.357 mag ballistic test: Remington 180 gr SJHP fired from revolver and carbine

[chopinbloc]

.357 mag Remington 180 gr SJHP video link




.357 mag Remington 180 gr SJHP fired from S&W Model 13 4" revolver and from Rossi M92 16" carbine through four layers of denim into calibrated gelatin.

BB: 597.8 fps, 3.2"

Revolver data

Impact velocity: 1,193 fps
Pentration: 17.8"
Retained weight: 181.7 gr
Max expansion: 0.557"
Min expansion: 0.534"

Carbine data

Impact velocity: 1,563 fps
Penetration: 18.1"
Retained weight: 151.3 gr
Max expansion: 0.600"
Min Expansion: 0.587"

 

[mgkdrgn]

the expansion of those two rounds was just a thing of beauty!

 

[chopinbloc]

Note that the one fired from the carbine shed some weight and ended up slightly shorter and expanded slightly more. The penetration from each differed by a statistically insignificant margin.

I'm really pleasantly surprised by this one. I expected good performance but I didn't expect it to be as close. Looks like a great general purpose hunting/trail load for both the rifle and the handgun. Gonna get a few boxes for the wife to carry while hiking/camping. They're her guns, after all.

 

[Rush_Fan]

Thank you for posting this and your time to film this demonstration. I was very surprised how little difference 12 inches of barrel and over 350 fps in velocity from the carbine had. I have a Rossi 92 with a 20" barrel. I haven't used it on deer or hogs yet but may still do so.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

There is a website called something like velocity by the inch that has coolected all kinds of data like this aswell. Worth checking out.

 

[chopinbloc]

I was very surprised how little difference 12 inches of barrel and over 350 fps in velocity from the carbine had.

Keep in mind that this load is atypical. Most bullets will either perform very well from the revolver but blow apart and not penetrate deeply enough from the rifle or they will perform very well from the rifle and not expand at all from the revolver. I was very pleasantly surprised by this one.

 

[SeanSw]

Thanks for the test. I would not have counted on that load expanding from a 4" barrel at all, especially considering that normal factory .357 158gr loads spec at similar velocities. Surprising results. Probably a bit much for our snubbies though!

 

[chopinbloc]

I've heard it said that heavy bullets lose less velocity to short barrels but you're probably right.

 

[Panzerschwein]

Sounds like a good "twofer" load for revo and lever gun.

Thanks for the tests!

 

[chopinbloc]

That's exactly what I thought and we'll be buying a couple boxes of these for camping/hiking. The revolver and rifle mentioned in the descriptions belong to my lovely wife.

 

[dprice3844444]

shame we couldn't see at what point the expansion began and ended.

 

[chopinbloc]

I'd be happy to capture that event for you if you send me a Phantom high speed camera. ;^)

 

[Deltaboy1984]

I still love the 357 it is a great round. I regret I sold my Colt.

 

[JonathanE]

Fantastic. Thank you.

 

[SeanSw]

The Remington factory spec for this load is 1145fps muzzle velocity with an 8 3/8" barrel. I am even more surprised with the results now. This could be a real sleeper load and would love to get my hands on some.

 

[Legionnaire]

Very nice production; thank you! I, too, am surprised that there is not more difference between the revolver and the carbine. Having a similar pair (Ruger and Marlin), this is good to know.

 

[george burns]

A picture is worth a thousand words.

 

[CPLofMARINES]

Very interesting, thank you for the data. So, stay away
from hollow points in a carbine from what I can gather.
That is if going after 4 legged creatures.

 

[chopinbloc]

I wouldn't say that at all. I think the performance was excellent.

 

[ljnowell]

There is a website called something like velocity by the inch that has coolected all kinds of data like this aswell. Worth checking out.

Unfortunately Ballistics by the Inch has very skewed data. The testing method they employ gives much lower results with revolvers than experienced in the real world.

Many people that want to cherry pick load data that makes 38 & 357 revolvers look wimpy, or even 44 mag revolvers use that data. It's usually in 9mm vs. 357 or 10mm vs. 44 mag threads.

 

[chopinbloc]

Could you give specific data that varies from what they give? I don't have a lot of .357 mag data on hand but they list "Federal 125 gr JHP" as 1,511 fps from a 4" revolver and in my own test Remington 125 gr Golden Saber got 1,333 fps. Underwood 125 gr got 1,503 fps. I would have expected the Remington load to be closer to the Federal load. Underwood is known for producing very hot ammo.

 

[ljnowell]

Could you give specific data that varies from what they give? I don't have a lot of .357 mag data on hand but they list "Federal 125 gr JHP" as 1,511 fps from a 4" revolver and in my own test Remington 125 gr Golden Saber got 1,333 fps. Underwood 125 gr got 1,503 fps. I would have expected the Remington load to be closer to the Federal load. Underwood is known for producing very hot ammo.

Look up the 9mm vs 357 mag thread from recently. You will find all sorts if examples.

The testing method they use shorts revolvers, in the case of 357 mags by about 1 1/2" of barrel length. Revolver barrels are measured from the forcing cone forward to muzzle. They measure from the breech face like you would a semi auto.

1 1/2" can make a big difference in a 357 mag full house load with a slow burning powder.

 

[chopinbloc]

They use cut Contender barrels to get their velocity figures so it makes sense for them to measure from the breech face. If anything, the figures they give should be significantly higher than you'll get from real revolvers chambered in that cartridge because there is no cylinder gap in their test barrels.

Have you collected chronograph data that is not consistent with the data posted to the Ballistics by the Inch site? Can you link to data collected by someone else that indicates their results are inaccurate? I have not personally tested any of the loads they list.