limits that I have? I would love to have a S&W Chief's special but dream on...
Thanks,
ZVP
Click to expand...

I would never recommend a single action anything for HD/SD. Gunbroker is filled with PA-63, Beretta 84, S&W 915, Beretta 1951, FEG HP pistols for less than $200 or just above $200. The Taurus & Rossi 3rd wold country police trade ins work but are rough looking. I would also look into those as well.
 
Correct, they're all kinds under $225.00, just dont forget the $20/$30 dollars shipping and the $20 + dollars transfer fee.

Also guys remember he stated he's on a fixed income, Social Security?

Any of you tried to live on $1500 or less a month?
 
ZVP, There are some nice deals on. .38spl. DA rov.s out there . But being on a fixed income I have found it cost more to shoot &get good firearms to shoot with. The H.A.s -R.R. combination S.A. with the 3.5"BRL. & Birdshead grips is just fine for what you want. I have owned 2 that I got in trades over the years. I know of (4) others that use them as trail guns. I will agree that there are better guns & cal.s out there. But with the price of ammunition going up unless you are a handloader or planning on it, the cost of that is a factor. .22mag. is not the best S.D.round out, but it will get the job done! A old bear hunter I know used a Ruger S.S. Rov. w /4 5/8" for years &was very successful. Get what works for You! Good luck, Be safe &have fun!
 
I will stand by my 'guns', so to speak - DA shooting in self defense is intuitive.
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You can argue about "intuitiveness" (is that a word) or what is or isn't second nature all day long. You can easily make the same argument about striker-fired or DAO autos. Yes, it is a given that it's easier for the uninitiated to pick something up and make it go bang when all it requires is to slap the trigger. I'm talking waaaaay beyond that. What matters is how much time you spend building proficiency. Bottom line is that nothing is quicker from leather to the first shot than a Colt pattern SA. So we can argue the in's and out's of each platform until we're blue in the face. That's not where I'm going with this. I'm not saying that one is inherently better than the other. All I'm saying is that the individual's level of proficiency is vastly more important than the particular tool he is proficient with. Proper mindset is vastly more important than either. To steal a quote from JD Jones, "an arrow through the heart is better than 10,000ft-lbs in the ass".


Your encounter with someone in your trailer park some 30yd away simply tells me that you were about to be 'bushwhacked' yourself...
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The point is that you never know what is going to happen or when, until it happens. Nor do the bad guys (sometimes a matter of perspective) obey by the rules. I really don't care what instructors say. Every instructor in America can say the same thing but that is not a guarantee that it will happen that way. Rest assured, whatever scenario folks have worked out in their minds, is not how it will go down. It will happen when you least expect it, where you least expect it, from and unlikely direction and probably not from a pre-determined distance.


Why do you think so many security guard 64's, for example, have had the SA notch on the hammer ground down - or the hammer itself is bobbed?
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Who cares??? They could all have pink grips but what does that prove?


No, I never said I shoot CAS.


Any of you tried to live on $1500 or less a month?
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Yep. Money can be saved over time. If your life is important to you, you will save enough money to buy a halfway decent tool for the job. Or not.
 
Any of you tried to live on $1500 or less a month?

Yep. Money can be saved over time. If your life is important to you, you will save enough money to buy a halfway decent tool for the job. Or not.
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Actually I should have typed "in todays economy?".

Further, none of us know the OP's financial situation. Saving money over time or not.

As far as advice to the OP. I would for an inexpensive semi auto in 9mm or larger. Surplus would work fine, in fact much better than a .22 rim fire, LR or Magnum or whatever.
 
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PS, local shop has like new S&W .38 snubs stickered at $320-$350. If you can afford a computer and internet access, you can afford a decent defensive weapon. Eat Ramen noodles for a month, anything. Fact is affordability is usually a choice.
 
jcwit

Correct, they're all kinds under $225.00, just dont forget the $20/$30 dollars shipping and the $20 + dollars transfer fee.

Also guys remember he stated he's on a fixed income, Social Security?

Any of you tried to live on $1500 or less a month?
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I'd PM'd the OP on PA-63's chambered in 32 ACP. They were well below $150. So another $25 for shipping and and another $25 for transfer fee still puts him nicely below $200. 7+1 of 32 ACP from a semi-auto beats a single action HRR in 22 Mag any day - and I have a HRR in 22 Mag!!!

And, no - I have not had to try living on $1,500 or less a month. I thank the big guy upstairs each and every day. We need to take better care of our seniors, but I'm digressing...
 
I'd PM'd the OP on PA-63's chambered in 32 ACP. They were well below $150. So another $25 for shipping and and another $25 for transfer fee still puts him nicely below $200. 7+1 of 32 ACP from a semi-auto beats a single action HRR in 22 Mag any day - and I have a HRR in 22 Mag!!!

And, no - I have not had to try living on $1,500 or less a month. I thank the big guy upstairs each and every day. We need to take better care of our seniors, but I'm digressing...
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Very good plan! I have 2 of them, one is even chambered for .380. Good reliable defense pistol.
 
CraigC - I agree with your post #16!

As to #13, it looks like we are discussing semantics - you say you need training in the use of what you have - I want less training - more practice - in what is easiest to employ... intuitively, you might say! You bet intuitiveness is a word - look it up. But, your remark about pink grips was unkind... I think they are butch. Not just anyone can strap a hogleg on with a pink grip!

Stainz

PS My SS retirement income, which I started at 62 with 46+ yr of work, is less than $1,500/month - with no deductions. I prefer the Oriental Ramen Noodles, which I buy at Publix on Wed when I get my old guy 5% off.
 
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I can honestly say I'd have no problem carrying your Bersa.

I carry the NAA mini in 22 magnum and those go for around $210 or so. Much easier to conceal than a Heritage and stainless too.
 
Any of you tried to live on $1500 or less a month?


Actually I should have typed "in todays economy?".
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yes. as a small town cop with a family.
 
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