.308 shopping

[Thompson9494]

Okay guys, me and my dad are going to be in the market for a .308 semi-auto here pretty soon (if Fienstein's AWB gets knocked out)and the three popular .308s I've heard about are the AR-10, the M1A and FAL/DS Arms SA-58.

I've handled all three of them and have been most impressed by the SA-58, I like the ergos, the sights, the position of the charging handle and how pointable the rifle is.

The AR-10 comes in second, I like the ergos on it too, the magazine release is a more familiar than on the SA-58 or the M1A, but I don't like the position of the charging handle.

The M1A is actually my least favorite when considering the price range, it doesn't have a pistol grip (as made), is a pound or two heavier than both of the others and is much more expensive if you want to get a more tactical variant (or at least in my experience it has been $100 to $200 more).

So what do y'all think of the three rifles I'm looking at? Which ones better, worse, is there something I don't know about these rifles that gives them an edge or makes them less desirable than the other two on the list or is there another rifle all together I haven't listed that deserves a chance?



Thanks!!

 

[PhotoBiker]

What are you going to use them for?

I just put an LR308B on order at the LGS. I plan on punching some serious holes in paper with it ;-)

 

[No4Mk1*]

Best trigger - M1A
Ability to mount optics - AR

Magazine release and charging handle not as important as all have a way to release the bolt during a reload and you get 20 rounds of 308 between mag changes. M1A and FAL sort of force you to keep up with your empty mags better as youare more likely to grab the empty mag to detach from the rifle while the AR allows faster reloads.

 

[adelbridge]

AR-10 is the most accurate of the three. AR-10 wins when it comes to aftermarket parts (including charging handles). AR-10 is going to probably be the lightest. Gun smithing is going to be easiest on the AR-10. AR-10 is going to have the most manufacturers to choose from. That said the Browning BAR Hog Hunter/Winchester SX-AR/FN-AR is an ugly gun but worth looking into. I own an AR-10 and the BAR. BAR makes a better hunting rifle for sure.

 

[MCMXI]

Best trigger - M1A

Really? The M1A has a good trigger but AR308s can have GREAT triggers.

http://geissele.com/

I have an SA58 PARA, a Springfield M1A Scout Squad and a POF P308. If I could only keep one it'd be the POF ... no doubt about it. Best trigger (Geissele), most accurate (0.5 MOA), best magazines (MAGPUL), most flexible in terms of optics, most choices in terms of stock/forend and the biggest selection of aftermarket accessories. Second choice would be the SA58 but when all is said and done, the M1A is still a great rifle. Thank goodness I don't have to choose.

 

[Thompson9494]

Personally, it's mostly going to be shooting range stuff for the foreseeable future unless I get really big into boar hunting after I leave for college and get my own place. Accuracy doesn't disturb me as much, as long as the rifle is capable of shooting "Moment of milkjug" or moment of bad guy at 300 to 400 yards I'm good, I'm not looking at getting into any rifle competitions where clover leafing my shots is a necessity, so as long as the rifle is capable of doing that (and all three of these rifles are) I'm good.


And I'll look into the Browning rifle.

 

[krupparms]

I would go with the DSA / FAL. Just my pick.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Those are my three favorites in the following order:

AR-10
FAL
M1A

The AR-10 is far-and-away the most ergonomic, adaptable and efficient. They're also the most accurate, frequently capable of sub-MOA from factory.

The FAL is a sleek, slender rifle (except the charging handle) that is combat proven. Handling characteristics are good, but controls layout is less so. The safety is not within reach without adjusting your grip, and mag changes are much slower than an AR. Accuracy of a standard FAL is combat acceptable, but not match level; 2-4 MOA is typical.

The M1A is a sexy rifle, but has the FAL's reload speed and accuracy shortcomings, in addition to getting very heavy very quickly if you try to make it more ergonomic, such as EBR. I do like the M1A, but as I said, it's 3rd on my list.

fourth would be the G3/CETME pattern. Good guns, but on the heavy side, no more accurate than the FAL or M1A, do not lock open on empty, sharper recoil impulse, nose heavy, not a ton of upgrade/accessory options. The upshot is literally dirt-cheap mags; I was buying them at 5 for $20.


