wun_8_seven
member
hey folks, i have a m1 30 cal carbine(usgi,IBM). and wondered what ya'll think about this gun & cartridge for home defense.(rural) also any way to make it feed sp or hp ammo? so far i'll i can get it to run is fmj. thanks 187
30 carbine for defense
- Thread starter wun_8_seven
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benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Keep trying different HP loads until you find something it likes.
If you can find a HP load it's reliable with, I'd say it's an excellent choice. It was the FMJ loads that gave it a bad reputation.
If you can find a HP load it's reliable with, I'd say it's an excellent choice. It was the FMJ loads that gave it a bad reputation.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
For all practical purposes it's like a hot-load .357 110-grain ahead of a bunch of 4227 or HS6. Just needs a better bullet, is all.
Don't know the source, but my uncle loaded a bunch of round-nosed 110-grain soft-points. Quite reliable in feeding through my father's old WW II critter.
Worst case, you could load some of those 100-grain plinkers. They oughta feed okay, and expand. (Guess I'll have to try some, and see.
)
Art
Don't know the source, but my uncle loaded a bunch of round-nosed 110-grain soft-points. Quite reliable in feeding through my father's old WW II critter.
Worst case, you could load some of those 100-grain plinkers. They oughta feed okay, and expand. (Guess I'll have to try some, and see.
)Art
WonderNine
member
Well it's not quite as large diameter as the .357 bullet, but has about the energy of a typical factory loaded .44 magnum out of a 4" revolver when the .30 is coming out of the carbine barrel. Or a little less than half that of a 30-30.
Safe Stop for Self Defense
Mag Safe makes a .30 Caliber SWAT Load. Haven't fired it and I don't know much about it. You can see it on thier web page and I think Natchez Shooters sells it.
Safe Stop @ www.safestop.net will be producing .30 caliber bullet designed by Jim Cirillo formerly of NYPD. He used the .30 carbine in gun fights while with the stake out unit. This fellow certainly has had the experience to design a great round. Check out the web page and email Fuzzy for more details about the release date of the Safe Stop .30 caliber.
Also, Cor Bon is slated to release a Pow'r Ball in .30 Caliber.
Finally, Winchester produces a 110 grain Hollow Soft Point. I've read that this performs well on varmints and is around $26.00 for 50. It also reported feeds well in the M1's.
I'd like to know more about the .22 Spitfire.
I think the lack of effective ammo placed this gun on the shelf for years as a self defense weapon. Now, it seems good ammo is coming out. I think it's a great choice between a pistol caliber carbine and a high powered rifle like a .223. Since IAI and Fulton Armory are producing M1's this caliber may make a real comeback.
I just bought an old M1. I'm seeing so much talk about it in the discussion groups I figured I'd get it before the price goes up.
It's almost 60 years old and functions quite well.
Mag Safe makes a .30 Caliber SWAT Load. Haven't fired it and I don't know much about it. You can see it on thier web page and I think Natchez Shooters sells it.
Safe Stop @ www.safestop.net will be producing .30 caliber bullet designed by Jim Cirillo formerly of NYPD. He used the .30 carbine in gun fights while with the stake out unit. This fellow certainly has had the experience to design a great round. Check out the web page and email Fuzzy for more details about the release date of the Safe Stop .30 caliber.
Also, Cor Bon is slated to release a Pow'r Ball in .30 Caliber.
Finally, Winchester produces a 110 grain Hollow Soft Point. I've read that this performs well on varmints and is around $26.00 for 50. It also reported feeds well in the M1's.
I'd like to know more about the .22 Spitfire.
I think the lack of effective ammo placed this gun on the shelf for years as a self defense weapon. Now, it seems good ammo is coming out. I think it's a great choice between a pistol caliber carbine and a high powered rifle like a .223. Since IAI and Fulton Armory are producing M1's this caliber may make a real comeback.
I just bought an old M1. I'm seeing so much talk about it in the discussion groups I figured I'd get it before the price goes up.
It's almost 60 years old and functions quite well.
wun_8_seven
member
thanks for the replys, i tried the winchester 110's and it wouldn't feed two in a row. i also tried a round soft nose of unknown origin & it would feed 3-4 then jam.but with usa 110 fmj it has never missed a beat. 187
Dave Markowitz
Member
IMO, the M1 Carbine with expanding ammo would make a great defense gun. It should perform like a .357 Magnum carbine. If yours won't feed SPs or HPs reliably, check the feed ramp. It may need to be polished a bit.
