Folks, I am in the market for a bolt action rifle for hunting whitetail in South Texas. I am leaning on getting a TIKKA T3, but need some advise on the caliber. I really like the 30 calibers. What info can you provide regarding the .308 vs the 30.06? Is there significantly less recoil in the the .308? I am relatively new to rifle hunting. Any info would be greatly appreciated. Have a great weekend.
.308 vs 30.06
- Thread starter Dan-E-Boy
- Start date
- Status
TexasRifleman
Moderator Emeritus
My opinion only, there's not really any recoil difference between the 2, not enough to worry about anyway. The Ought 6 may have a tiny bit more.
These days I'd buy the '06 simply because of ammo prices. .308 is through the roof.......
Either will be plenty for our scrawny Texas deer
These days I'd buy the '06 simply because of ammo prices. .308 is through the roof.......
Either will be plenty for our scrawny Texas deer
TCB in TN
Member
In a light weight or youth rifle the .308 would be a little lighter from a recoil standpoint but honestly I don't think there is enough difference for it to be a big deal.
Titan6
member
Both are good cartridges. Recoil depends upon a many factors that have to do with firearm design. There are dozens of threads here that have that information. Try using the search function at the bottom of the front page. If after reading a few you still have questions go ahead and post those.
Look in a reloading manual ( or several) and read the intro to each round. The current thinking (conventional wisdom) is that the 308 can be loaded to any performance level that the 30.06 can, plus some that it cannot. the phrase "More versitile than the 30.06" is used frequently. I haven't shot a 30.06 in years, but have and had many 308's. Loading them is a nice experience. also, it fits in a short action, rather than a long action. is that supposed to be an advantage? I don't know.
Hope this answered more questions than it raised.
Thing is, you will be happy with either one, both are superb rounds, both are proven in combat and the hunting field, and no one will ever give you that "Not enough gun" crap with either round.
Hope this answered more questions than it raised.
Thing is, you will be happy with either one, both are superb rounds, both are proven in combat and the hunting field, and no one will ever give you that "Not enough gun" crap with either round.
The main advantage with 30'06 is that you can buy commercial ammo up to 220 grains vs 180 grains for .308. For the most part you'll have more variety in 30'06 loadings for hunting.
For whitetail, 180 grains is more than enough. If you plan to hunt anything bigger, I'd give a nod to the 30'06.
Even without that, unless you plan on getting a semi-auto .30 battle rifle (M1A, FAL, AR-10, etc) which are all .308/7.62x51 I'd probably go for the 30'06.
For whitetail, 180 grains is more than enough. If you plan to hunt anything bigger, I'd give a nod to the 30'06.
Even without that, unless you plan on getting a semi-auto .30 battle rifle (M1A, FAL, AR-10, etc) which are all .308/7.62x51 I'd probably go for the 30'06.
esmith
Member
Go rem 700 bdl in 30-06. You are going to find 30-06 in every store that sells ammo. Its definitly one of the most well known cartridges that have ever existed. After being tested for the over 100 years of its existence it has been thrown into the group i like to call the 'tried and true' category.
Recoil is dependant on a lot of things. Barrel length, Bullet weight, Gun weight, etc. It should be controlled easily though.
Recoil is dependant on a lot of things. Barrel length, Bullet weight, Gun weight, etc. It should be controlled easily though.
jimmyraythomason
Member
For whitetails,150gr or 165gr bullets are ideal. 180gr bullets in .30 cal. don't perform well on thin skin game.
Titan6
member
Yes, especially with ball ammo. We have a supply/demand issue.
esmith
Member
What little milsurp 308 there is, is expensive. South African battle packs are going upwards of 150. Making it about 75 cents a shot. Lituanian battle packs are a little better at 50 cents a pop, but its still bad for the milsurp shooter. Sorry is this was off topic.
Floppy_D
Member In Memoriam
For the first time in 15+ months, I found wolf 308 at 5.99 a box at the local shop. I thought it was all but gone. I sold my PTR-91 due to ammo costs (prior to getting started reloading). 30-06 has been, for the last two years, cheaper, everywhere I've seen it. If you reload, that's less a concern. hankpac pointed out a clear fact: handloading the stuff allows you a lot of control out of both cartridges, and they're close rivals.
What does your supply line look like, and do you reload?