I have trigger time with all the 7.62 battle rifles available in the USA, save for the Kel Tec RFB. I own an Armalite AR-10 carbine, a DSA SA58 Para carbine and a Century C91 (G3). The FAL is a very recent acquisition, and I like it, but still prefer the AR-10 for the aforementioned reasons. Incidentally, it's successor, the SCAR-H, is pretty much my least favorite battle rifle.

 

[TIMC]

I have owned all three but what remains in my collection are two AR-10's and neither one of the others. AR's in .308 are about as good as it gets in a semi-auto .308 rifle.

 

[OldTex]

I have two accurized M1As (one in a JAE stock) and a LaRue 7.62 OBR. I wouldn't part with any of them. The LaRue probably has more accuracy potential but it's harder to drive than the M1As, at least for someone never that into the AR guns. It also beats the bejesus out of me compared with the M1As. Had to put a big muzzle brake on it. Triggers are nice on all three but had to upgrade the factory Geiselle on the OBR. I'm a sucker for the old M1As so don't talk too bad about my babies.

 

[The_Armed_Therapist]

The M1A is a fine work of art, imo. However, it costs lots of $. Art collectors are typically wealthy. LOL... If you are an art collector, I don't think you'll be disappointed with the M1A. If not an art collector, then move on...

I own a PTR91, and it's a fine rifle. I get 2.5MOA with cheap surplus ammo. I also bought it for well under a grand last summer. I rate this practically identical to the FAL. I love both, and just bought the first one that I could get on a great deal.

Now the the AR10. I don't know a lot about the market for the AR10. However, the LR308, an AR-style rifle by DPMS is a great product for a decent price. My Brother-in-Law can squeeze just under 1MOA with the good stuff. Obviously, market support for AR platforms is more than sufficient, too.

If I had the liberty to choose whatever I want without worrying about paying next month's rent, MIA all the way; I don't have the luxury. LOL... So, my next choice would be the LR308 or AR10. They barely edge out the FAL and the PTR91. Although, all 5 that I've mentioned are phenomenal tools in my eyes.

 

[Geno]

I went with the M1A because of the on/off switch for the gas system. Too, any rifle that with iron sights, can hit a toaster sized target at 300 yards, shot after shot (the "Loaded" model) is accurate enough even w/o an optic. I'm not suggesting the others can't be as accurate, but they lack that switch. If you reload, that is a valuable option. In addition to the Loaded model, I bought the SOCOM model for boar hunting in the woods.

Good luck and enjoy whatever you select.

Geno

 

[Derek Zeanah]

<cough>SCAR-17</cough> I never liked the ergonomics on the FAL. I really like the ergonomics on the SCAR though. Go figure.

If it were me, choosing among the options you listed, I'd probably choose an M1A and drop it into an aftermarket stock. Something like this:

We're getting out of your price range at that point, though.

In all, every one of the rifles you're considering is a competent choice. If I was being practical, I'd say plan on purchasing 20-30 magazines when you buy the rifle and let the difference in magazine price/availability guide you.

 

[Desert Dog]

I have a DPMS LR308 AP4, and it is a tack driver. I am thoroughly impressed with the accuracy and the low recoil of the weapon. I was lucky enough to pick up some Magpul magazines for it before November 6th...

 

[browningguy]

I prefer the FNAR for a .308, but to each his own. Of the 3 you specifically mention the FAL is a good enough battle rifle but the AR10 is generally much more accurate. And while I like the M1A it's mostly for nostalgic reasons, either the AR10 or FNAR will shoot far better unless you spend a lot of cash on the M1A.

 

[TexAg]

I like the FNAR too, though mine is an SX-AR. I like slinging .308 at distance accurately as possible. My second choice would be a .308 AR, especially one that takes Magpul mags.

 

[avs11054]

I have a AR-10. It is awesome. I have not shot and do not have any experience with the other two. With the AR-10, it is familiar to anybody who has shot an AR-15, and it is extremely customizable. Parts are readily available (usually) for them.

 

[MachIVshooter]

I'm not suggesting the others can't be as accurate, but they lack that switch. If you reload, that is a valuable option.

AR-10 and other .308 ARs tend to put empties in a nice little pile about 10' to your right.

FAL can eject nicely, if properly set.