I have an Underwood M1 that I want to try out the Winchester HSPs in, to see if they feed ok.
Back in the 1980s I had an Iver Johnson M1 and handloaded for it. One load I tried used the Speer 100 grain "Plinker" short-jacket bullets. They should expand pretty well at M1 Carbine velocities, although they were not as accurate as 110 grain ammo.
I have an Underwood M1 that I want to try out the Winchester HSPs in, to see if they feed ok.
Back in the 1980s I had an Iver Johnson M1 and handloaded for it. One load I tried used the Speer 100 grain "Plinker" short-jacket bullets. They should expand pretty well at M1 Carbine velocities, although they were not as accurate as 110 grain ammo.
Andrew Wyatt
Member
do .30 carbine bullets and 7.62X25mm bullets have the same OD?
clem
Member
Go to this site. They have the "Johnson SpitFire Barrels & Ammo".
http://www.e-gunparts.com/DisplayAd.asp?chrProductSKU=766960A&chrSuperSKU=766960
Hope this helps.
http://www.e-gunparts.com/DisplayAd.asp?chrProductSKU=766960A&chrSuperSKU=766960
Hope this helps.
natedog
Member
My understanding is that the .30 Carbine has more evergy at 100 yds. than a .357 has at the muzzle. Here's the source: http://www.impactguns.com/store/iai_m1_carbine.html
Considering the value of an IBM M1 Carbine you may want to put her up for sale and get one of the less expensive ARs or an AK with the money. A standard IBM will bring $600 while an AO receiver IBM will bring considerably more. (I spent years searching for my IBM and I wouldn't touch her to make any alterations.) The other guns have proven performance for man and varment stoping and the ammunition is considerably cheaper than the .30 carbine.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
I've never had any feeding problems, but if I did, I'd just polish the feed ramp into the chamber. No different from what's done to 1911s...
Careful tweaking with the lips of the magazine might be just enough of an angle change to allow feeding of the "oddball" ammo.
Art
Careful tweaking with the lips of the magazine might be just enough of an angle change to allow feeding of the "oddball" ammo.
Art
WonderNine
member
That's about right.
Wildalaska
member
For anyone who thinks the 30 carbine, in any loading, is ineffective for home defense, I invite you to stop by my house and let me shoot you in the face with one at a range of 10 feet.
Just jokin of course..
WildbutyagetmypointdontyouAlaska
Just jokin of course..
WildbutyagetmypointdontyouAlaska
Tom C.
Member.
M1 Carbine for home defense
I have an M1 Carbine and I consider it a very good weapon for home defense. Sierra 110 RNSPs with 296 make a good combination. I also replaced the recoil spring with a Wolff spring, polished the feed ramp, and keep the gas piston clean. Failure to clean the gas piston after a session can lead to short stroking.
I have an M1 Carbine and I consider it a very good weapon for home defense. Sierra 110 RNSPs with 296 make a good combination. I also replaced the recoil spring with a Wolff spring, polished the feed ramp, and keep the gas piston clean. Failure to clean the gas piston after a session can lead to short stroking.
wun_8_seven
member
hso, my dad who retired from ibm collected ibm carbines for 30 years(21 total) gave it to me so i wont be selling or altering it in anyway. i have an AR and a sks, but thought the short , light carbine with its lower powered ammo might be a better option for in and around the house & barn etc. 187
Gordon
Member
I think the Rem. soft point factory load is the most effective and it feeds well too. The win. HP is too frangible(like a varmint load) and doesn't feed well. Ball is ok by me but goats shot thru chest with Rem load(sp) drop on spot instead of the 50 foot run with same hit with ball, the penetration is near complete (14-16"). Carbines Rock!
If you must use this weapon for home defense besides using soft points that by the way have been available for many years, I would test out each and every magazine that you plan on using.
I have had nothing but trouble with M1 Carbine magazines. The 15 round military are the most reliable but even they often malfuction. If possible avoid taking off the floor plate to clean them. If you put even a slight bend in the flimsy sheet metal floor plate it will slip off the bottom of the mag causing a jam.
The next thing you want to do is replace the recoil spring with a heavy duty one. Sarco used to sell them so I would give them a call and see if you can get one right away. The original recoil springs were pretty aenemic and if you did not watch when you charged the weapon and partially rode the op-rod down the extractor would not snap over the loaded round because of the exteremely week recoil spring. Replacing it will help elimiate this charging problem and also help in more relialbe feeding.
