.308 Recommendations

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Vegaslaith

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trying to round out my rifle collection with something in .308. I was considering an HK91($1050-$1200) clone or maybe an M1A. As far as magazine and gun price/availability it seems the HK gets my vote. Even though the M1A runs about $1400 and the mags cost more, people say the recoil on the HK is terrible. Basically my criteria for buying any gun are:1)price 2)parts availability, and 3)ease of maintainence and use.

What do you guys think? Which gun (or even a 3rd choice) gets at least 2 out of 3?
 
How about a FAL or an AR10? Good used FALs or part guns can cost between $500-1200 depending on the maker and condition. A big plus is that mags are cheap and plentiful. Also the gas regulator can be fine tuned for milsurp, factory, and reloads.
 
I've shot .45acp guns and don't have a problem with the recoil. But never tried anything in 7.62 NATO, just my trusty AK in 7.62 by 39
 
I've posted here before on my PTR 91. I really like the rifle, even though it took some modifications to get it to work as I like it. It fits me well and is just a huge pleasure to shoot. The versatility of the subcaliber kits out there which allow the use of 22 long rifle ammo really clinched the deal for me. I can blow up blue rocks on the berm with the 22s, or the 308 as the desires strike.

I would not hesitate to buy another were the opportunity to present itself.
 
I'll chime in here about the recoil. It is MUCH worse. Compare the 2 guns and although the PTR91 has more mass it is brutal to shoot. I love my PTR and the recoil actually enhances the experience for me. FWIW, I scoped my rifle and tweaked some handloads to see what kind of accuracy it had......... 1 MOA or better with 165 grain handloads. Not a fully developed load, but it gave me insight into the accuracy.
 
I just bought a PTR-91 as well. The recoil is not that bad but it is pronounced. I have shot 12 gauge slugs before so it isn't as bad as the recoil from the shotgun. After shooting 300 rounds through it, I got use to the recoil. The front end of this rifle is heavy so that helps reduce the recoil.
 
I'll chime in here about the recoil. It is MUCH worse. Compare the 2 guns and although the PTR91 has more mass it is brutal to shoot.
Click to expand...
That just tickles the crap out of me. Reminds me of the friend, who just having shot my Garand said, "Has kind of a lot of recoil for a COMBAT weapon!"
 
:confused:

I don't get it. All this talk about the recoil from an HK-91 (or the like) being so bad?

:rolleyes:

Wow. I must be some kind of stud or something. Who woulda thunk it?

I once had an HK-91 that I sold because I got weary of the heavy and awkward feel to it. I loaded and shot some HOT rounds out of that thing. Yeah, it kicked some. So what?

Is everybody so used to the .223 rifles that something like a .308 feels "brutal" out of a heavy rifle like the HK?

Geez. You want brutal .308 (or at the very least, "quite uncomfortable") try shooting one of the Ishapore faux jungle carbines that are out there.

That baby can put some "ouch" on you. Makes the HK, etc. things feel like pussycats - which they really aren't that far from being. Relatively.
 
It's not that it (HK91 and clones) recoils all that much for most. Just it isn't uncommon for those who have shot them side-by-side with FALs, M1As, and AR-10s to think that the roller lock has comparatively more recoil than the gas operated semi-auto battle rifles.
 
Look at FALs better rifle....

As far as recoil???? My niece was shooting M38 Mosin Nagants and my G3s and CETMEs when she was 11 weighin in at a wopping 85lbs!!! Same with my ex step daughter at 4'9" and 75lbs, we'd have to make em stop shooting by only giving them 150 rnds per gun otherwise they'd blast away all day with em, ya'll must be either in serious need of proper training on shooting a long gun or outa invest in some GYM time cause a .308 is nothing ESPECIALLY from a roller locked semi auto...... hope ya'll never decide to try any of the WWI or WWII Bolt guns ya'll probably cripple yourselves ;) and yes my collection of Ishy 2A1s (.308) were their favorits as they tended to be more accurate than the Mosins

The FAL can be tuned with its adjustable gas regulator to shoot super soft for those who spend more time playin with mice and keyboards than workin with their hands
 
The recoil is greater than an AK47, yes. But what bothered me is that it takes you off target, not the shove so much as the necessity to reacquire your target.

So I had Mike Six at Hickman Rifles here in Colorado Springs install a heavy buffer and a Cooley muzzle brake from JPRifles dot com. Now it pushes straight back, but it doesn't move me nearly so much off target.

I might offer the comparison of the slant brake on the AK vs. the plain muzzle. The recoil is not objectionable, but it is sufficient to move your muzzle away from what you are shooting. Only the Cooley brake is more refined than the slant brake, the latter of which seemed to over compensate somewhat. The Cooley just keeps the muzzle on target shooting the 308 with bullets as heavy as 168 grains.

The heavy buffer I'm glad I have. I don't know that I would get another had I to do it over again, but it seems to change the character of the recoil impulse to where it seems more of a shove than a kick. It is a subtle difference, so in truth there may be no difference really at all.

The Magpul stock which has a rubber buttpad or the standard G3 stock with the rubber buttpad also helps.

Altogether I'm glad I had these modifications made to the rifle, but then I like to tinker with rifles. I don't know that any single modification would have satisfied me, but if I were to pick only one, it would be the muzzle brake. The mods together make it quite a manageable piece.

As for the FAL, some people really like the FAL. I guess I am ambivalent to it mostly. I had a pre dealer sample G1 which was a nice rifle, but whoever designed that stamped metal forend had his head in a dark and smelly place. That thing would get so hot after a couple of magazines that you couldn't hold it. This was IMO, a poor design. The PTR91 with the wide forend does a much better job of heat isolation from the shooter.

YMMV.
 
The M1A is slightly better than the FN FAL and the HK is comes in out of the bunch. They are all 3 great rifles though. Shoot all three of them and get used to them and pick your favourite.

For me, it is the M1A.
 
Before you get too locked in, consider the Saiga in .308.

Actually quite pleasant to shoot. And the price is so low, you can do a lot to it in the way of modifications (or not, if you prefer) and still have gobs of $$$ left over for ammo.

Do a search here and you'll find quite a bit of reference to it.
 
Funny,
I don't find the Garand recoil bad at all. For me the PTR recoil is much more violent. I love rifles that let me know when I fire them, so it's no big deal for me.
As far as targeting after another round is fired........no problem with my Eotech.
 
people say the recoil on the HK is terrible.
Click to expand...

It's just "snappier" or something, not sure how to describe it.

It's very sudden and violent, but it's not painful or uncontrollable, just different from every other rifle I've fired.
 
No, 7.62x39 is a little small for 7.62x51

So mag availability is the downside here. You can purchase 25rd High cap mags for the .308 and they're US made, but they cost ya $40 each instead of cheaper surplus mags.

BUT, my S.308 21" shoots 2" @100yrds with Surplus 150gr ball ammo.

I love it.
 
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