What does your supply line look like, and do you reload?
TheGunGuru
Member
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2007
- Messages
- 79
I have a Tikka T3 Varmint in .308 and a rem 700 in .30-06. It may be like comparing apples and oranges but I find myself shooting the Tikka more, possibly because of the reduced recoil and because the military surplus is pretty cheap. (well was until about a year ago, but I have faith that after the Iraq war is done the surplus market will be ripe again).
As for white tail, both guns are fine. Both have plenty of power an accuracy within hunting distances. The real difference comes with a follow up shot, if needed. The .308 fits in a short action bolt while the -06 is a long action, therefore the time needed to cycle the bolt is longer with the -06. Keep in mind that it may only be an extra half second of cycle time, but it could matter when your hunting. The biggest advantage, and reason for the invention of the .308, is the reduced recoil which is quite noticeable from similar guns, ie same barrel length, similar bullet weights and similar gun weights.
Even with the moderate advantages of the .308, the 30-06 is probably the best bet. It has more than enough power to take white tale and bigger animals because hell, you never know, your buddies may want to hunt elk in Canada next year and you will have a rifle for the hunt already. Buy a good rifle in either caliber and you will be perfectly happy with it, I know i love both my -06 and .308.
As for white tail, both guns are fine. Both have plenty of power an accuracy within hunting distances. The real difference comes with a follow up shot, if needed. The .308 fits in a short action bolt while the -06 is a long action, therefore the time needed to cycle the bolt is longer with the -06. Keep in mind that it may only be an extra half second of cycle time, but it could matter when your hunting. The biggest advantage, and reason for the invention of the .308, is the reduced recoil which is quite noticeable from similar guns, ie same barrel length, similar bullet weights and similar gun weights.
Even with the moderate advantages of the .308, the 30-06 is probably the best bet. It has more than enough power to take white tale and bigger animals because hell, you never know, your buddies may want to hunt elk in Canada next year and you will have a rifle for the hunt already. Buy a good rifle in either caliber and you will be perfectly happy with it, I know i love both my -06 and .308.
Shawnee
member
In addition to other comments...
The .308 is a "short-action" cartridge while the '06 is a "long-action".
That means the .308, like all "short-action" cartidges gives you (in most rifle models) more leeway in mounting a scope because the rings are closer together and do not crowd the flare of the scope lenses - which means the .308 gives you more choices of scopes than the '06 - and that can save you dollars or help you get the scope you really, really like.
I've shot a passle of South Texas deer with various .243s and the Hornady 87gr. BTHP, and that combination is like lightning on deer. But if you really want a .308 or '06 I'm pretty certain even the 150 grainer won't bounce back and knock your hat off.
The .308 is a "short-action" cartridge while the '06 is a "long-action".
That means the .308, like all "short-action" cartidges gives you (in most rifle models) more leeway in mounting a scope because the rings are closer together and do not crowd the flare of the scope lenses - which means the .308 gives you more choices of scopes than the '06 - and that can save you dollars or help you get the scope you really, really like.
I've shot a passle of South Texas deer with various .243s and the Hornady 87gr. BTHP, and that combination is like lightning on deer. But if you really want a .308 or '06 I'm pretty certain even the 150 grainer won't bounce back and knock your hat off.
Lone_Gunman
Member
One thing to remember though is that Tikka uses a long action on all their rifles, including short cartridges like 308. This doesnt affect follow up shot time though, because the bolt only has to travel back far enough to pick up a fresh cartridge. I have a very nice Tikka T3 in 308 that is very accurate and a good rifle, but I still think its a little cheesy to put a short action cartridge in a long action rifle.
The Annoyed Man
Member
I'm going on my very first deer hunt in a little over a week from now. I'll be bringing a Remington 700 in .308, and the ammunition recommended to me by my local gun store for north Texas white tails is the Hornady 150 grain SST. I don't own an assortment of left handed .308s, so I'm bringing the only one I have - a VSF varmint rifle. I know it's heavy to lug around, but it is only for a couple of days, and I think I'll manage.
As I usually shoot the Federal 168 grain and 175 grain Sierra Match Kings, the recoil from the 150 grain loads in this heavy rifle should be pretty mild.