For handloaders that are out there I have found that Duponts 4227 powder to be about the most reliable. Alliant 24o00 (Hercules) will do the job in a pinch but is not nearly as reliable in making the gun function.
Make sure the damned ring that holds in the piston is tight and it is really supposed to be staked to prevent it from backing off and causing malfuctions but this is not practical if you shoot your carbine alot because you can only stake this so many times. I just use the special take down tool wrench and really tighten it up good after cleaning the piston. Failure to keep the piston clean in the gun will cause a lot of malfuctions.
Check the rear sight often. I have had them come loose from time to time and if you think the normal basketball size groups this gun gives are bad try shooting one with a loose rear sight.
If you get the impression that I do not think much of this weapon your right. YOur better off trading it off for a much more reliable,and much, much, much more accurate and more powerful SKS in 7.62x39.
I have had nothing but trouble with M1 Carbine magazines. The 15 round military are the most reliable but even they often malfuction. If possible avoid taking off the floor plate to clean them. If you put even a slight bend in the flimsy sheet metal floor plate it will slip off the bottom of the mag causing a jam.
The next thing you want to do is replace the recoil spring with a heavy duty one. Sarco used to sell them so I would give them a call and see if you can get one right away. The original recoil springs were pretty aenemic and if you did not watch when you charged the weapon and partially rode the op-rod down the extractor would not snap over the loaded round because of the exteremely week recoil spring. Replacing it will help elimiate this charging problem and also help in more relialbe feeding.
For handloaders that are out there I have found that Duponts 4227 powder to be about the most reliable. Alliant 24o00 (Hercules) will do the job in a pinch but is not nearly as reliable in making the gun function.
Make sure the damned ring that holds in the piston is tight and it is really supposed to be staked to prevent it from backing off and causing malfuctions but this is not practical if you shoot your carbine alot because you can only stake this so many times. I just use the special take down tool wrench and really tighten it up good after cleaning the piston. Failure to keep the piston clean in the gun will cause a lot of malfuctions.
Check the rear sight often. I have had them come loose from time to time and if you think the normal basketball size groups this gun gives are bad try shooting one with a loose rear sight.
If you get the impression that I do not think much of this weapon your right. YOur better off trading it off for a much more reliable,and much, much, much more accurate and more powerful SKS in 7.62x39.
wun_8_seven
member
thanks for the repls, as far as mags go i have 5, 15 rounders that i've never had a problem with when using fmj. and bhp9 mine will shoot into 4-5" at a 100 yards which is further than i intend to shot with this gun. 187
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
Yeah, 187, I'm like you, I guess. What with nary a problem with M1 or M2 mags over a few years, I 'magine I'll stay with luck over skill, any day.
, Art
, ArtWildalaska
member
Whatever.
WildifyoucantaffordagoodonejustsaysoAlaska
Tamara
Senior Member
WildAlaska,
Don't you understand? Your experiences are superfluous! BHP9 is telling you how it is!
Don't you understand? Your experiences are superfluous! BHP9 is telling you how it is!
Andrew Wyatt
Member
at least he didn't say a .30 carb's accuracy was a "cruel joke".
the m1 carbine is just fine for what you intend to use it for.
the m1 carbine is just fine for what you intend to use it for.
Sven
Senior Member
I was shooting 2" groups with my carbine at 50 yards yesterday. That's good enough for home defense.
During our tests where we shot jugs of water with rifles the carbine gave performance similar to the rifles - an explosion, or... if you hit the base of an empty jug, it would fly into the air. This was at 40 yards.
Pistols would neither explode the jug nor sending it flying.
Not a very scientific test, but sadly more objective that much of what some have posted.
The carbine is very quick to shoulder and light... by the time the empty jug landed on the ground, the sights would be over the target again and... 11 out of every dozen shots I'd nail that sucker again.
Talk about fun.
During our tests where we shot jugs of water with rifles the carbine gave performance similar to the rifles - an explosion, or... if you hit the base of an empty jug, it would fly into the air. This was at 40 yards.
Pistols would neither explode the jug nor sending it flying.
Not a very scientific test, but sadly more objective that much of what some have posted.
The carbine is very quick to shoulder and light... by the time the empty jug landed on the ground, the sights would be over the target again and... 11 out of every dozen shots I'd nail that sucker again.
Talk about fun.
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