357 load has lots of flash

[Bozrdang]

I recently purchased my first revolver. A S&W 686 Pro Series .357 mag and i worked up a couple starting loads for it and I also purchased some cheap factory ammo from Walmart. I've never shot a revolver of any kind before so I'm not sure what this means, if anything. From my perspective, the factory ammo has a slight but noticable in daylight muzzle flash. The reloads had huge flame like flash. According to my wife who was watching me shoot, th factory ammo had the muzzle flash and no noticable flash coming around the cylinder whereas she said my reloads had huge flash coming out around the cylinder and no noticable muzzle flash. Both my loads had quite a bit less recoil than the factory. Does that difference in flash mean anything? I realize different powder can have different flash but I was surprised there was so much difference and that the location was different.

My loads were mixed brass, 2400 powder (15.7 gr & 16.5 gr), S&B small pistol primers, Hornady XTP 125 gr and a COL of 1.582

The factory ammo is Remington UMC JSP 125 gr.

 

[Reloadron]

Remington UMC is a light load 357 Magnum, by comparison as to factory loads a name like CorBon would likely exceed even your hand loads. The muzzle flash is normal and after dark a show.

Where did you get your load data? The reason I ask is my Hornady 9th Edition for 125 grain XTP bullets shows Alliant 2400 Start 13.9 grains and Maximum Load is 16.9 grains. Those numbers closely parallel my Speer 12th Edition. I only looked at those two manuals but those numbers are a long way from your 5.7 and 6.5 grain loads?

Anyway, the flash is not unusual, even in a long barreled revolver. Flash at the forcing cone and the muzzle.

Ron

 

[Slamfire]

Are you using 38 Special cases with that 2400 load?

I used to load a 125 Jacketed bullet with 17.5 grains 2400. That made one heck of a fireball, which was partially the reason I was shooting them. It was fun. That load produced a totally obnoxious and loud blast with a huge fireball. I annoyed everyone around me, but that is what young punks want to do.

I am a bit older now and don't enjoy recoil and noise as much as I used to. Now I find it annoying.

2400 is a magnum powder, it still produces a fireball at magnum levels, I expect it burns less cleanly at low levels. If you want to shoot light loads, use a faster powder. Something like Unique. Great all around pistol powder.

 

[USSR]

As Slamfire1 noted, 2400 is not really a good powder for the light weight bullets you are using, and you are using WAY too little of it. Go with a faster burn rate powder such as Unique or similar.

Don

 

[Bozrdang]

Sorry guys. My first post should have read 15.7 and 16.5 gr of 2400 (I will edit that). I am using 357 mag cases. Like I said, the factory ammo has quite a bit more recoil than my reloads so I assume from that my reloads are weaker which is why I was surprised by how much flame it was throwing compared to the factory. Being new to reloading this cartridge figured I'd ask if that meant anything.

 

[Bozrdang]

I am not looking for light loads. I was just following Alliant's advice to start out 10% lighter than their listed load of 17.5.

 

[Reloadron]

OK, now we all understand it was just a typo. So, yes, the big flash is normal, especially with the powder you are using. Like I mentioned, nice show, especially when it gets dark.

Ron

 

[Bozrdang]

It was indeed a cool show. I was also surprised how much less recoil versus the factory. Especially since I am only .9 gr away from Alliant's listed data. I am hoping I can get similar recoil from my reloads.

 

[Rollis R. Karvellis]

The first one is a 686 with a bucket full of 2400.

The second is my 92FS. I used a Bernie Sanders voter that the DNC ''volunteered'' to snap the photo.

 

[joneb]

I've had results with Accurate #7 and 158gr jacketed in a 2.75" 357 mag. way less flash than 2400.

 

[gamestalker]

You haven't seen muzzle flash, until you've shot a .357 snub loaded with H110 / 296. I get about a 3' white flame coming out of the muzzle.

I have a 4" Taurus 608, that one has a "V" type compensated barrel, It sends produces the long flames up like a funny car does when launching off the starting line, and also has the straight out 3' muzzle flash, super cool looking when shot at night.