As I usually shoot the Federal 168 grain and 175 grain Sierra Match Kings, the recoil from the 150 grain loads in this heavy rifle should be pretty mild.
rockstar.esq
Member
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2004
- Messages
- 1,475
So my buddy Timbokhan would say I view the .308 win as the greatest cartridge of all time. While that's not far from the truth I think the debate on the 30-06 vs the .308 often gets biased information.
For example I would say that ballistically speaking the "heavier" weights thing is off base. The heaviest projectiles listed for the 30-06 are 220 grains, whereas the 308's heavyweight is 180 grains. Comparing these two loads side by side is pretty telling because the .308 has higher velocity AND higher energy than the 30-06 well past 500 yards.
Now I'm not saying it doesn't work so much as I'm saying that I've yet to hear of a 30-06 that grouped 220 grain projectiles well enough to brag about (same deal as the hypervelocity 60 grain load). I submit that the extra forty grains of bullet weight on the 30-06 simply taxes it too much to be worth doing. Add to that the simple reality that this bullet weight is far more realistic from a .300 win mag than a 30-06.
The recoil comment comes up frequently as well. Here again using the same projectile, the 30-06 is less than 100fps faster in some loads, far less on average. In the case of the 150 grain projectile, no difference to speak of. So since we're moving the same projectile weight at the same speed, the recoil is essentially the same.
Finally, I think it's important to point out that the debut of the .308 winchester at the Camp Perry 1000yd national competition raised the bar so much that the center ring of the target was reduced by HALF to make it possible to judge more effectively. There haven't been other developments since that required re-sizing the targets.
Although I do revere the .308 Winchester I would never disparage the cartridge it sought to replace. The 30-06 is one of our countries longest serving cartridges and I have absolutely no reservations about recommending it. I think it's very interesting that commercially made match ammo is made in .308 , 30-06, and .300 win mag. When you consider that there are literally hundreds of 30 caliber cartridges, dozens of which are loaded by these manufacturers, two of the three cartridges are closer ballistically than any other pair. While the .308 won't likely replace the 30-06, a shooter may rest assured that the very finest performance can be had with either one.
For example I would say that ballistically speaking the "heavier" weights thing is off base. The heaviest projectiles listed for the 30-06 are 220 grains, whereas the 308's heavyweight is 180 grains. Comparing these two loads side by side is pretty telling because the .308 has higher velocity AND higher energy than the 30-06 well past 500 yards.
Now I'm not saying it doesn't work so much as I'm saying that I've yet to hear of a 30-06 that grouped 220 grain projectiles well enough to brag about (same deal as the hypervelocity 60 grain load). I submit that the extra forty grains of bullet weight on the 30-06 simply taxes it too much to be worth doing. Add to that the simple reality that this bullet weight is far more realistic from a .300 win mag than a 30-06.
The recoil comment comes up frequently as well. Here again using the same projectile, the 30-06 is less than 100fps faster in some loads, far less on average. In the case of the 150 grain projectile, no difference to speak of. So since we're moving the same projectile weight at the same speed, the recoil is essentially the same.
Finally, I think it's important to point out that the debut of the .308 winchester at the Camp Perry 1000yd national competition raised the bar so much that the center ring of the target was reduced by HALF to make it possible to judge more effectively. There haven't been other developments since that required re-sizing the targets.
Although I do revere the .308 Winchester I would never disparage the cartridge it sought to replace. The 30-06 is one of our countries longest serving cartridges and I have absolutely no reservations about recommending it. I think it's very interesting that commercially made match ammo is made in .308 , 30-06, and .300 win mag. When you consider that there are literally hundreds of 30 caliber cartridges, dozens of which are loaded by these manufacturers, two of the three cartridges are closer ballistically than any other pair. While the .308 won't likely replace the 30-06, a shooter may rest assured that the very finest performance can be had with either one.
RevolvingCylinder
Member
- Joined
- Nov 6, 2006
- Messages
- 782
You've got that backwards. .30-06 Springfield can launch any same bullet faster than the .308 Winchester can do. The .30-06 Springfield has a larger case capacity and the .308 and .30-06 are no more equals than the .30-06 and .300 Win Mag are. Since the .30-06 is capable of the same loads as the .308 or superior, it is in fact the more versatile cartridge. The 7.62x51mm NATO was developed to duplicate the retro, low-pressure .30-06 Springfield loads(M1 Ball).