SCAR was more violent than AR-10, but still not throwing them excessive distances.

G3/CETME/PTR send brass into low orbit, and the fluted chambers tear it up anyway. Not a good option for reloaders.

I honestly didn't pay much attention to the FN AR in this regard. I just felt the rifle was rather ugly and definitely snout-heavy. Pretty accurate, though.

 

[Robert]

I love my FAL. Best ergonomics and runs like a champ on just about anything.

 

[The_Armed_Therapist]

G3/CETME/PTR send brass into low orbit

Very true! The first time I shot my PTR at a commercial range, it took me 15minutes to find the brass. Someone else actually found it. He said, "Hey, I think they're over here." The guy was like 50 feet away. I said, "Um... I don't think that's possible." HAHA... I was wrong.

 

[Geno]

If you decide to go with an M1A, be sure to avoid SA's Gen 4 base. It has no protrusion that inserts into the receiver's groove on the side. I've had issues with mine not holding zero, and finally sent it back as defective. My A.R.M.S. 18 base holds very well.

Geno

 

[CA Raider]

"That said the Browning BAR Hog Hunter/Winchester SX-AR/FN-AR is an ugly gun but worth looking into. I own an AR-10 and the BAR. BAR makes a better hunting rifle for sure. "

adelbridge ... i was looking at BAR's and noticed the HogHunter. If I remember right it's got a fairly short barrel ... maybe 18-in or 20-in. what kind of accuracy are you getting from it - do you have a HogHunter?

CA R

 

[TexAg]

The FNAR comes in 16 and 20 inch barrels, but I think the Browning and Win only come in 20". I get 1moa from my Win SX-AR.

 

[Thompson9494]

The quest for a .308 continues....

I know, this is an oldish thread but I figured I'd use this one instead of creating an entirely new one. So here it goes...

I'm still looking for a .308 battle rifle. I'd still prefer a DSA FAL but they are extremely short supply, I've seen about four since March at gun shows only, not in a store which is annoying.

The PTR-91 has now entered the running and there is one in stock at an LGS that I really like but I keep on hearing about persistent issues with ammo in the PTRs and I'd really rather not have a rifle that is choosy on ammo.

The M1A is old school and I like them a lot but they are pretty difficult to mount a scope on unless you to mount in the 'scout' position which is something of a concern seeing as I might one day want to mount a scope on my rifle.

The AR-10...I can't say that there is anything I do not like about this rifle, they're easy to mount a scope on and they are 'modular' and everything but it's just kind of bland and boring to me....I dunno maybe I'm just weird.

Thanks in advance!

 

[barnbwt]

Go for an FNAR. 1100$ plus optics gets you:

-1MOA guaranteed out of the box
-plenty of rails for optics/accessories
-Excellent box mags in 5, 10, and 20 round capcities
-Adjustable cheek and butt pads (I think cant and comb drop can be adjusted with spacers, too)
-Only needs a full breakdown/overhaul every 1000 rounds
-Comes with sling swivels for mounting "Fudd" accessories
-Ambidextrous mag release (drop free)
-Short stroke tappet piston action (low recoil/debris)
-Aluminum receiver (weighs in at 12lbs, but with a full stock/forearm and heavy barrel)
-Stock can be replaced with a non-pistol grip Short trac BAR stock with minor fitting (and I believe some guy came up with a folding stock as well)
-Gentle on ejected brass (condition and distance --mine, at least)

The only, and I mean only downsides are
-No military history (but 'only' 60 years of excellent hunting performance as the BAR)
-Crossbolt safeties are out of fashion compared to selector levers (but still reachable with one hand)
-Magazines are expensive and won't be found littering the Capitol Wasteland when SHTF. Personally, mag cost is a drop in the bucket compared to 308
-The extremely infrequent overhauls are a pain in the rear; since the gun is a non-modular design, it breaks down into many little pieces instead of "groups"
-No one makes drums for it yet

I suggest you draw up a list of these pros/cons against other "military-style" 308 autoloaders, and see how they stack up (don't do it here; flame wars, and all :banghead. Unless you have your heart set on a lookalike battle rifle for historical/aesthetic/personal reasons, military service in and of itself should not be a factor in the decision.

TCB