And yes, this is pretty standard when using powders that produce lots of flash.

GS

 

[Swampman]

What gamestalker said.

H-110 was actually developed for .30 Carbine loads out of an 18 inch barrel.

It gives great velocities in magnum revolver loads, but it ain't exactly what you'd call subtle.

 

[gamestalker]

Ya, it definitely isn't subtle, more like a hand full from a little snub.

GS

 

[PO2Hammer]

If you want rocket velocities, you need rocket fuel.

Likely the wal mart load had a faster powder. It seems like the faster powders have more recoil than the slower powders even though the velocities and powder charges are slightly lower with the faster powders.

 

[Bozrdang]

I went out last night and shot some test loads with 17.5 gr of 2400 and they definitely had a little more kick but the factory rounds still seemed like it had even more. Maybe it's just a matter of the type of recoil that makes it feel different to me.

I also tried a few loads with 8.5 gr of BE-86 (Alliant's listed load was a max of 9.1) and they were softer than anything I've shot in that gun.

 

[pintler]

I'm far from an expert, but I once loaded a bunch of 45ACP to the same book velocity using several different powders, then fired them at night. The difference in flash was quite large. If you want reduced flash, which is smart for defensive loads, experiment with different powders.

Some commercial loads use anti flash additives. I don't think such powders are available for retail sales.

 

[Bozrdang]

The BE-86 I tried on a few loads has flash suppressant (or so it says). That's not why I use it though.

This is the first I've ever used 2400 before and the first I've shot a magnum before. If I hadn't shot the factory ammo first, I probably wouldn't have thought much about the flash from the 2400. It's just that the factory rounds has so little I was surprised at the difference.

 

[Walkalong]

A lot of powders available to the reloader have flash suppressants. A lot don't.

If you want flash, Power Pistol =

 

[Blue68f100]

Don't judge velocity by recoil, that will get you in trouble. Powders that are considered slow can have a more push effect and still have high velocity. Faster powders normally give you a kick effect.

If you want fire ball the H110/W296 will most definitely do that. It will be one of the powders that give you the most velocity too. But only likes the top end loads. Not good for reduced.

 

[Berger.Fan222]

Many factory loads include powders with added flash suppressors (chemicals that reduce flash).

Most powders sold to reloaders do not.

 

[TimSr]

Its interesting how different powders give different intensities of flash. To me, Blue Dot seems to give the brightest flash, even more than 110/296, but it might just be the color which is almost white. Those dull orange color flashes like from Unique seem to be the least visual.

 

[AzShooter1]

Tim beat me to it. Try Blue Dot if you really want to impress someone with the flash. I use to use it for night shoots and my loads would light up the range.

If you don't want flash but want to make up some good shooting loads try UNIQUE.

 

[Walkalong]

Blue Dot is definitely another good one for big fireballs.


Quite a number of powders available to the reloader have flash repellents. All it takes is a bit of looking/reading.

Here's a new one.

New: BE-86™
Flash Suppressant Pistol Powder

Pistol reloaders get better powder flow, more versatility, reduced flash and more with new BE-86.

Here's one that has been around for awhile. Not old, not new.

AUTOCOMP is extremely fine in the 38 Super, 9mm, 45 ACP and 40 S&W race guns. It’s just the perfect burning speed to feed the compensators with a higher volume of gas. With AUTOCOMP competitors get off faster shots with minimal muzzle flash, it’s a winner.

An old one.

Accurate No. 2 is an extremely fast burning, double-base, spherical handgun powder suitable for use in a wide range of handgun calibers. Low recoil and low flash

 

[Slamfire]

Blue Dot is definitely another good one for big fireballs

.


Blue Dot leaded my barrels something awful in the 357. But it sure gave fireballs out the muzzle!

 

[thump_rrr]

Lil'Gun produces large fireballs also.
Lil'Gun is also hard on the gun if used excessively.