JohnMcD348
Member
I have been going through the same exercise in deciding on what I want in my 700 when I get one. Ultimately, I decided on the 30-06. .308 is a great cartridge but the -06 has more versatility. Larger cartridge, larger range of bullet/power variables.
I was always told that essentially, the .308 was a design by the number crunchers who realized that the .30-06 military round was a waste of space and that if you shortened the cartridge so that it better matched the powder charge you could carry more ammo and it would save on brass equaling more cases, etc, etc.
I went with the .30-06 since I'll be carrying alot fewer rounds hunting than I would for a battle rifle. I've never noticed a huge difference in felt recoil between the two rounds but it is there. If I were looking for a target shooter, I'd probably go with the .308 for that reason only. Then again, it's not anything more than could be handled by the improvement of the stocks recoil pad and handling technique.
I'm by far no expert in the field, these are just my observations.
I was always told that essentially, the .308 was a design by the number crunchers who realized that the .30-06 military round was a waste of space and that if you shortened the cartridge so that it better matched the powder charge you could carry more ammo and it would save on brass equaling more cases, etc, etc.
I went with the .30-06 since I'll be carrying alot fewer rounds hunting than I would for a battle rifle. I've never noticed a huge difference in felt recoil between the two rounds but it is there. If I were looking for a target shooter, I'd probably go with the .308 for that reason only. Then again, it's not anything more than could be handled by the improvement of the stocks recoil pad and handling technique.
I'm by far no expert in the field, these are just my observations.
Well the target reduction occurred in the time period the M14's started coming on the firing line. But it was not due to the 308 being that much better than a 30-06.
The change really came about when the first place winner won by one point over the second place guy. But the second place guy had 74% more V's. Or something like that. It became clear that the 5V target was incapable of discriminating between who should be winner, and who should not be the winner.
I have shot on the 5V target. It was very hard to use at 300 and 600 yards, too small to see. Also, the match winner was typically decided by V count, which was a matter of luck who hit more V's at 200 or 300 yards.
I have shot the 30-06 in competition, shot out a barrel or two. In human hands it is hard to prove that one is more accurate than the other, though in lot testing the 308 came out better. The 30-06 simply kicks more and had a longer bolt throw, and the free brass disappeared. I do not know when the last time the 30-06 won the Wimbleton 1000 yard match, but it was still competitive until good bullets in the subcalibers came along.
1911shooter
Member
if you are only looking to whitetail, the 308win is better then the '06, i would never shoot an '06, there are so many calibers that will do what it does and better. even if you decide you want to hunt bear and elk at some point the 308win will serve you well.
rc109a
Member
I thinkg both are great rounds. I use my 308 more then 30-06. In my rifles the 30-06 kicks a lot more (that is with my rifles and configurations), but others might tell you different. As far as the Tikka goes, that is a really smooth action. I have shot one and really enjoyed it. I like the magazine even though there are others who will say it is cheap. It feels different then most and I was skeptical at first about it. That was until I shot a Tikka. I like them, but that is my opinion. I have not shot the CZ, but I also hear good things. You will need to pick one up and feel what is best for you. Good luck!
Six in one, half dozen in the other.
There is really no meaningful difference between the two. Pick the one you like best.
The only real advantage I've seen in the '06's favor is that most places will have more of it and more variety of it in stock than the .308.
If you don't shoot milsurp ammo outof your hunting rifles, there is little price difference between the two. And milsurp is running out fast for both calibers and IMO, should not be a consideration.
As for the rifles, of the two you listed, I like the CZ better.
In reality, there's about as much difference between those two rifles as there is between the cartridges.
There is really no meaningful difference between the two. Pick the one you like best.
The only real advantage I've seen in the '06's favor is that most places will have more of it and more variety of it in stock than the .308.
If you don't shoot milsurp ammo outof your hunting rifles, there is little price difference between the two. And milsurp is running out fast for both calibers and IMO, should not be a consideration.
As for the rifles, of the two you listed, I like the CZ better.
In reality, there's about as much difference between those two rifles as there is between the cartridges.
Jeff F
Member
The .308 and the 30-06 are pretty equal until you get out to some extreme ranges and the 06 will out perform the .308. Also with bullets of 180 grain and up the 30-06 will push them harder.
- Status
